RugbyRebels

I agree .. but neither Moen in his interview recently or seemingly England think he is the primary spinner.

Drubbing on the cards. Best we can hope for is some spirited batting and extending the game to a 5th day. Actually felt that the first morning was critical. We missed our chance then, i think, and then followed it up with some dreadful 1st innings batting.
Personnel wise we are horribly weak in the top 3. A change there is a no brainer with Stoneman a possibility.
I dont see Dawson as a test match player. Not sure what Rashid has done to get himself excluded, but right now he would be far more likely to take wickets. Long term, I think Crane is the one to watch but its too early for him.

Saffers are no doubt a slightly better side now under their proper captain . England are in their usual self destruct mode and are perhaps thinking they are better that they actually are . Few bright lights but the opening order and selection is a farce . Dawson, an alleged spinner , I would suggest should never be seen again. We are again depending on the same batsmen to give us a decent total . Just hoping we don't get a tonking by the crims . Sad to say both Broad and Anderson are past their best .

Anyone seen the 16y/o at Derby? https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/ ... an-cricket



Could be one for the future. His first innings figures were impressive, too 15-8-16-1!

Ballance out of the 3rd test, choice between Stoneman and Malan for me. Likely to be the former, but I'd love to see Malan in the test team. Been a fan of his for ages.

Brilliant from Aggers and the TMS team:

And a hattrick for Moeen. That's 18 in the series so far, at less than 15 a piece.

Not bad for a part time spinner...

And my 2nd favourite player getting a 5fer on debut, plus those two cameos with the bat. Should have really been picked earlier, but hopefully now TRJ is here to stay. For a while at least.

Well 3-1 was a good display...a bit of positive luck with Phillander being limited in his fitness Rabada not as good in the UK and their top order not really firing but they were well beaten.

Some concerns in the England top order with none of the first 3 not really on top form although may be unfair to Cook.

I hope they get a clear opinion of who they want for the next two series West Indies should offer an unique opportunity. .but getting ready for the Ashes should be the driver.

I am not sure about Jennings ...but he may get a chance to get back into form at county level and let him improve his technique which was tested ..and decide who else we have as an option.

I liked Malan. ..but he has had some great deliveries to face so he should get a chance as well as Wesley against WI.

Bowling ..TRJ did well but do we bring back Woakes as the 3rd seamer slot or let TRJ bed in .

Really good comeback after Trent Bridge. SA below par but we played really well at the Oval and OT.

The side has a great spine with a fabulous middle order (Stokes, Bairstow and Ali) but that top 5 is seriously fragile.

Think Westley deserves retention but Jennings surely needs to be stood down and i'm not convinced that Malan is any better then several other players who have been tried. maybe Hales at 5 is worth a go?

The crazy thing is that Ballance plays 5. So if he comes back, don't jettison Westley...

77 so far for Hameed in the Lancashire match. Definitely a player we need to keep our eyes on. Was a crying shame we've had no CC matches this summer.

Hales looked great at 5 for Notts.

The spine is taking shape...

Cook
Hameed/Jennings/Stoneman/A.N.Other
Westley
Root
Malan/Hales/Ballance/A.N.Other/Bairstow
Stokes
Bairstow/Ali
Ali/Dawson/Woakes/A.N.Other
TRJ
Broad
Anderson

Basically that's it. We need to make up our mind on the 2 and 5, and hope that Westley does well.

Is Woakes injury free for the Ashes or have people forgot him . ?

Discreet Hooker wrote:Is Woakes injury free for the Ashes or have people forgot him . ?

First game back from injury against Middlesex. Unfortunately (Middlesex is my team) he did alright. 5 wickets and a half century. He won't be fit for the 1st test against the Windies, but should play a part in the series. Trouble is, who does he come in for? Do we push everyone up a place and go with 5 quicks?

Stom wrote:

Discreet Hooker wrote:Is Woakes injury free for the Ashes or have people forgot him . ?

First game back from injury against Middlesex. Unfortunately (Middlesex is my team) he did alright. 5 wickets and a half century. He won't be fit for the 1st test against the Windies, but should play a part in the series. Trouble is, who does he come in for? Do we push everyone up a place and go with 5 quicks?

TRJ looks the one for the chop. He's maybe where Woakes was a few years ago with the speed to do okay on English pitches that offer a little, but a seeming sitting duck were he to be exposed to touring Australia. Woakes also has more in the bank, and offers more with the bat.

Someone like TRJ could still be kept in the side, but maybe only to rest Broad and Anderson for a test each with a view to the winter tour. And maybe we could play a final game with 5 quicks to only use Stokes in 4-5 over bursts.

Digby wrote:

Stom wrote:

Discreet Hooker wrote:Is Woakes injury free for the Ashes or have people forgot him . ?

First game back from injury against Middlesex. Unfortunately (Middlesex is my team) he did alright. 5 wickets and a half century. He won't be fit for the 1st test against the Windies, but should play a part in the series. Trouble is, who does he come in for? Do we push everyone up a place and go with 5 quicks?

TRJ looks the one for the chop. He's maybe where Woakes was a few years ago with the speed to do okay on English pitches that offer a little, but a seeming sitting duck were he to be exposed to touring Australia. Woakes also has more in the bank, and offers more with the bat.

Someone like TRJ could still be kept in the side, but maybe only to rest Broad and Anderson for a test each with a view to the winter tour. And maybe we could play a final game with 5 quicks to only use Stokes in 4-5 over bursts.

McGrath was far from quick. In fact, TRJ may be marginally quicker, but you cannot say he was ineffective in Australian conditions...

He's performed excellently in his first 2 tests, simple as.

Stom wrote:

Digby wrote:

Stom wrote:
First game back from injury against Middlesex. Unfortunately (Middlesex is my team) he did alright. 5 wickets and a half century. He won't be fit for the 1st test against the Windies, but should play a part in the series. Trouble is, who does he come in for? Do we push everyone up a place and go with 5 quicks?

TRJ looks the one for the chop. He's maybe where Woakes was a few years ago with the speed to do okay on English pitches that offer a little, but a seeming sitting duck were he to be exposed to touring Australia. Woakes also has more in the bank, and offers more with the bat.

Someone like TRJ could still be kept in the side, but maybe only to rest Broad and Anderson for a test each with a view to the winter tour. And maybe we could play a final game with 5 quicks to only use Stokes in 4-5 over bursts.

McGrath was far from quick. In fact, TRJ may be marginally quicker, but you cannot say he was ineffective in Australian conditions...

He's performed excellently in his first 2 tests, simple as.

If you perform excellently you might still be dropped if a better option becomes available, and that contest for places isn't to be bemoaned.

If TRJ goes on to prove himself even the diet version of McGrath then I'm just very wrong, but he looks like a plodder (by test standards) who'd be found out outside of England.

England squad to face West Indies

Alastair Cook (Essex), Mark Stoneman (Surrey), Tom Westley (Essex), Joe Root (Yorkshire, capt), Dawid Malan (Middlesex), Ben Stokes (Durham), Jonathan Bairstow (Yorkshire, wk), Moeen Ali (Worcestershire), Chris Woakes (Warwickshire), Toby Roland-Jones (Middlesex), Stuart Broad (Nottinghamshire), Mason Crane (Hampshire), James Anderson (Lancashire).

So Jennings rested Stoneman in Woakes back into the sqaud and a bolter in Mason Crane.
I have never seen the lad play red ball cricket only T20.. but maybe not alone in that I guess, anyone know what he brings to the party?

No need to worry about a red ball next up

Digby wrote:

Stom wrote:

Digby wrote:
TRJ looks the one for the chop. He's maybe where Woakes was a few years ago with the speed to do okay on English pitches that offer a little, but a seeming sitting duck were he to be exposed to touring Australia. Woakes also has more in the bank, and offers more with the bat.

Someone like TRJ could still be kept in the side, but maybe only to rest Broad and Anderson for a test each with a view to the winter tour. And maybe we could play a final game with 5 quicks to only use Stokes in 4-5 over bursts.

McGrath was far from quick. In fact, TRJ may be marginally quicker, but you cannot say he was ineffective in Australian conditions...

He's performed excellently in his first 2 tests, simple as.

If you perform excellently you might still be dropped if a better option becomes available, and that contest for places isn't to be bemoaned.

If TRJ goes on to prove himself even the diet version of McGrath then I'm just very wrong, but he looks like a plodder (by test standards) who'd be found out outside of England.

aye

Digby wrote:No need to worry about a red ball next up

This new ' pink ' ball is going to be interesting . The manufacturers were on 5Live this morning and even they are unaware of how the ball will perform . There was even a suggestion that the ball will be affected by the lights when switched on . Bit of a gamble imo for the paying customers .

Watch this space .

Discreet Hooker wrote:

Digby wrote:No need to worry about a red ball next up

This new ' pink ' ball is going to be interesting . The manufacturers were on 5Live this morning and even they are unaware of how the ball will perform . There was even a suggestion that the ball will be affected by the lights when switched on . Bit of a gamble imo for the paying customers .

Watch this space .

Reports seem to be it's done different things, from doing very little and just being normal, to moving around a fair bit, to softening quite quickly and leaving the bowlers wishing the next 50 overs would just go so they can have another new ball. I suppose in fairness we get all those at times with a red ball.

Discreet Hooker wrote:

Digby wrote:No need to worry about a red ball next up

This new ' pink ' ball is going to be interesting . The manufacturers were on 5Live this morning and even they are unaware of how the ball will perform . There was even a suggestion that the ball will be affected by the lights when switched on . Bit of a gamble imo for the paying customers .

Watch this space .

I would imagine it is not just going to be the ball that is affected. I imagine a few fielders will have their visual skills tested in new ways with seeing the ball in the air and getting traction on a damp surface.

I suport the notion it is a gamble but I suppose test cricket has to offer the paying public a differant option...but for me I am yet to see the upside...but I will be glued to the spare TV as Mrs PG will have her selection on the main screen after 7 pm

ALunpg wrote:

Discreet Hooker wrote:

Digby wrote:No need to worry about a red ball next up

This new ' pink ' ball is going to be interesting . The manufacturers were on 5Live this morning and even they are unaware of how the ball will perform . There was even a suggestion that the ball will be affected by the lights when switched on . Bit of a gamble imo for the paying customers .

Watch this space .

I would imagine it is not just going to be the ball that is affected. I imagine a few fielders will have their visual skills tested in new ways with seeing the ball in the air and getting traction on a damp surface.

I suport the notion it is a gamble but I suppose test cricket has to offer the paying public a differant option...but for me I am yet to see the upside...but I will be glued to the spare TV as Mrs PG will have her selection on the main screen after 7 pm

I don't think it is that much of a gamble to be honest. Pink ball has been used under lights at various places around the world, if the ball doesn't really work in English conditions then so be it. If it doesn't work they've lost nothing really as it is a throw away test v WI. It is depressing enough seeing county games in front of 1 man and his dog, but it is worse when sparse crowds turn up for tests on week days. If, and it is a big if, they manage to get more to turn up to a day/night test then it is a good thing for test cricket.

First three ' days ' sold out apparently . Best test ground for atmosphere imo . Shame not a stronger opposition really but with England who knows .


Regards the county game , hard to generate interest but needed to bring players thru' .

Windies are a sad sight these days...mind, that's been the case for over 10 years in truth, compared to what they have been. Its a crying shame, but you can easily see test cricket curling up slowly and dying.

Banquo wrote:Windies are a sad sight these days...mind, that's been the case for over 10 years in truth, compared to what they have been. Its a crying shame, but you can easily see test cricket curling up slowly and dying.

With a corrupt global body, it's kind of hard to call out local boards for poor behaviour...

If the Windies CB sorted their crap out, they'd have a pretty good team to put out. There is some talent around. Just think if they could develop it.

Plus, some of these other sportsmen, who in ages past would have been cricketers, are now playing alternative sports because it pays better.

Stom wrote:

Banquo wrote:Windies are a sad sight these days...mind, that's been the case for over 10 years in truth, compared to what they have been. Its a crying shame, but you can easily see test cricket curling up slowly and dying.

With a corrupt global body, it's kind of hard to call out local boards for poor behaviour...

If the Windies CB sorted their crap out, they'd have a pretty good team to put out. There is some talent around. Just think if they could develop it.

Plus, some of these other sportsmen, who in ages past would have been cricketers, are now playing alternative sports because it pays better.

even with their best current players they'd be struggling. And as you say with other sports competing more effectively for their best athletes, will they be able to be really competitive again?...'other sports' including T20

It was also a general point on Test Cricket globally tbh