Team for Scotland

[Banquo]

Who would you pick if Smith, Smith and Furbank are fit?

Smith, Smith and Furbank

At, 10, 15 and 23???

More Morecambe and Wise than that, but yes

[Oakboy]

Smith, Smith and Furbank

At, 10, 15 and 23???

More Morecambe and Wise than that, but yes

So what, necessarily, is the right order?

[Mikey Brown]

Lol. This can't become another team selection thread.

[Oakboy]

Lol. This can't become another team selection thread.

My, fault. Sorry. Shift if required, Puja.


[Mod] Have done so, just to keep the m-b-m thread to discussions about things that come up there.

[Banquo]

Lol. This can't become another team selection thread.

No lolling allowed

[Banquo]

At, 10, 15 and 23???

More Morecambe and Wise than that, but yes

So what, necessarily, is the right order?

Smith Furbank Smith. But Furbank also needs to show form

[p/d]

I don’t really understand what issue you’re taking with what he said either, to be honest. His overall summary seems pretty fair and to agree with Morgan.

Both those quotes are referring to specific moments and how keenly voices on the internet have jumped on them.

The last sentence might not have helped, unless that was a direct quote from the Morganiser!

[Banquo]

I don’t really understand what issue you’re taking with what he said either, to be honest. His overall summary seems pretty fair and to agree with Morgan.

Both those quotes are referring to specific moments and how keenly voices on the internet have jumped on them.

The last sentence might not have helped, unless that was a direct quote from the Morganiser!

Aye

[Mellsblue]

More Morecambe and Wise than that, but yes

So what, necessarily, is the right order?

Smith Furbank Smith. But Furbank also needs to show form

Harsh to drop F. Smith after a win.

[Oakboy]

So what, necessarily, is the right order?

Smith Furbank Smith. But Furbank also needs to show form

Harsh to drop F. Smith after a win.

Does that mean it would be harsh to drop Sleightholme for IFW? Didn't have you down as too emotional, MB.

[Mikey Brown]

When did IFW last play? I know he wants to throw his hat in the ring for the Lions but surely he'd need a bit of time to get up to speed, even if he is somehow match fit?

Maybe this is just my subconscious bias wanting to prevent Murley slipping even further down the pecking order.

[Mellsblue]

When did IFW last play? I know he wants to throw his hat in the ring for the Lions but surely he'd need a bit of time to get up to speed, even if he is somehow match fit?

Maybe this is just my subconscious bias wanting to prevent Murley slipping even further down the pecking order.

21st Dec.

Play him against Wales. It’ll be a nice warmup match for him before he takes the step up to the intensity of the Prem.

[Oakboy]

When did IFW last play? I know he wants to throw his hat in the ring for the Lions but surely he'd need a bit of time to get up to speed, even if he is somehow match fit?

Maybe this is just my subconscious bias wanting to prevent Murley slipping even further down the pecking order.

21st Dec.

Play him against Wales. It’ll be a nice warmup match for him before he takes the step up to the intensity of the Prem.

[Oakboy]

When did IFW last play? I know he wants to throw his hat in the ring for the Lions but surely he'd need a bit of time to get up to speed, even if he is somehow match fit?

Maybe this is just my subconscious bias wanting to prevent Murley slipping even further down the pecking order.

IFW, fit but not match-sharp, is a significant step up from any of our other wingers, IMO. Has he ever indicated that Lions selection is in his mind? Maybe he would not see it as that important at his age and against Australia.

[Puja]

When did IFW last play? I know he wants to throw his hat in the ring for the Lions but surely he'd need a bit of time to get up to speed, even if he is somehow match fit?

Maybe this is just my subconscious bias wanting to prevent Murley slipping even further down the pecking order.

I don't think he's fit yet. Rumour has him potentially being fit for the last two games, if that, so he might be able to have the home game against Italy to get back up to speed. Not sure I'd want to drop him in if the only match is away in Cardiff.

Puja

[Mellsblue]

When did IFW last play? I know he wants to throw his hat in the ring for the Lions but surely he'd need a bit of time to get up to speed, even if he is somehow match fit?

Maybe this is just my subconscious bias wanting to prevent Murley slipping even further down the pecking order.

Has he ever indicated that Lions selection is in his mind? Maybe he would not see it as that important at his age and against Australia.

Baxter has.

[Mellsblue]

When did IFW last play? I know he wants to throw his hat in the ring for the Lions but surely he'd need a bit of time to get up to speed, even if he is somehow match fit?

Maybe this is just my subconscious bias wanting to prevent Murley slipping even further down the pecking order.

Has he ever indicated that Lions selection is in his mind? Maybe he would not see it as that important at his age and against Australia.

Baxter has.

Found it:
“He’s probably overthinking it a little bit, as you can imagine,” Baxter said.
“In his head he’s thinking: ‘If I don’t get some international rugby in the Six Nations, is there any chance of the Lions?’ That makes you go: ‘Well, if I try to rehab it and get back for some of the Six Nations, do I potentially put myself in the Lions window, having a couple of good games for England and finish the season well for Exeter — does that give me my best chance?’

[Oakboy]

When did IFW last play? I know he wants to throw his hat in the ring for the Lions but surely he'd need a bit of time to get up to speed, even if he is somehow match fit?

Maybe this is just my subconscious bias wanting to prevent Murley slipping even further down the pecking order.

Has he ever indicated that Lions selection is in his mind? Maybe he would not see it as that important at his age and against Australia.

Baxter has.

I did not know that. I watched an interview where Baxter mentioned his decision to not have surgery as entirely the player's but I do not remember any mention of the Lions. Fair enough, then.

[Oakboy]

Has he ever indicated that Lions selection is in his mind? Maybe he would not see it as that important at his age and against Australia.

Baxter has.

Found it:
“He’s probably overthinking it a little bit, as you can imagine,” Baxter said.
“In his head he’s thinking: ‘If I don’t get some international rugby in the Six Nations, is there any chance of the Lions?’ That makes you go: ‘Well, if I try to rehab it and get back for some of the Six Nations, do I potentially put myself in the Lions window, having a couple of good games for England and finish the season well for Exeter — does that give me my best chance?’

Ah, hadn't caught that. Baxter does not sound in full agreement, perhaps?

[Mikey Brown]

When did IFW last play? I know he wants to throw his hat in the ring for the Lions but surely he'd need a bit of time to get up to speed, even if he is somehow match fit?

Maybe this is just my subconscious bias wanting to prevent Murley slipping even further down the pecking order.

IFW, fit but not match-sharp, is a significant step up from any of our other wingers, IMO.

I don't even understand how you can make the judgement that he's still effective when not match-sharp??? How does that even work? He's played 9 games for England and just about 2 seasons as a first choice Premiership player. This isn't some crusty old veteran prop who can get by waddling from scrum to scrum.

Don't get me wrong he's looked fantastic for England pretty much from the off (very first action was a missed tackle but I wouldn't hold that against him) but his game is centred on being lightning quick, aggressive and getting on the ball. Is the rest of his game already judged to be so good that he's still worth picking while rusty? Was he not fast-tracked in large part because he was running a blitz (which we've not semi-abandoned) at Exeter?

Freeman is maybe not electric in the same way, but I'd say has a more rounded game and I wouldn't drop him for anyone right now.

Sleightholme and Murley are obviously still behind IFW and have had their own defensive lapses but offer this similar pace and physicality going forward. I'd be happy to see a bit more of them until IFW has shown that he should be taking the shirt back, by actually playing. Roebuck has different strengths but hasn't put a foot wrong in his brief chances either.

[Mellsblue]

Baxter has.

Found it:
“He’s probably overthinking it a little bit, as you can imagine,” Baxter said.
“In his head he’s thinking: ‘If I don’t get some international rugby in the Six Nations, is there any chance of the Lions?’ That makes you go: ‘Well, if I try to rehab it and get back for some of the Six Nations, do I potentially put myself in the Lions window, having a couple of good games for England and finish the season well for Exeter — does that give me my best chance?’

Ah, hadn't caught that. Baxter does not sound in full agreement, perhaps?

It seems a secondary concern to the new EPS agreement:

‘Baxter said that because of that new set-up there has been a lot of “to-ing and fro-ing” between club and country, which is delaying a firm decision as to whether Feyi-Waboso opts for an operation, and therefore is pushing back his return date.
He believes the decision would have not have been delayed last season, when Feyi-Waboso was only managed by Exeter, not England. “I think it certainly would have happened quicker, without doubt. We had things booked, ready to go, decisions ready to be made a week ago, and then the process you have to go through now has certainly slowed things down,” he explained.
That doesn’t mean, necessarily, that it’s wrong, but it certainly slows things down.
He’s not going to rehab his shoulder in time to play in the full Six Nations campaign. England go into camp in ten days or so. He’s barely started his rehab process really, because the to-ing and fro-ing is probably slowing both options down — the operation or the rehab.“

[Banquo]

Has he ever indicated that Lions selection is in his mind? Maybe he would not see it as that important at his age and against Australia.

Baxter has.

I did not know that. I watched an interview where Baxter mentioned his decision to not have surgery as entirely the player's but I do not remember any mention of the Lions. Fair enough, then.

Think you kind of have to accept that the Lions is the pinnacle of most GB and I players aspirations/career.

[Oakboy]

When did IFW last play? I know he wants to throw his hat in the ring for the Lions but surely he'd need a bit of time to get up to speed, even if he is somehow match fit?

Maybe this is just my subconscious bias wanting to prevent Murley slipping even further down the pecking order.

IFW, fit but not match-sharp, is a significant step up from any of our other wingers, IMO.

I don't even understand how you can make the judgement that he's still effective when not match-sharp??? How does that even work? He's played 9 games for England and just about 2 seasons as a first choice Premiership player. This isn't some crusty old veteran prop who can get by waddling from scrum to scrum.

Don't get me wrong he's looked fantastic for England pretty much from the off (very first action was a missed tackle but I wouldn't hold that against him) but his game is centred on being lightning quick, aggressive and getting on the ball. Is the rest of his game already judged to be so good that he's still worth picking while rusty? Was he not fast-tracked in large part because he was running a blitz (which we've not semi-abandoned) at Exeter?

Freeman is maybe not electric in the same way, but I'd say has a more rounded game and I wouldn't drop him for anyone right now.

Sleightholme and Murley are obviously still behind IFW and have had their own defensive lapses but offer this similar pace and physicality going forward. I'd be happy to see a bit more of them until IFW has shown that he should be taking the shirt back, by actually playing. Roebuck has different strengths but hasn't put a foot wrong in his brief chances either.

I just think Scotland would be relieved to hear he was not going to play. IMO, he is our most dangerous attacker since Jason Robinson. Sod logic if he's fit. Get him in.

Conversely, I doubt Scotland will be quaking in their boots knowing they have to face Sleightholme or Murley.

Freeman, IMO, managed to get up to a more effective level v France but he has been badly used in games of late. He HAS looked good previously as part of a back three with IFW and Furbank. The messing about with defensive systems has not helped him - nor has the absence of Mitchell. His improved impact is a solid reason to stick with Fin, arguably. I wonder whether the original concept of having him stick wide, principally as a kick-chaser, with IFW roaming, needs more imagination. It was a safer option, perhaps based on IFW's relative inexperience. Allowing both to wander seems essential to get the best out of them.

[Oakboy]

Baxter has.

I did not know that. I watched an interview where Baxter mentioned his decision to not have surgery as entirely the player's but I do not remember any mention of the Lions. Fair enough, then.

Think you kind of have to accept that the Lions is the pinnacle of most GB and I players aspirations/career.

Above the RWC?

[Which Tyler]

He’s barely started his rehab process really, because the to-ing and fro-ing is probably slowing both options down — the operation or the rehab.“

In that case, someone somewhere is incompetent.
Absolutely no reason that rehab has to wait for a decision on surgery before starting - or more precisely, if you're opting for surgery, you REALLY want to start the rehab beforehand, to maximise the chances of a successful outcome.

TBH, I suspect he's telling porkie pies because he doesn't like central contracts, and wants to have a dig.