RugbyRebels

I was always quite a big Dai Young fan, so is this testament to what Dai built or an illustration that my trust in Dai was misplaced?

Digby wrote:I was always quite a big Dai Young fan, so is this testament to what Dai built or an illustration that my trust in Dai was misplaced?

Yes

Digby wrote:I was always quite a big Dai Young fan, so is this testament to what Dai built or an illustration that my trust in Dai was misplaced?

I think you look at the best parts of the victory: Gopperth at 12, Willis, Young, Rowlands, the scrum and you have applaud Dai. However, the trust in Umaga, the rejuvenation of Bassett and new umbrella defensive system you have to give that to Lee and Costello.

padprop wrote:

Digby wrote:I was always quite a big Dai Young fan, so is this testament to what Dai built or an illustration that my trust in Dai was misplaced?

I think you look at the best parts of the victory: Gopperth at 12, Willis, Young, Rowlands, the scrum and you have applaud Dai. However, the trust in Umaga, the rejuvenation of Bassett and new umbrella defensive system you have to give that to Lee and Costello.

He just ran out of gas- as a lot of head coaches do if they stay too long.

Umaga was already our starting 10 with dai.

The extra focus on defence doesn't seem to have takenfrom our attack which is big.

It's the side dai built, but being used better.

It would be the most Eddie Jones move of all time to not now pick Willis...

He's just so consistent. He hardly dips below an 8 every game, and often scores higher.

I am worried by the fact that Jones didnt pick Armand when he was clearly the best player in the prem for a while....

I am worried you think Armand was clearly the best player in the Prem for a while....

“Calls for his selection from former players have been deafening. Armand has been the best back-rower in the Premiership for a year but Jones has ignored him while England fumble at the breakdown, until now.”

These articles were a dime a dozen in 2018.

+ shortlist of 2018 player of the year

Maybe clearly was the wrong turn of phrase, but he was getting similar hype back then that Willis is now

Armand was never getting the sort of hype Willis has been getting, outside of rugby writers wanting to have a pop at Eddie. He was very good for a very good team, but he wasn't defining matches all by himself.

padprop wrote:I am worried by the fact that Jones didnt pick Armand when he was clearly the best player in the prem for a while....

All well and good except he did pick him.

Armand deserved a lot more time with England than he got. He was badly done to i reckon. As good as he was - and for a good couple of seasons he was routinely excellent - he wasnt at the level that Willis is currently performing at.

Banquo wrote:

padprop wrote:I am worried by the fact that Jones didnt pick Armand when he was clearly the best player in the prem for a while....

All well and good except he did pick him.

For a token 5 minutes against Ireland. Hope Willis will get a bit more

You can have as many articles as you like saying Armand has been the best back-rower in the Premiership for a year but that clearly doesn’t make him clearly the best player in the Premiership.
Tbh, it was just a flippant comment responding to your flippant comment.

padprop wrote:

Banquo wrote:

padprop wrote:I am worried by the fact that Jones didnt pick Armand when he was clearly the best player in the prem for a while....

All well and good except he did pick him.

For a token 5 minutes against Ireland. Hope Willis will get a bit more

He’ll have seen a bit more than that during camp.
I’m with Eddie on this one.

Mellsblue wrote:You can have as many articles as you like saying Armand has been the best back-rower in the Premiership for a year but that clearly doesn’t make him clearly the best player in the Premiership.
Tbh, it was just a flippant comment responding to your flippant comment.

Aye, I can acknowledge my flippancy, just remember commentators getting very excited with Armand in a similar way to Willis. Was just making the point that I hope it doesn’t end up the same way.

It shouldn’t be a question of him making the squad, it should be how do we get this guy in the starting XV, but with Eddie, I fear that is not his mindset

Quite honestly, he's 23. We're 3 years out from a RWC. He's currently got 0 caps. The unit in possession are fit and playing well.


I'm happy to get him in the pitch via the bench, let him find his feet at international level. Set him up to succeed, rather than as the new Messiah to be torn down for Christmas

I’d say that for most players, but to have 43 turnovers when the next best player is 19... I’d love to see if that translates to the international game straight away, instead of being pissed around by Eddie, getting an injury in a training camp and being forgotten about

I don't think anyone's calling for him to get an injury during a training camp and be forgotten about.

We're talking about putting him the 7 shirt, or the 19 shirt

padprop wrote:

Banquo wrote:

padprop wrote:I am worried by the fact that Jones didnt pick Armand when he was clearly the best player in the prem for a while....

All well and good except he did pick him.

For a token 5 minutes against Ireland. Hope Willis will get a bit more

And several squads, and a tour. He had a good look at him. For what it’s worth, I think Armand limited and was at the time.

padprop wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:You can have as many articles as you like saying Armand has been the best back-rower in the Premiership for a year but that clearly doesn’t make him clearly the best player in the Premiership.
Tbh, it was just a flippant comment responding to your flippant comment.

Aye, I can acknowledge my flippancy, just remember commentators getting very excited with Armand in a similar way to Willis. Was just making the point that I hope it doesn’t end up the same way.

It shouldn’t be a question of him making the squad, it should be how do we get this guy in the starting XV, but with Eddie, I fear that is not his mindset

Willis is a way better player than Armand. But I share your worry.

Which Tyler wrote:I don't think anyone's calling for him to get an injury during a training camp and be forgotten about.

We're talking about putting him the 7 shirt, or the 19 shirt

6 shirt tbh. Curry at 7 for me

England have 6 games in 7 weeks. Willis, or anyone else, doesnt have to play in every game. This is a perfect opportunity to spread the load and look at a number of new players.
You could easily rotate on a game by game basis.
We dont have to make any long term decisions now.
Just get him in, give him a chance and lets see where we are at the end of the autumn.

Banquo wrote:

padprop wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:You can have as many articles as you like saying Armand has been the best back-rower in the Premiership for a year but that clearly doesn’t make him clearly the best player in the Premiership.
Tbh, it was just a flippant comment responding to your flippant comment.

Aye, I can acknowledge my flippancy, just remember commentators getting very excited with Armand in a similar way to Willis. Was just making the point that I hope it doesn’t end up the same way.

It shouldn’t be a question of him making the squad, it should be how do we get this guy in the starting XV, but with Eddie, I fear that is not his mindset

Willis is a way better player than Armand. But I share your worry.

Agreed

fivepointer wrote:England have 6 games in 7 weeks. Willis, or anyone else, doesnt have to play in every game. This is a perfect opportunity to spread the load and look at a number of new players.
You could easily rotate on a game by game basis.
We dont have to make any long term decisions now.
Just get him in, give him a chance and lets see where we are at the end of the autumn.

Yep. That’s exactly what I’m thinking too.

I’d give Willis a debit from the bench vs. Italy and then a start against Georgia. I reckon he’d love that kind of physicality.