RugbyRebels

What our journalists once breathlessly described as shock and awe is falling on Ukraine now. Not quite the same when our enemies do it.

We now need to apply ALL possible sanctions, cut Russia and in particular the Russian leaders off from the world financially and economically.

I'd also add that we need to be pretty careful to make sure that what we do works, or Taiwan is next, followed by Georgia and what next? Lithuania to link up with Kaliningrad?

Also we should hit Belarus with the same sanctions as it's allowing Russia to invade via its territory.

This is terrible

hopefully the Fu*ker over reaches and it becomes the end of him

paddy no 11 wrote:This is terrible

hopefully the Fu*ker over reaches and it becomes the end of him

he's also threatened nukes if any military intervention from NATO; its a huge dead cat he's bouncing and its a disaster.

Banquo wrote:

paddy no 11 wrote:This is terrible
hopefully the Fu*ker over reaches and it becomes the end of him

he's also threatened nukes if any military intervention from NATO; its a huge dead cat he's bouncing and its a disaster.

That's the most likely implication of his threat, but you could also interpret it as full-scale cyber or biological warfare.

However, it's a bluff*. He's not a madman.


* don't tell Putin I said this though

Son of Mathonwy wrote:

Banquo wrote:

paddy no 11 wrote:This is terrible
hopefully the Fu*ker over reaches and it becomes the end of him

he's also threatened nukes if any military intervention from NATO; its a huge dead cat he's bouncing and its a disaster.

He's not a madman.

....discuss!...

Is he mad or is he just getting carried away with his own success? I think something odd happens to people after a sustained length of time in power and Putin has a good track history on having his own way. He knows that NATO won’t intervene militarily this time. I think this is very carefully calculated.

Fine line between ruthless leaders/managers and pyscopathy for sure.Also something about leaders with big egos needing a glorious war on their CV.
Can't see the Ukranians not taking up the fight, in which case the young, poor, old, disabled as per usual will cop for it when MV ups the ante.Sorry show.

Sandydragon wrote:Is he mad or is he just getting carried away with his own success? I think something odd happens to people after a sustained length of time in power and Putin has a good track history on having his own way. He knows that NATO won’t intervene militarily this time. I think this is very carefully calculated.

I'd think deliberately killing a lot of people as a bit of showboating and distraction might be classified as a tad mad. Threatening nukes isn't entirely sane either.

kk67 wrote:

Zhivago wrote:

kk67 wrote:
Fairy muff.

I couldn't help but notice that, once again, Liz Truss was making explicit threats against the Nord-Stream 2 pipe line.
I hate to be banging the same drum repeatedly but Opec and the US seem determined that whatever happens, Gazprom are not going to be allowed to flood Europe with cheap LNG which will break their cartel.
Like all cartels, they will say and do anything to protect their monopoly.

Are you suggesting America is provoking this crisis to get the Nord-Stream 2 pipeline shut down?

Yeah. Absolutely.
That's why the CIA funded ISIS.
The first thing ISIS did when they were the Western allies was to attack the pipeline.
They subsequently turned out to be psychopathic imbeciles but by then they'd done their job.

“The first thing ISIS did when they were the Western allies was to attack the pipeline.”
Last time I looked, Nordstream 2 was running under the Baltic, nowhere near Syria or Iraq.
Mind you, neither is Nordstream 1 nor the line through Ukraine anywhere near former Isis operating territory

Banquo wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:Is he mad or is he just getting carried away with his own success? I think something odd happens to people after a sustained length of time in power and Putin has a good track history on having his own way. He knows that NATO won’t intervene militarily this time. I think this is very carefully calculated.

I'd think deliberately killing a lot of people as a bit of showboating and distraction might be classified as a tad mad. Threatening nukes isn't entirely sane either.

The whole staged and choreographed "advice" meeting with the clearly scared shitless senior politicians worried me. Sitting there and vocally encouraging people to disagree with him if they think his decision to invade is wrong. Either he was being genuine and has lost grip on reality in thinking that anyone would dare disagree with him, or he was a grown man entertaining himself by using other grown men as puppets in a little stage show he made. Neither answer speaks well to his sanity.

Puja

Please gods let this be true:


Unfortunately, I'm not going to get my hopes up until independently verified by multiple sources

Banquo wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:Is he mad or is he just getting carried away with his own success? I think something odd happens to people after a sustained length of time in power and Putin has a good track history on having his own way. He knows that NATO won’t intervene militarily this time. I think this is very carefully calculated.

I'd think deliberately killing a lot of people as a bit of showboating and distraction might be classified as a tad mad. Threatening nukes isn't entirely sane either.

We threatened nuclear obliteration or decades, still do to be fair. We just tend to be a bit more low key about it.

I’m still going for calculating. Put another way, if he is totally mad then heaven help us all.

Sandydragon wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:Is he mad or is he just getting carried away with his own success? I think something odd happens to people after a sustained length of time in power and Putin has a good track history on having his own way. He knows that NATO won’t intervene militarily this time. I think this is very carefully calculated.

I'd think deliberately killing a lot of people as a bit of showboating and distraction might be classified as a tad mad. Threatening nukes isn't entirely sane either.

We threatened nuclear obliteration or decades, still do to be fair. We just tend to be a bit more low key about it.
I’m still going for calculating. Put another way, if he is totally mad then heaven help us all.

I don't think a madman would be able to engineer his position of de facto dictator and hold it for so long. Not saying the invasion is sensible in any way of course but starting Armageddon would be something else.

We could get there by increments though.

Which Tyler wrote:Please gods let this be true:


Unfortunately, I'm not going to get my hopes up until independently verified by multiple sources

It would be nice to find that the Russian army is not up for this, or more rubbish than we feared.

Something to hope for SoM. I think enough will follow orders but maybe not for too long if guerrilla warfare fills body bags in large numbers.

Son of Mathonwy wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:

Banquo wrote: I'd think deliberately killing a lot of people as a bit of showboating and distraction might be classified as a tad mad. Threatening nukes isn't entirely sane either.

We threatened nuclear obliteration or decades, still do to be fair. We just tend to be a bit more low key about it.
I’m still going for calculating. Put another way, if he is totally mad then heaven help us all.

I don't think a madman would be able to engineer his position of de facto dictator and hold it for so long. Not saying the invasion is sensible in any way of course but starting Armageddon would be something else.

We could get there by increments though.

A madman might not be able to get to his position, but someone who's gone mad could definitely hold onto it. I'm worried he's been in unquestionable power for so long that he's lost his grip.

Puja

So it looks like Chernobyl was an early prime target.
I can't think of any good reasons why that would be so.


Isn't the concrete sarcophagus on wheels as it had to be put together half a mile away, and rolled into place?

Which Tyler wrote:So it looks like Chernobyl was an early prime target.
I can't think of any good reasons why that would be so.


Isn't the concrete sarcophagus on wheels as it had to be put together half a mile away, and rolled into place?

quickest route to kyiv?

Son of Mathonwy wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:

Banquo wrote: I'd think deliberately killing a lot of people as a bit of showboating and distraction might be classified as a tad mad. Threatening nukes isn't entirely sane either.

We threatened nuclear obliteration or decades, still do to be fair. We just tend to be a bit more low key about it.
I’m still going for calculating. Put another way, if he is totally mad then heaven help us all.

I don't think a madman would be able to engineer his position of de facto dictator and hold it for so long. Not saying the invasion is sensible in any way of course but starting Armageddon would be something else.

We could get there by increments though.

lets say psychopath then? The invasion looks like madness to your average Joe, if not to the students of geopolitics- who seem to be aligned with the Donald

This is awful. So many clowns in charge of so much.

I'm a bit worried about social media here. The damage that can be inflicted by Facebook porkies is potentially massive. We've seen it influence elections and fuck with a pandemic response. Will the clowns in charge favour memes over diplomacy? That question is skating pretty fucking close to rhetorical right now.

Banquo wrote:

Son of Mathonwy wrote:

Sandydragon wrote: We threatened nuclear obliteration or decades, still do to be fair. We just tend to be a bit more low key about it.
I’m still going for calculating. Put another way, if he is totally mad then heaven help us all.

I don't think a madman would be able to engineer his position of de facto dictator and hold it for so long. Not saying the invasion is sensible in any way of course but starting Armageddon would be something else.

We could get there by increments though.

lets say psychopath then? The invasion looks like madness to your average Joe, if not to the students of geopolitics- who seem to be aligned with the Donald

Not sure this is smart in the long run, so definitely not agreeing with the Donald . But I think Putin has calculated that he can get away with this one without catastrophic loss.

Sandydragon wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Son of Mathonwy wrote: I don't think a madman would be able to engineer his position of de facto dictator and hold it for so long. Not saying the invasion is sensible in any way of course but starting Armageddon would be something else.

We could get there by increments though.

lets say psychopath then? The invasion looks like madness to your average Joe, if not to the students of geopolitics- who seem to be aligned with the Donald

Not sure this is smart in the long run, so definitely not agreeing with the Donald . But I think Putin has calculated that he can get away with this one without catastrophic loss.

but surely casually brushing off thousands of deaths- probably- and millions of badly impacted lives as part of a calculation is a tad....psychopathic----- not denying it is calculated, but its hardly sane either, and certainly devoid of any moral compass.

Banquo wrote:

Which Tyler wrote:So it looks like Chernobyl was an early prime target.
I can't think of any good reasons why that would be so.


Isn't the concrete sarcophagus on wheels as it had to be put together half a mile away, and rolled into place?

quickest route to kyiv?

I think that's the nail on the head - saves them a river crossing as well.

Plus, if they are concerned about getting bogged down or facing an insurgency during their occupation, they don't particularly want access to dirty nuke material being open to the Ukrainians.

Puja