England XV vs France XV

[Oakboy]

Haha. Maybe check out the 'foe' feature.

Felt pretty similar to the Lions for me. Kind of a scratch team, disjointed and the heat got to them. Still disappointing though.

Great to see Atkinson, Willis, Hill and a couple of others go well.

Is Theo Dan actually any good?

That horrible line-out concession at a crucial time might be your answer. George did the ordinary stuff so well and showed why I was wrong to wonder if Dan should have started. I think he should now be dumped. He fails at crucial moments too often.

Can you detail those crucial moments? Cos it seems to me that if you were such a fan before, you must have ignored them?

I'm not a fan but someone has to take over from George eventually. Not picking George is more important than picking Dan with the future in mind. I'd just switch attention to one of the alternatives.

[Banquo]

No, but for some reason he has a central contract

Taking your anti fez hat off

That thing is welded on.

Yeah, fair point, but he's only shown glimpses of that in white so far. Hopefully it's just a bit soon for him and another season let's him tidy up the rough edges

In the meantime, what else does Langdon have to do? He's been probably the best in the league for 2 seasons running now - another player where I can't see what Shank Bathroom dislikes

I like Langdon, but in bigger matches he’s been rag dolled carrying a fair bit, which has been his calling card for recognition

[loudnconfident]

My 2p

Nice arvo for families
Respect to the 2 teams for sweating it out
Crowd concentrating on Mexican waves (while we dropped two late tries) was disrespectful.
As was the screen flashing #weartherose bullshit during the anthems
Getting 3 maul pens against us at the start was weird

But fun for £25 and travel easier with 32k attendees rsther than a rammed HQ

Cheers

L&C

[p/d]

Haha. Maybe check out the 'foe' feature.

Felt pretty similar to the Lions for me. Kind of a scratch team, disjointed and the heat got to them. Still disappointing though.

Great to see Atkinson, Willis, Hill and a couple of others go well.

Is Theo Dan actually any good?

That horrible line-out concession at a crucial time might be your answer. George did the ordinary stuff so well and showed why I was wrong to wonder if Dan should have started. I think he should now be dumped. He fails at crucial moments too often.

Can you detail those crucial moments? Cos it seems to me that if you were such a fan before, you must have ignored them?

Was it Dan’s overthrow after Slade’s excellent touch finder that then led to Slade knocking on?

[Captainhaircut]

Reasonable run out. Taught us nothing new but hopefully Borthers learnt something he should have already learnt by now… Namely Dombrandt and Slade are dreadful, Davidson should never have been picked ahead of AOF and Langdon is miles better than Dan.

Hopefully Dingwall, BCurry and Furbank are fit for the first test.

IFW had a mare. Hopefully he’s available for USA.

[Epaminondas Pules]

Watching live there were a few things. IFW was a red all day long. Not need for yellow. Yoy heard the contact ring around stadium.

Willis was good. Atkinson looked good when we used him.

Spencer seemed quick with ball but his accuracy was poor.

Ford kicked way too much and quite badly at times.

We didn’t commit their ruck defenders anywhere near enough.

The ref was pretty poor. Last scrumming was a joke. France were offside at every single kick off, by quite some distance!

Spencer should have gone off. He was all over the place post rhe hit he took. Was properly wobbly! I have no idea how / why he stayed on.

6:2 made to look like a cunts choice. Which it was!

[Epaminondas Pules]

Plus it was ridiculously hot! Not sunny by fuck me it was hot!

And everyone was on their feet willing Joe Heyes to score the greatest <ahem> try ever seen!

[loudnconfident]

Plus it was ridiculously hot! Not sunny by fuck me it was hot!

+100

The players needed their 20 min water-break (which let us pop back for a pint as well.)

[Oakboy]

Watching live there were a few things. IFW was a red all day long. Not need for yellow. Yoy heard the contact ring around stadium.

Willis was good. Atkinson looked good when we used him.

Spencer seemed quick with ball but his accuracy was poor.

Ford kicked way too much and quite badly at times.

We didn’t commit their ruck defenders anywhere near enough.

The ref was pretty poor. Last scrumming was a joke. France were offside at every single kick off, by quite some distance!

Spencer should have gone off. He was all over the place post rhe hit he took. Was properly wobbly! I have no idea how / why he stayed on.

6:2 made to look like a cunts choice. Which it was!

All spot on apart from the ref denigration. Was she bad really?

[SixAndAHalf]

Reasonable run out. Taught us nothing new but hopefully Borthers learnt something he should have already learnt by now… Namely Dombrandt and Slade are dreadful, Davidson should never have been picked ahead of AOF and Langdon is miles better than Dan.

Hopefully Dingwall, BCurry and Furbank are fit for the first test.

IFW had a mare. Hopefully he’s available for USA.

Agreed - could be helpful if it persuades Borthers to jettison a few who look like 6/10 internationals (Slade, Dombrandt, Isiekwe plus maybe Dan and Spencer)

[Epaminondas Pules]

Watching live there were a few things. IFW was a red all day long. Not need for yellow. Yoy heard the contact ring around stadium.

Willis was good. Atkinson looked good when we used him.

Spencer seemed quick with ball but his accuracy was poor.

Ford kicked way too much and quite badly at times.

We didn’t commit their ruck defenders anywhere near enough.

The ref was pretty poor. Last scrumming was a joke. France were offside at every single kick off, by quite some distance!

Spencer should have gone off. He was all over the place post rhe hit he took. Was properly wobbly! I have no idea how / why he stayed on.

6:2 made to look like a cunts choice. Which it was!

All spot on apart from the ref denigration. Was she bad really?

Watching live she seemed to be a bit off. Looked like another case of promoting people too early. But I will say that is live and thus without angles.

[Puja]

That horrible line-out concession at a crucial time might be your answer. George did the ordinary stuff so well and showed why I was wrong to wonder if Dan should have started. I think he should now be dumped. He fails at crucial moments too often.

Can you detail those crucial moments? Cos it seems to me that if you were such a fan before, you must have ignored them?

I'm not a fan but someone has to take over from George eventually. Not picking George is more important than picking Dan with the future in mind. I'd just switch attention to one of the alternatives.

While George is still showing such form, I'm in favour of picking him. He's just such a clever player on the pitch - first to a loose ball, first to spot a break and get in support, first to spot an underresourced ruck and join in to save our ball. It's no surprise that he was the first person to notice Spencer was down at the end of the first half and step in at 9 to secure the ball.

Yes, he can't go on forever, but I'd rather make him the target that the younger heads need to outmatch, rather than just gift someone caps without making them fix their deficiencies.


Speaking of Spencer, what an absolute turd of a performance that was. Again. Didn't kick the leather off it this time, thankfully, but some of those passes made me wish that he did. By the end, Ford had stopped running onto the ball because every time he tried, Spencer passed it behind him to stop him in his tracks.

Puja

[Spiffy]

Does England have any really fast centres who look as though they might make a break or outsprint an opposite number? Quite hard to think of one since the days of Guscott. Maybe the notion of moving Freeman to 13 is not bad one. He's big, powerful and has some gas. There are a few fast wings waiting around who could slot in in his place.

[Mikey Brown]

Ollie Lawrence is hardly ancient history. Whatever you think of his other shortcomings he can make breaks. Only just started to really click for him when he got injured.

Beard, Freeman, Marchant are all quick and evasive, but might not see them get a run (at 13) immediately. I fear Slade keeps getting back in for the sake of ‘security’, then keeps his place due to ‘continuity’ without ever having to offer much more than the occasional big touch finder.

[Banquo]

That horrible line-out concession at a crucial time might be your answer. George did the ordinary stuff so well and showed why I was wrong to wonder if Dan should have started. I think he should now be dumped. He fails at crucial moments too often.

Can you detail those crucial moments? Cos it seems to me that if you were such a fan before, you must have ignored them?

Was it Dan’s overthrow after Slade’s excellent touch finder that then led to Slade knocking on?

I give up! Was it?

[Oakboy]

Ollie Lawrence is hardly ancient history. Whatever you think of his other shortcomings he can make breaks. Only just started to really click for him when he got injured.

Beard, Freeman, Marchant are all quick and evasive, but might not see them get a run (at 13) immediately. I fear Slade keeps getting back in for the sake of ‘security’, then keeps his place due to ‘continuity’ without ever having to offer much more than the occasional big touch finder.

George is still performing but can't go on for ever. Slade is consistent and useful but needs moving on. In both cases, Sunshine Beak needs to make decisions soon while there is time for both to be around as fall-back options. Maybe, in the case of Dan and Beard, for example, he is preparing to rule out rather than rule in: to the extent that they will simply be categorised as 4th/5th choice.

This sort of tour, with so many on jamboree absence, is a chance for fringe players if any are good enough to take it. They can also fall deeper down the ranking. Many would be disappointed if Hill and Atkinson did not step up. Others, like Willis and Roebuck look destined to enhance their reputations.

[loudnconfident]

Watching live there were a few things. IFW was a red all day long. Not need for yellow. Yoy heard the contact ring around stadium.

Willis was good. Atkinson looked good when we used him.

Spencer seemed quick with ball but his accuracy was poor.

Ford kicked way too much and quite badly at times.

We didn’t commit their ruck defenders anywhere near enough.

The ref was pretty poor. Last scrumming was a joke. France were offside at every single kick off, by quite some distance!

Spencer should have gone off. He was all over the place post rhe hit he took. Was properly wobbly! I have no idea how / why he stayed on.

6:2 made to look like a cunts choice. Which it was!

All spot on apart from the ref denigration. Was she bad really?

Watching live she seemed to be a bit off. Looked like another case of promoting people too early. But I will say that is live and thus without angles.

I find it hard to judge when at the game. (On TV I'm 100% right always).

I felt the 3 pens in a row against us early on - two instant maul offences - that led to the first French try were a bit odd.

[jngf]

Reasonable run out. Taught us nothing new but hopefully Borthers learnt something he should have already learnt by now… Namely Dombrandt and Slade are dreadful, Davidson should never have been picked ahead of AOF and Langdon is miles better than Dan.

Hopefully Dingwall, BCurry and Furbank are fit for the first test.

IFW had a mare. Hopefully he’s available for USA.

I actually thought both players had arguably one of their best performances to date in an England shirt. I’ve been very critical of Slade’s selection, especially in recent seasons but I genuinely thought he had a very good game and credit where credit’s due imo

[Captainhaircut]

Reasonable run out. Taught us nothing new but hopefully Borthers learnt something he should have already learnt by now… Namely Dombrandt and Slade are dreadful, Davidson should never have been picked ahead of AOF and Langdon is miles better than Dan.

Hopefully Dingwall, BCurry and Furbank are fit for the first test.

IFW had a mare. Hopefully he’s available for USA.

I actually thought both players had arguably one of their best performances to date in an England shirt. I’ve been very critical of Slade’s selection, especially in recent seasons but I genuinely thought he had a very good game and credit where credit’s due imo

The stats have Dombrandt making 3 carries in 36 minutes. Willis made 16 in 54. Think he had one decent carry and one turnover versus one knock on in a great position and the massive overrun on kick chase that almost cost us a try. I’ll not count the walk in whilst standing on the wing…

Slade just makes the wrong decision most of the time. Which is insane with his experience and talent. Couple of good touch finders (not sure Ford would have done that much worse) but other than that it was an intercept where we should have made a line break (fortunate to have penalty advantage- not sure anyone knew) and that dreadful decision where he went himself rather than passing to Quirke. On top of that, he often just shovelled the ball on without going to the line. If Dingwall, Atkinson or Ojomoh are our options at 12, then 13 really needs to be more of a runner given their distribution skills.

I thought Roebuck was good again- I really think Freeman at 13 is the way to go.

[Banquo]

Reasonable run out. Taught us nothing new but hopefully Borthers learnt something he should have already learnt by now… Namely Dombrandt and Slade are dreadful, Davidson should never have been picked ahead of AOF and Langdon is miles better than Dan.

Hopefully Dingwall, BCurry and Furbank are fit for the first test.

IFW had a mare. Hopefully he’s available for USA.

I actually thought both players had arguably one of their best performances to date in an England shirt. I’ve been very critical of Slade’s selection, especially in recent seasons but I genuinely thought he had a very good game and credit where credit’s due imo

Slade kicked well for the corner, but otherwise wavered between anonymous and shit.

[Banquo]

Can you detail those crucial moments? Cos it seems to me that if you were such a fan before, you must have ignored them?

I'm not a fan but someone has to take over from George eventually. Not picking George is more important than picking Dan with the future in mind. I'd just switch attention to one of the alternatives.

While George is still showing such form, I'm in favour of picking him. He's just such a clever player on the pitch - first to a loose ball, first to spot a break and get in support, first to spot an underresourced ruck and join in to save our ball. It's no surprise that he was the first person to notice Spencer was down at the end of the first half and step in at 9 to secure the ball.

Yes, he can't go on forever, but I'd rather make him the target that the younger heads need to outmatch, rather than just gift someone caps without making them fix their deficiencies.


Speaking of Spencer, what an absolute turd of a performance that was. Again. Didn't kick the leather off it this time, thankfully, but some of those passes made me wish that he did. By the end, Ford had stopped running onto the ball because every time he tried, Spencer passed it behind him to stop him in his tracks.

Puja

I'm in the school of not dropping anyone until there is someone at least as good; if the at least as good person is younger, crack on. If George is still the best starting hooker we have, and I think he probably is, then play him.

Spencer I agree with, though I would say (again) that we committed zero French defenders to the breakdown, because the forwards weren't going forward. So as a 9, running ruck to ruck sideways at best, and back a lot, doesn't make you look that good. Though he was shit.

[Banquo]

Reasonable run out. Taught us nothing new but hopefully Borthers learnt something he should have already learnt by now… Namely Dombrandt and Slade are dreadful, Davidson should never have been picked ahead of AOF and Langdon is miles better than Dan.

Hopefully Dingwall, BCurry and Furbank are fit for the first test.

IFW had a mare. Hopefully he’s available for USA.

I actually thought both players had arguably one of their best performances to date in an England shirt. I’ve been very critical of Slade’s selection, especially in recent seasons but I genuinely thought he had a very good game and credit where credit’s due imo

The stats have Dombrandt making 3 carries in 36 minutes. Willis made 16 in 54. Think he had one decent carry and one turnover versus one knock on in a great position and the massive overrun on kick chase that almost cost us a try. I’ll not count the walk in whilst standing on the wing…

Slade just makes the wrong decision most of the time. Which is insane with his experience and talent. Couple of good touch finders (not sure Ford would have done that much worse) but other than that it was an intercept where we should have made a line break (fortunate to have penalty advantage- not sure anyone knew) and that dreadful decision where he went himself rather than passing to Quirke. On top of that, he often just shovelled the ball on without going to the line. If Dingwall, Atkinson or Ojomoh are our options at 12, then 13 really needs to be more of a runner given their distribution skills.

I thought Roebuck was good again- I really think Freeman at 13 is the way to go.

This, tho Freeman has to somehow get some non-international game time at 13...he needs to learn to defend there if nothing else.

[Mikey Brown]

I still think George should be used as a security blanket off the bench and allow us to see if Dan or Langdon can actually do it from the start.

Dan has almost as many caps as Dombrandt, someone we are saying has already had far too many chances without showing a great deal, but I can’t remember if he’s had any starts or not. I feel like we could easily go another season or two of him coming off the bench and just sort of being there, without learning much or developing anyone else.

I honestly preferred Blamire, but that ship has sailed.

I also really liked having George’s leadership in the closing minutes of a tight game.

[FKAS]

I honestly preferred Blamire, but that ship has sailed.

Why, he's only 27. His lineout accuracy has tended to be his achillies heel. If he could improve that over the summer and next season with Tigers he might find his way back in.

I'd have liked to have seen Seb Blake in the squad personally. Very good at lineout time and good around the park. Still developing a bit but he's a unit.

[Danno]

I honestly preferred Blamire, but that ship has sailed.

I'd have liked to have seen Seb Blake in the squad personally. Very good at lineout time and good around the park. Still developing a bit but he's a unit.

He's going to have to transfer from Glos first