Snap General Election called

[Zhivago]

[
who thinks far too much of himself.

This coming from a man who will tell people who disagree with him that they believe propaganda and aren't well enough read. A bit of self awareness would do you a world of good.

You just aren't patriotic enough. If you loved your country more, you'd try to save it by spending your spare time fruitlessly trying to convince the misguided not to self harm too.

[Zhivago]

You might well have identified the issue there. What is considered centrist and liberal on this board seems to leave an awful lot of ground to the left.

I've no issues with say Yvette Cooper, once you start going further left such as with Andy Burnham I'm less a fan, once we start veering all the way out towards Corbyn I'm inclined to ridicule what is by then the loony left.

I'd agree with this. Though, as a Conservative, albeit a liberal one, I'm practically a fascist.

Well given the recent propensity for your party to round up and deport our own citizens, the fascist comparison is not as far off the mark as it used to be.

[Mellsblue]

I've no issues with say Yvette Cooper, once you start going further left such as with Andy Burnham I'm less a fan, once we start veering all the way out towards Corbyn I'm inclined to ridicule what is by then the loony left.

I'd agree with this. Though, as a Conservative, albeit a liberal one, I'm practically a fascist.

Well given the recent propensity for your party to round up and deport our own citizens, the fascist comparison is not as far off the mark as it used to be.

You’re not believing that propaganda are you? You need to read more.

[Digby]

I've no issues with say Yvette Cooper, once you start going further left such as with Andy Burnham I'm less a fan, once we start veering all the way out towards Corbyn I'm inclined to ridicule what is by then the loony left.

I'd agree with this. Though, as a Conservative, albeit a liberal one, I'm practically a fascist.

Well given the recent propensity for your party to round up and deport our own citizens, the fascist comparison is not as far off the mark as it used to be.

It's not like the Labour party spotted this issue coming either, both leaderships despite the matter being spoken about at various points by a number of backbench MPs have badly let down large numbers. Yes the Tories are the government and thus more responsible, but a decent opposition might at other times have helped avoid this crisis arising.

I don't believe for one moment what's happened was the intention of May or Rudd, nor the wider Tory party. So maybe they are facists depending on how one grades such things, but not over this issue, in this instance they've simply shown themselves incompetent over and over, and so sadly have the official opposition

[Zhivago]

You might well have identified the issue there. What is considered centrist and liberal on this board seems to leave an awful lot of ground to the left.

I've no issues with say Yvette Cooper, once you start going further left such as with Andy Burnham I'm less a fan, once we start veering all the way out towards Corbyn I'm inclined to ridicule what is by then the loony left.

After finishing his post Digby refreshed the page to look for comments, so that he could once again remind his comrades in blue that he was one of them... an achiever who made it all by himself, and damn those feckless poor who wanted to take it all away from them... "the loony left shall never prevail" he muttered under his breath as he glanced at his framed picture of Thatcher from when she saved Albion all those years ago.

If only his good old friend Rupert was still here to see him now, he'd say "Nice one Diggers, you tell them straight how things must be. Make sure the hoi polloi are kept busy so we don't get any commies stealing our dividends."

And with that tearful thought he poured himself another glass of his VSOP, just like Churchill would have done, to bring himself fresh spirit for his online battle over the coming days, weeks, and months ahead battling it out in the Internet forums.

[Zhivago]

I'd agree with this. Though, as a Conservative, albeit a liberal one, I'm practically a fascist.

Well given the recent propensity for your party to round up and deport our own citizens, the fascist comparison is not as far off the mark as it used to be.

It's not like the Labour party spotted this issue coming either, both leaderships despite the matter being spoken about at various points by a number of backbench MPs have badly let down large numbers. Yes the Tories are the government and thus more responsible, but a decent opposition might at other times have helped avoid this crisis arising.

I don't believe for one moment what's happened was the intention of May or Rudd, nor the wider Tory party. So maybe they are facists depending on how one grades such things, but not over this issue, in this instance they've simply shown themselves incompetent over and over, and so sadly have the official opposition

'The ends do justify the means, Diggers. Don't let those commie bastards tell you otherwise." Said Rupert to his pal Diggers.

[Digby]

I do have a friend called Rupert, so at least part of that is true.

[Digby]

Well given the recent propensity for your party to round up and deport our own citizens, the fascist comparison is not as far off the mark as it used to be.

It's not like the Labour party spotted this issue coming either, both leaderships despite the matter being spoken about at various points by a number of backbench MPs have badly let down large numbers. Yes the Tories are the government and thus more responsible, but a decent opposition might at other times have helped avoid this crisis arising.

I don't believe for one moment what's happened was the intention of May or Rudd, nor the wider Tory party. So maybe they are facists depending on how one grades such things, but not over this issue, in this instance they've simply shown themselves incompetent over and over, and so sadly have the official opposition

'The ends do justify the means, Diggers. Don't let those commie bastards tell you otherwise." Said Rupert to his pal Diggers.

What ends are justified by what means in this instance?

The Windrush situation is a national disgrace, I'm only saying in looking at what's happened that both the government and the official opposition missed this was a serious problem in the offing, and had either (and ideally both) been more up to the job we could have avoided much of this.

I've long thought there's far too little serious review of government policy, and while I do blame them more given it's their policy and they're obviously best placed to bring about change it doesn't mean I don't want the opposition party to be seriously reviewing what happens on the back of policy changes.

[Zhivago]

It's not like the Labour party spotted this issue coming either, both leaderships despite the matter being spoken about at various points by a number of backbench MPs have badly let down large numbers. Yes the Tories are the government and thus more responsible, but a decent opposition might at other times have helped avoid this crisis arising.

I don't believe for one moment what's happened was the intention of May or Rudd, nor the wider Tory party. So maybe they are facists depending on how one grades such things, but not over this issue, in this instance they've simply shown themselves incompetent over and over, and so sadly have the official opposition

'The ends do justify the means, Diggers. Don't let those commie bastards tell you otherwise." Said Rupert to his pal Diggers.

What ends are justified by what means in this instance?

The Windrush situation is a national disgrace, I'm only saying in looking at what's happened that both the government and the official opposition missed this was a serious problem in the offing, and had either (and ideally both) been more up to the job we could have avoided much of this.

I've long thought there's far too little serious review of government policy, and while I do blame them more given it's their policy and they're obviously best placed to bring about change it doesn't mean I don't want the opposition party to be seriously reviewing what happens on the back of policy changes.

In case you've missed it, judging from the Tory response, claiming that Labour are conflating legal and illegal immigration, the implication seems to be that the reduction of immigration outweigh the collateral damage of this scandal. Hence no resignations and therefore no real acceptance of responsibility or accountability.

Ps. I guess you missed it, but Labour voted against the immigration bills that caused this, on grounds that too much power was being handed over to the executive to deport people.

[Zhivago]

I'd agree with this. Though, as a Conservative, albeit a liberal one, I'm practically a fascist.

Well given the recent propensity for your party to round up and deport our own citizens, the fascist comparison is not as far off the mark as it used to be.

You’re not believing that propaganda are you? You need to read more.

If I could read more I would. But news from multiple papers in three languages is already hard to keep up with.

[Mellsblue]

Well given the recent propensity for your party to round up and deport our own citizens, the fascist comparison is not as far off the mark as it used to be.

You’re not believing that propaganda are you? You need to read more.

If I could read more I would. But news from multiple papers in three languages is already hard to keep up with.

Yet still you find the time to post on here.

[Digby]

I'm not interested in Tory attempts to shift criticism around Windrush onto a wider discussion around immigration wherein they feel they can go back onto the offensive against Labour. I'm not interested either in Labour suddenly trying to hammer the government over Windrush when they too missed just what a problem this was going to be.

Again I blame the government more, but I'd hope being the official opposition is about more than just voting against every government bill and playing gotcha. Sadly my hopes are rather let down in this area (as they were when the Tories were in opposition to Labour)

[Zhivago]

You’re not believing that propaganda are you? You need to read more.

If I could read more I would. But news from multiple papers in three languages is already hard to keep up with.

Yet still you find the time to post on here.

There is a threshold whereby additional time spent returns diminishing returns.

By using multiple languages, I can for example read/hear reports from German news ZDF where Uli Geck reported from Syria that witnesses were saying it was most likely staged.

It helps provide more context that illuminates the falsehoods in any one nation's media.

Sure I could learn more languages and read more news but that takes time, and it's a hefty investment.

[Mellsblue]

If I could read more I would. But news from multiple papers in three languages is already hard to keep up with.

Yet still you find the time to post on here.

There is a threshold whereby additional time spent returns diminishing returns.

By using multiple languages, I can for example read/hear reports from German news ZDF where Uli Geck reported from Syria that witnesses were saying it was most likely staged.

It helps provide more context that illuminates the falsehoods in any one nation's media.

Sure I could learn more languages and read more news but that takes time, and it's a hefty investment.

Now. This sounds like a man who thinks far too much of himself.

[Zhivago]

Yet still you find the time to post on here.

There is a threshold whereby additional time spent returns diminishing returns.

By using multiple languages, I can for example read/hear reports from German news ZDF where Uli Geck reported from Syria that witnesses were saying it was most likely staged.

It helps provide more context that illuminates the falsehoods in any one nation's media.

Sure I could learn more languages and read more news but that takes time, and it's a hefty investment.

Now. This sounds like a man who thinks far too much of himself.

Better that than be too modest with much to be modest about.

[Mellsblue]

There is a threshold whereby additional time spent returns diminishing returns.

By using multiple languages, I can for example read/hear reports from German news ZDF where Uli Geck reported from Syria that witnesses were saying it was most likely staged.

It helps provide more context that illuminates the falsehoods in any one nation's media.

Sure I could learn more languages and read more news but that takes time, and it's a hefty investment.

Now. This sounds like a man who thinks far too much of himself.

Better that than be too modest with much to be modest about.

At least you accept your hypocrisy.

[Zhivago]

Looks like Labour won the majority of seats 52.4% atm, strange how it's being spun in the media...

[Stones of granite]

Looks like Labour won the majority of seats 52.4% atm, strange how it's being spun in the media...

Not really that strange when you consider how losing the General Election was spun as a Labour victory.

[Stones of granite]

Hold on, only 99 out of 150 Councils have declared results. Isn't it a bit early for the victory parade?

[Mellsblue]

It’s all relative. In opposition you should be winning local elections. When the Govt is as unpopular as it’s said to be, the oppo should be taking them to the cleaners.

[Stones of granite]

So, it's kind of difficult to see what Zhivago is getting excited about. Here's the scores on the doors at 10:19

2018-05-04 11_18_29-England local elections 2018 - BBC News.jpg

Labour have lost control of a council but have increased their seats by 2.5%
Tories have neither lost or gained councils but have lost 0.1% seats
LibDems have gained a council and have increased their seats by 12.25%

So the real story is, LibDems have gained some momentum, UKIP have crashed and burned, and both Labour and Tories have held their ground. So far.

[Zhivago]

Hold on, only 99 out of 150 Councils have declared results. Isn't it a bit early for the victory parade?

Agreed, too early. Just countering the early media spin a bit by saying that the spin in the media seems to be that it's disappointing for Labour because they didn't wipe out the tories.... And take Westminster etc... My point is although no exciting event, Labour are making steady progress.

[Mellsblue]

Hold on, only 99 out of 150 Councils have declared results. Isn't it a bit early for the victory parade?

Agreed, too early. Just countering the early media spin a bit by saying that the spin in the media seems to be that it's disappointing for Labour because they didn't wipe out the tories.... And take Westminster etc... My point is although no exciting event, Labour are making steady progress.

The story, based on results so far, is that Labour have underperformed given the current political climate.

[Stones of granite]

Hold on, only 99 out of 150 Councils have declared results. Isn't it a bit early for the victory parade?

Agreed, too early. Just countering the early media spin a bit by saying that the spin in the media seems to be that it's disappointing for Labour because they didn't wipe out the tories.... And take Westminster etc... My point is although no exciting event, Labour are making steady progress.

What's your evidence for "steady progress"?
In my view, losing control of 1 council and increasing the total number of council seats by 2.5% is pretty close to "no progress".

In the light of the mess the Tories are making of the Brexit negotiations, losing a Home Secretary and the stagnant economy, you would have to say the lack of any significant impact by the Opposition is rather worrying.

[Which Tyler]

Current score:

Locals.jpg

Seems to me that we're now seeing the end of UKIP now that the conservatives have thrown themselves fully behind Brexit; with Lib Dem and Labour picking up most of that.