EPS Watch / Player Form Thread

[p/d]

At 6ways yesterday, not sure I'd want Mills in an England shirt

[Puja]

Not really sure what the point of having Ryan Mills there is. I would've placed him safely in the "never will be" pile and leapt straight to an U20s name like Malins.

Interesting that Harrison is there ahead of Nathan Catt. Would suggest that he is lined up for the 17 shirt vs the BaaBaas behind whichever of Genge and Mullan is unavailable. Did anyone else notice that Harrison played 3 for Sale against Leicester? Was that an in extremis selection or is he being groomed to move across?

Puja

I'm not sure I'd consign Mills to the 'never will be' pile yet. He's not 25 until the end of the month so still has plenty of time on his side and when he's been given game time, he's delivered for Worcester. I'd argue his form has been one of the biggest factors in Worcester's resurgence under Gold.

He's expressed a preference for playing 12 next season and if he shows up well playing week-in, week-out in that second-playmaker role, he could be a useful option to have in/around the EPS mix. IMO, he's effectively competing with Slade, Francis and Mallinder. He's not in Slade's class, but Slade still needs to nail down a position, Francis will likely be playing at 10 and despite Mallinder's obvious potential, he still has glaring weaknesses in his game that may take longer than a couple of seasons to solve.

I agree with you re. Catt. Perhaps he didn't impress last time he was called in to camp? It seems as the Rokoduguni's also slipped behind Humphreys and Attwood behind Spencer. Ellis' call-up doesn't really balance it out for Bath.

I'm also slightly surprised that Ribbans didn't get a call. I imagine Eddie likes the look of him.

Shame for any Newcastle players too after the season they've had.

I suspect Roko's been put onto Eddie's "never-will-be" list, which I disagree with. Glad to see Yarde's rewarded after his response the last couple of weeks. He's looking dangerous again for the first time in a long time.

On Newcastle - I take your point, but they've got so much of a foreign legion that I can't actually name an English player who's been a driving force in them going up the league. One could make a case for Watson and Wilson, but neither of them have had the impact that Goneva, Socino, Takalua, or Latu have, and they are in positions that are already fairly well stocked in that training squad.

Puja

[Puja]

Not really sure what the point of having Ryan Mills there is. I would've placed him safely in the "never will be" pile and leapt straight to an U20s name like Malins.

Interesting that Harrison is there ahead of Nathan Catt. Would suggest that he is lined up for the 17 shirt vs the BaaBaas behind whichever of Genge and Mullan is unavailable. Did anyone else notice that Harrison played 3 for Sale against Leicester? Was that an in extremis selection or is he being groomed to move across?

Puja

I'm not sure I'd consign Mills to the 'never will be' pile yet. He's not 25 until the end of the month so still has plenty of time on his side and when he's been given game time, he's delivered for Worcester. I'd argue his form has been one of the biggest factors in Worcester's resurgence under Gold.

He's expressed a preference for playing 12 next season and if he shows up well playing week-in, week-out in that second-playmaker role, he could be a useful option to have in/around the EPS mix. IMO, he's effectively competing with Slade, Francis and Mallinder. He's not in Slade's class, but Slade still needs to nail down a position, Francis will likely be playing at 10 and despite Mallinder's obvious potential, he still has glaring weaknesses in his game that may take longer than a couple of seasons to solve.

I agree with you re. Catt. Perhaps he didn't impress last time he was called in to camp? It seems as the Rokoduguni's also slipped behind Humphreys and Attwood behind Spencer. Ellis' call-up doesn't really balance it out for Bath.

I'm also slightly surprised that Ribbans didn't get a call. I imagine Eddie likes the look of him.

Shame for any Newcastle players too after the season they've had.

Seems clear that in the majority of cases, Eddie has skipped the 23-30 year olds who haven't already established themselves in looking to Argentina; hence Puja's 'surprise' over Mills- who I also think is a good player and will make a good fist of 12.

I'll be honest - I did think Mills was a bit older than 24, so that increased my surprise at him being picked.

Puja

[Scrumhead]

Re. the Newcastle players I was primarily thinking about Wilson (Mark not David obviously) and Watson.

Green and Welch are underrated IMO but I wouldn't pick either ahead of the players who have been selected.

Apparently the Northampton players were not in contention either due to their play-off. Harrison, Haywood and Ribbans were the only players in with a shout though I'd imagine?

[Puja]

Re. the Newcastle players I was primarily thinking about Wilson (Mark not David obviously) and Watson.

Green and Welch are underrated IMO but I wouldn't pick either ahead of the players who have been selected.

Apparently the Northampton players were not in contention either due to their play-off. Harrison, Haywood and Ribbans were the only players in with a shout though I'd imagine?

Plus no Mallinder, Hill, Wood, or Hartley from the original squad.

Puja

[fivepointer]

This squad will meet up this week, so anyone not fit (Catt, I assume) wouldn't have been called up and anyone still involved with their clubs were also excluded. It did leave a small pool of players. I suspect Eddie wanted a full pack to work with what could be much of his starting backline for the BaaBaas and Argentinian games. I suspect that for some, this will be their one and only involvement with England but there's no harm in having a look at some outer fringe options.

Newcastle are a bit unlucky but they don't really have anyone demanding selection. Green would be a decent fill in at lock, Wilson is a very consistent back rower and Watson is a lively back 3 option. Outside of that maybe Harris at OC and, if they had had more game time, possibly Robinson at lock and Scott Wilson at TH.

[Banquo]

At 6ways yesterday, not sure I'd want Mills in an England shirt

The tweed jacket then?

[Digby]

At 6ways yesterday, not sure I'd want Mills in an England shirt

The tweed jacket then?

that would be a boon

[Mellsblue]

Rory Teague resigns from his position as England's skills coach to move to Bordeaux Begles. He leaves after the Arg tour.

[Mellsblue]

The BBC will broadcast live television coverage of England's tour to Argentina in June.


Coverage details:

10 June: First Test from 20:00-22:30 BST on BBC Two

17 June: Second Test from 20:00-22:30 BST on BBC Two

[belgarion]

The BBC will broadcast live television coverage of England's tour to Argentina in June.


Coverage details:

10 June: First Test from 20:00-22:30 BST on BBC Two

17 June: Second Test from 20:00-22:30 BST on BBC Two

So Auntie still does Sports other than MotD, Wimbledon & the Olympics

[Digby]

Rory Teague resigns from his position as England's skills coach to move to Bordeaux Begles. He leaves after the Arg tour.

Looks a good move for Teague, hard to say if he's been a success with England

[Banquo]

Rory Teague resigns from his position as England's skills coach to move to Bordeaux Begles. He leaves after the Arg tour.

Looks a good move for Teague, hard to say if he's been a success with England

which pretty much says he hasn't!

[Digby]

Rory Teague resigns from his position as England's skills coach to move to Bordeaux Begles. He leaves after the Arg tour.

Looks a good move for Teague, hard to say if he's been a success with England

which pretty much says he hasn't!

I think it's much too early to say either way. And our attack still seems a bit weird from selection onward, and that really isn't all him. He's highly thought of it seems, so mostly I'm pleased he's going to be doing more day to day coaching

[Mellsblue]

Looks a good move for Teague, hard to say if he's been a success with England

which pretty much says he hasn't!

I think it's much too early to say either way. And our attack still seems a bit weird from selection onward, and that really isn't all him. He's highly thought of it seems, so mostly I'm pleased he's going to be doing more day to day coaching

Jones on Teague:
“I’m pleased for him. One of my jobs is to improve English coaches and I’ve always said they’ve got to have overseas experience. He has a great opportunity. If he does three or four years and then comes back, he’s the sort of guy who is ready to take a senior role with an international side.”

[Mellsblue]

Jones says that Hartley can be captain at the World Cup if he continues to improve and keeps his hunger.......

[Scrumhead]

Jones says that Hartley can be captain at the World Cup if he continues to improve and keeps his hunger.......

Discipline aside, I wouldn't say he has improved in the past few years, so I can't see how he's going to improve now?

Hopefully George, Cowan-Dickie and Taylor keep improving to the extent that Hartley is unequivocally the fourth best hooker we have.

Also, considering that 'leadership qualities' are the main factor in him retaining his place in the side, we need a few more leaders to step-up and minimise the perceived need for Hartley's influence.

[Mikey Brown]

Starting posting this in the Saracens/Clermont thread but it's probably more relevant here in the end.

I too am left wondering what the situation is with W'Worth, Barritt, Ashton, Goode (Farrell on occasion) looking so desperately limited at points for England, yet being that brutally effective with Saracens. I still maintain that is Haskell gets another chance and was able to perform like he did last year then it's possible anybody can do it.

I'm not suggesting I want them all back but it's interesting to see which players Jones thinks he can iron out the flaws of and which he doesn't. I guess lack of options (that fit his vision) for the 7 shirt in particular was a major factor.

I'm really hoping that phase 2 of Jones's plan plays out the way he described. We have a few players with enormous talent that aren't sitting quite right at club level that I think he could really get something extra from. You have to wonder where this mythical power in the backline is coming from; there's T'eo obviously, Tuilagi who might never get another cap, Yarde/Roko appear to have blown it and now he's looking at some really green youngsters.

[Mellsblue]

now he's looking at some really green youngsters.

Haha, very good. Cokanasiga plays for Irish who wear green. Welcome to the punnery.

[Mikey Brown]

I'll punt you in to the sea.

[Mellsblue]

Hehe.

[Timbo]

Big Dave Ewers apparently out for 6 months or so. His knees seem a bit buggered.

[twitchy]

Big Dave Ewers apparently out for 6 months or so. His knees seem a bit buggered.

That is such a shame.

[TheNomad]

Kieran Treadwell's just been called up by Ireland...shame for us, but good luck to him. I guess we're not short of locks at any rate.

[Peat]

Kieran Treadwell's just been called up by Ireland...shame for us, but good luck to him. I guess we're not short of locks at any rate.

Inevitable from the moment he signed for Ulster. As a Ulster fan I've been pleased by him, but make no mistake, this is a taster being given to a promising player, not a real deal international call up - he may never get one of those.