1872 Cup Champions

[AL.]

bit fucking strong......









take it, sadly.

[switchskier]

Hoyland has to make that pass though. Good from Weir and Watson to set him free but the white line fever was massive. He's evidently desperate to get a score.

If there's anyone i want to get that ball there it's Watson.

[Chunks Baws]

I love Hamish Watson. I'd let him pump my Mrs, if I had one.

[Matt Ha]

I love Hamish Watson. I'd let him pump my Mrs, if I had one.

How about your girlfriend? He really is a star. But Edinburgh were pretty awful for all but the last 20 minutes. Connacht would have been up at half time even if they had stayed in the changing room.

[Tobylerone]

I love Hamish Watson. I'd let him pump my Mrs, if I had one.

How about your girlfriend? Connacht would have been up at half time even if they had stayed in the changing room.

This is taking the hospitality package for a visiting team to a new level..

[Jps]

Interesting interview with Cockerel here: http://www.scotsman.com/sport/rugby-uni ... -1-4415087

The line here confuses me a little: "The Englishman promises to hand that mantle to the younger generation because “the senior players haven’t done the job”.

And the reason that confuses me is, other than Ford, who are the senior players in this squad who are fit? They're all very young. I think maybe that's the problem most of the time, the whole team is young.

[hp18]

Interesting interview with Cockerel here: http://www.scotsman.com/sport/rugby-uni ... -1-4415087

The line here confuses me a little: "The Englishman promises to hand that mantle to the younger generation because “the senior players haven’t done the job”.

And the reason that confuses me is, other than Ford, who are the senior players in this squad who are fit? They're all very young. I think maybe that's the problem most of the time, the whole team is young.

Your senior players pool is probably Ford, Gilchrist, Dickinson, MvInally, Hardie, CDP, Nel.

[Jps]

I suppose you're right, but I was discounting Nel, Dickinson and Hardie from his comments considering they'd been injured all year, but I guess he didn't put a time frame on it. I did add the "fit" caveat,

Gilchrist confuses me, and so does McKenzie, both seem to have plenty of talent, but just aren't consistent enough, and Gilchrist hasn't been close to the same since his last real injury

[whatisthejava]

i wonder how much the environment has affected some senior players, Dicko, Nel , Hardie , Watson have all came back to Edinburgh and done alot better

Ford, Gilchrist, Macinally, Brown, I still think would have done a hell of a lot better if he had left and had to fight for his place

Mackenzie has reverted

I think its quite strange for a coach to come in and say these things but Cockerill has the backing of the SRU and i kinda think the SRU are running out of patience at Edinburgh, might be time for another night of the long knifes and to kick some established names arses

[Adder]

Interesting interview with Cockerel here: http://www.scotsman.com/sport/rugby-uni ... -1-4415087

The line here confuses me a little: "The Englishman promises to hand that mantle to the younger generation because “the senior players haven’t done the job”.

And the reason that confuses me is, other than Ford, who are the senior players in this squad who are fit? They're all very young. I think maybe that's the problem most of the time, the whole team is young.

He also seems a lot more confident about the pack than the backs.

think the forward pack has a lot of potential. For whatever reason everyone tells me that it has not reached its potential but there are a lot of very good young players in there; [Magnus] Bradbury, [Jamie] Ritchie and Hamish Watson and there are some very good young second rows that are coming through, [Lewis] Carmichael in particular. There are some good young front rowers as well so I think there is a lot of potential there. “But I think that the back line has been a bit under-resourced and obviously Mark Bennett is coming into that (when fit), I think [Blair] Kinghorn is a very good player. But there needs to be a little more invested in the back line and that is what we are looking to do. But it’s not going to be a quick fix overnight.

[Big D]

Putting all the comments together that could be a dig at 10 and 12 (weir/tovey/burleigh) tbh. All experience pro's offering fuck all.

[Jps]

Putting all the comments together that could be a dig at 10 and 12 (weir/tovey/burleigh) tbh. All experience pro's offering fuck all.

And he wouldn't be at all wrong. I think Dean has played well at 13, but might be a more natural 12. Burleigh is on and off, but he's no more than a journeyman imo.

[Jps]

ALright, so bear with me for a minute, but what would it cost to bring in, or bring back the following players you all think: Hamitlon, Laidlaw, Denton, Visser or Maitland, Taylor?

Or maybe Brown and Hogg as older steady heads witin the squad? Both either start or are on the bench regularly for Sarries and Newcastle.

Some closer to the end than the beginning, some argauble about the regularity of their form, but what would it cost and could the SRU fund it? I know we have to keep producing younger talent, cause we only have 2 pro teams, but surely our other duty is produce the best team, the best Scottish team we can, and the experience and class those guys would offer would be immense.

Maybe I've had too much coffee and got froggy this morning, IDK, but how much more would Brown or Hogg cost than the Nasi Manu's or Fihaki's of the world? And suppose you could pick from a mid-field of Dean, Taylor & Bennet- I didn't even suggest bringing back Matt Scott, but I'd like to.

I suppose the answer is that they can't afford it or they might've done it already. And it still doesn't solve the problem of having no decent 10s

[Chunks Baws]

ALright, so bear with me for a minute, but what would it cost to bring in, or bring back the following players you all think: Hamitlon, Laidlaw, Denton, Visser or Maitland, Taylor?

Or maybe Brown and Hogg as older steady heads witin the squad? Both either start or are on the bench regularly for Sarries and Newcastle.

Some closer to the end than the beginning, some argauble about the regularity of their form, but what would it cost and could the SRU fund it? I know we have to keep producing younger talent, cause we only have 2 pro teams, but surely our other duty is produce the best team, the best Scottish team we can, and the experience and class those guys would offer would be immense.

Maybe I've had too much coffee and got froggy this morning, IDK, but how much more would Brown or Hogg cost than the Nasi Manu's or Fihaki's of the world? And suppose you could pick from a mid-field of Dean, Taylor & Bennet- I didn't even suggest bringing back Matt Scott, but I'd like to.

I suppose the answer is that they can't afford it or they might've done it already. And it still doesn't solve the problem of having no decent 10s

So just sign a load of guys that used to play for us? How forward thinking of you.

Anyway.....Hamilton is off to LI. Laidlaw recently signed for Clermont. Denton is only in his second year at Bath and has struggled with injuries. Visser is doing well at Quins and has improved his game down there, for Scotland's sake I'd rather he stayed. Maitland and Taylor play for the top side in Europe,why the f@ck would they come to Edinburgh? Brown is 34 and has just announced his retirement. Hogg is also 34, don't see the point. Matt Scott is only in his first season at Glaws, and has improved his game (see Visser).

Aside from all that, the only one we could probably afford is Ally Hogg.

[Jps]

I think my general sentiment was how much would it cost to field the best Scottish side we could and when or if will the SRU show the interest in doing so, and yes if they happen to have played for us before, so much the better.

I'm just sick of them letting the pro sides not receive the appropriate levels of investment to be the best they can be, while understanding that we have to continue to promote young players. The Irish seem to manage it well enough by not flogging the best at Munster or Leinster on the ocassions that they don't have to while still knocking off nearly a first choice team from other clubs- see Glasgow last weekend.

And as this is the Edinburgh thread, yea I'd much rather Visser played for Edinburgh than Quins. You just can't convince me that and Edinburgh squad with Brown or Hogg in it would've been less well off in the twilight of their best days, while understanding that English sides can offer a good deal more to those players to be squad guys.

So, would the SRU sooner try to field a 3rd side, reinforce the two they have or just let the status quo bump along. My guess is let the status quo bump along and find guys like Manu or Fihaki, who can't be on all the money in the world.

[Big D]

I think my general sentiment was how much would it cost to field the best Scottish side we could and when or if will the SRU show the interest in doing so, and yes if they happen to have played for us before, so much the better.

I'm just sick of them letting the pro sides not receive the appropriate levels of investment to be the best they can be, while understanding that we have to continue to promote young players. The Irish seem to manage it well enough by not flogging the best at Munster or Leinster on the ocassions that they don't have to while still knocking off nearly a first choice team from other clubs- see Glasgow last weekend.

And as this is the Edinburgh thread, yea I'd much rather Visser played for Edinburgh than Quins. You just can't convince me that and Edinburgh squad with Brown or Hogg in it would've been less well off in the twilight of their best days, while understanding that English sides can offer a good deal more to those players to be squad guys.

So, would the SRU sooner try to field a 3rd side, reinforce the two they have or just let the status quo bump along. My guess is let the status quo bump along and find guys like Manu or Fihaki, who can't be on all the money in the world.

How much money do you think the SRU have? They have been blatantly open and honest that the funds for the pro sides are dangerously close to maxing out hence the SGM. They have zero interest in a 3rd pro side because they can only just afford the two plus the academy.

The SRU are responsible for a damn sight more than the 2 pro sides. So whilst you might be sick of the SRU not spending outwith their means and hurting their member clubs I am quite grateful that they know when to stop. Scottish Rugby cannot be bankrupted to maybe win a few trophies.

Even now, when they practically begged members to let them seek external investment due to lack of funds they have appointed quality head coaches for the pro sides and handed out allegedly the two biggest contracts in SRU history to Hogg and Nel.

Guys like Manu? A super rugby winning captain? Manu was a high pedigree signing who has been unlucky with injuries.

Brown has been in the best possible situation for himself at saracens. There is literally no chance he'd have given that up. He's at the best club in Europe, been allowed to coach and they have a proven record of promoting from within.

[whatisthejava]

I was thinking this on the way to work this morning

I reckon scottish rugby is probably the healthiest its been since the professionalism, we still have a long way to go but i think its looking a hell of alot better than it did 10 years ago.

I really hope with Toonie, Rennie and Cockerill the status quo of mediocrity is removed, really interested to see the first few signings that Cockerill and Rennie make, my gut feel is Cockerill will bring in some old heads from down south and Rennie will look to bring in a couple of project players

Edinburgh need some players who wont accept half arsed training sessions and lack of commitment , Glasgow need some more squad players who will push the first XV for starting positions

[Jps]

I think my general sentiment was how much would it cost to field the best Scottish side we could and when or if will the SRU show the interest in doing so, and yes if they happen to have played for us before, so much the better.

I'm just sick of them letting the pro sides not receive the appropriate levels of investment to be the best they can be, while understanding that we have to continue to promote young players. The Irish seem to manage it well enough by not flogging the best at Munster or Leinster on the ocassions that they don't have to while still knocking off nearly a first choice team from other clubs- see Glasgow last weekend.

And as this is the Edinburgh thread, yea I'd much rather Visser played for Edinburgh than Quins. You just can't convince me that and Edinburgh squad with Brown or Hogg in it would've been less well off in the twilight of their best days, while understanding that English sides can offer a good deal more to those players to be squad guys.

So, would the SRU sooner try to field a 3rd side, reinforce the two they have or just let the status quo bump along. My guess is let the status quo bump along and find guys like Manu or Fihaki, who can't be on all the money in the world.

How much money do you think the SRU have? They have been blatantly open and honest that the funds for the pro sides are dangerously close to maxing out hence the SGM. They have zero interest in a 3rd pro side because they can only just afford the two plus the academy.

The SRU are responsible for a damn sight more than the 2 pro sides. So whilst you might be sick of the SRU not spending outwith their means and hurting their member clubs I am quite grateful that they know when to stop. Scottish Rugby cannot be bankrupted to maybe win a few trophies.

Even now, when they practically begged members to let them seek external investment due to lack of funds they have appointed quality head coaches for the pro sides and handed out allegedly the two biggest contracts in SRU history to Hogg and Nel.

Guys like Manu? A super rugby winning captain? Manu was a high pedigree signing who has been unlucky with injuries.

Brown has been in the best possible situation for himself at saracens. There is literally no chance he'd have given that up. He's at the best club in Europe, been allowed to coach and they have a proven record of promoting from within.

I was having a fit of pique, and considering Manu has made like 16 appearances in 2 years, and he is now headed to Treviso, I wouldn't call him the most valuable signing we've ever had.

I remember reading recently that the SRU's overdraft was the lowest it's been in, well ever since Murrayfield was redeveloped.

I do think we're in good hands, I'm just exhausted with the losing, especially with the way we played in the pool stages, and the way they play when the pressure is off.

With guys like Denton, it's no shock that we let him go since Bath were willing to pay a transfer fee, the same way Nakawara was let go by Glasgow, although he's apparently not having any fun at Racing.

I think my question is: What are our real, long term prospects?

[Big D]

I think my general sentiment was how much would it cost to field the best Scottish side we could and when or if will the SRU show the interest in doing so, and yes if they happen to have played for us before, so much the better.

I'm just sick of them letting the pro sides not receive the appropriate levels of investment to be the best they can be, while understanding that we have to continue to promote young players. The Irish seem to manage it well enough by not flogging the best at Munster or Leinster on the ocassions that they don't have to while still knocking off nearly a first choice team from other clubs- see Glasgow last weekend.

And as this is the Edinburgh thread, yea I'd much rather Visser played for Edinburgh than Quins. You just can't convince me that and Edinburgh squad with Brown or Hogg in it would've been less well off in the twilight of their best days, while understanding that English sides can offer a good deal more to those players to be squad guys.

So, would the SRU sooner try to field a 3rd side, reinforce the two they have or just let the status quo bump along. My guess is let the status quo bump along and find guys like Manu or Fihaki, who can't be on all the money in the world.

How much money do you think the SRU have? They have been blatantly open and honest that the funds for the pro sides are dangerously close to maxing out hence the SGM. They have zero interest in a 3rd pro side because they can only just afford the two plus the academy.

The SRU are responsible for a damn sight more than the 2 pro sides. So whilst you might be sick of the SRU not spending outwith their means and hurting their member clubs I am quite grateful that they know when to stop. Scottish Rugby cannot be bankrupted to maybe win a few trophies.

Even now, when they practically begged members to let them seek external investment due to lack of funds they have appointed quality head coaches for the pro sides and handed out allegedly the two biggest contracts in SRU history to Hogg and Nel.

Guys like Manu? A super rugby winning captain? Manu was a high pedigree signing who has been unlucky with injuries.

Brown has been in the best possible situation for himself at saracens. There is literally no chance he'd have given that up. He's at the best club in Europe, been allowed to coach and they have a proven record of promoting from within.

I was having a fit of pique, and considering Manu has made like 16 appearances in 2 years, and he is now headed to Treviso, I wouldn't call him the most valuable signing we've ever had.

I remember reading recently that the SRU's overdraft was the lowest it's been in, well ever since Murrayfield was redeveloped.

I do think we're in good hands, I'm just exhausted with the losing, especially with the way we played in the pool stages, and the way they play when the pressure is off.

With guys like Denton, it's no shock that we let him go since Bath were willing to pay a transfer fee, the same way Nakawara was let go by Glasgow, although he's apparently not having any fun at Racing.

I think my question is: What are our real, long term prospects?

Long term Pro sides will be relyo g on excellent coaching and recruitment within a strict budget or outside investment. That's ultimately it. The SRU can't continue to increase funding for the sides in line with player wage inflation which according to Dodson is unreal (can't remember the future, I did post it on the SGM thread).

The overdraught IIRC was largely reduced/cleared when BT got involved.

[whatisthejava]

An interesting article in the independent.ie (Fuck knows how i found it) but they were basically saying that Sarries are fooked if Nigel Wray dies, Toulouse are screwed, Stade Franc are screwed, Wasps have something like £40 million debt and the author was saying that the bubble must burst.

While all bubbles will burst im not convinced that sport is a bubble as the consumer will always pay more or we are so far from peak bubble burst moment that we may not see it for a long long time, Sky and BT sport keep growing and therefore keep pumping more and more money into sport.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/o ... 98261.html


In the short to medium term SRU must stay the course, increasing the academies system,

Longer term Glasgow and Glasgow council seem interested in extending scotsoun, if that happens and they grow to a 10 then a 15K capacity then I think the possibility of a sugar daddy coming in and buying Glasgow increases.

With the academy system producing and a good coach at Edinburgh I dont see why n 3 - 5 years Edinburgh couldnt be looking to extend Myreside or move again but i dont think we will see a 3rd pro team in scotland until the circumstances change very dramatically

[Adder]

Edinburgh have resigned Gilchrist for another 2 years.
http://www.edinburghrugby.org/news/17/0 ... urgh-rugby

Sent from my SM-J500FN using Tapatalk

[Mikey Brown]

Doesn't seem that inspiring going by what you lot have been saying about his form. Maybe the Toulon move would have sparked something in him, but if Cockerill can get more out of him he could still be a massive asset. Scotland don't seem to be blessed with a lot of leaders or real lineout wizards.

[AL.]

Off to pub shortly, anyone have an idea if today's match is being streamed anywhere?

[hugh_woatmeigh]

Off to pub shortly, anyone have an idea if today's match is being streamed anywhere?

Not for UK viewers. Eurosport for Italians - so a stream may be kicking around online.

[AL.]

Off to pub shortly, anyone have an idea if today's match is being streamed anywhere?

Not for UK viewers. Eurosport for Italians - so a stream may be kicking around online.

At pub, dead in here and football is on.....oh well.

I find finding a stream a pain in the ass nowadays, do you know a reliable one instead of one that bounces you from ad to ad before fucking you off?