America

[Digby]

But whilst I might say I hear you, what resources, what ideas?

[OptimisticJock]

I knew arming the teachers and other staff was the answer.

"If you had a teacher who was adept at firearms," he said, "they could very well end the attack very quickly."

Well done Trump.

What if there was more than one attacker, and they targeted the teachers as well as the kids?

"We'll arm the students too," he replied, "Obama didn't have the balls to do it, but I've got the balls. The biggest and best balls." he continued

One of the above quotes is fake news, but it's not immediately obvious which one.

Do we have a figure for accepted amount of kids shot in the crossfire?

[Mikey Brown]

Christ. What a fucking mess.

I’d not even considered the point above that all it really means as a teacher if you are given a gun (and you’d hope some sort of training) is that you are guaranteed to be the first person shot by the next nut job that tries this.

That’s assuming they’re not expected to be teaching gun-in-hand at all times.

[WaspInWales]

How about this for an endorsement for the NRA?


The man is a complete idiot.

[WaspInWales]

And a contradiction:


Complains about fake news saying he wants to give guns to teachers when he never said that. He said he wanted to give guns to gun adept teachers.

Fucking hell.

[Which Tyler]

Is he actually aware that 20% of teachers... are still fucking teachers!

[WaspInWales]

Is he actually aware that 20% of teachers... are still fucking teachers!

No, they're gun adept teachers. Bigly difference.

[WaspInWales]

Can you imagine what teacher training in the US could be like in the future?

"So, what teaching post are you considering applying for...math, science, art?"

"Oh none of those, I want to be one of those gun adept teachers".

Probably should add a yeehaw and some 'U-S-A' in there somewhere too.

[morepork]

This is just repulsive. What sort of fucked up civilised society indulges a pro-gun lobby group with tax free charity status and allows their law makers to be bullied into doing the things that data the world over has shown acts to prevent mass shooting incidents?

[Digby]

Have we agreed with any future deranged shooters they will wait to ascertain upon entering a classroom that (a) they've found one of the 1/5 teachers trained and armed and (b) they'll give them time to draw out a concealed weapon?

I didn't know if he'd manage to trump the stupidity of the wall, but Trump has managed to clear that bar with ease with this idea.

[Sandydragon]

Is he actually aware that 20% of teachers... are still fucking teachers!

Special forces teachers?

To be fair I had a teacher who could hit you clean in th head with a blackboard duster from across the class room. Crack shot she was, could probably stop a gun man in his tracks wth a box file.

[Which Tyler]

I'm not sure who I feel more sorry for?
The poor sod of a teacher who's expected to shoot somone during the next school massacre.
The poor sod of a teacher who gets his gun nicked whilst having a kip after lunch.
Class 3B after they've pushed teacher just that little bit too far.



ETA: Snapshot of Trump's notes at the meeting with the schoolchildren:

He seems to need a reminder to say "I hear you"

[WaspInWales]

He has 45 embroidered on to his cuffs ffs!

Do Presidents usually do that?

[morepork]

The nonsense coming out of this fat cunts mouth. A horribly unsubtle attempt to play all sides, peppered with senseless hyperbole ("tremendous progress...great things...the best people") and seasoned with sound bytes that parrot the NRA. What the fuck is wrong with these people???

[WaspInWales]

The nonsense coming out of this fat cunts mouth. A horribly unsubtle attempt to play all sides, peppered with senseless hyperbole ("tremendous progress...great things...the best people") and seasoned with sound bytes that parrot the NRA. What the fuck is wrong with these people???

Trump's a busted flush MP.

Most people can see that. I say most, but alarmingly, he seemingly still has some support among the masses.

The sound bytes are generic and can be interchanged at will. This week, there is nothing more important than children, but change children for coal, tax savings, jobs, border security, name of state, or country (if relating to foreign affairs only), being a teacher and just about any other issue and there we have Trump's latest sound byte.

Most people know that Trump is being played by those around him. Trump doesn't. He really thinks he is there on merit and deserves to be there. Every time he opens his mouth or has a Twitter tantrum, it becomes a little more obvious that he isn't calling the shots. I mean, who the fuck needs a cue card when speaking to kids after the horror of being caught up in a mass shooting where their friends have died, and then Tweet that the NRA are good people? Who?

This is how things are going backfire.

Trump has no empathy, or real connection with the things he touts. He thinks he does, but he is just repeating the shit he is told. He always has. If he had more intelligence, and was able to accept his place in proceedings, his administration would have more chance of succeeding. More intelligence to 'play' the press, not need cue cards and being able to spell, he'd be right up there on public opinion, but it's plainly obvious that the man is too thick, or just totally deluded of his own ability to deal with people/anything.

The midterms could be a real eye-opener for him, but again, he lacks the intelligence to deal with the potential set-back. If it goes to shit for the GOP, he'll be blaming the fake news...but by then, those who are calling the shots will probably want nothing more to do with the fat cunt.

I honestly believe the man is a simpleton, and you never go full retard, but he has gone above and beyond.

The other possibility is Mueller coming up 'trumps' on Trump. I still can't see that happening though. Fringe players are being indicted and possibly striking deals, but unless Mueller has a look at Trump/Kushner finances, I can't see the big boys being particularly bothered.

[cashead]

He has 45 embroidered on to his cuffs ffs!

Do Presidents usually do that?

I've never seen it before, but I'd never looked out for it either. A quick GIS of Dubya and Barack the Islamic Shock shows cuffs with no visible embroidery on them, so draw your own conclusions.

[morepork]

The nonsense coming out of this fat cunts mouth. A horribly unsubtle attempt to play all sides, peppered with senseless hyperbole ("tremendous progress...great things...the best people") and seasoned with sound bytes that parrot the NRA. What the fuck is wrong with these people???

Trump's a busted flush MP.

Most people can see that. I say most, but alarmingly, he seemingly still has some support among the masses.

The sound bytes are generic and can be interchanged at will. This week, there is nothing more important than children, but change children for coal, tax savings, jobs, border security, name of state, or country (if relating to foreign affairs only), being a teacher and just about any other issue and there we have Trump's latest sound byte.

Most people know that Trump is being played by those around him. Trump doesn't. He really thinks he is there on merit and deserves to be there. Every time he opens his mouth or has a Twitter tantrum, it becomes a little more obvious that he isn't calling the shots. I mean, who the fuck needs a cue card when speaking to kids after the horror of being caught up in a mass shooting where their friends have died, and then Tweet that the NRA are good people? Who?

This is how things are going backfire.

Trump has no empathy, or real connection with the things he touts. He thinks he does, but he is just repeating the shit he is told. He always has. If he had more intelligence, and was able to accept his place in proceedings, his administration would have more chance of succeeding. More intelligence to 'play' the press, not need cue cards and being able to spell, he'd be right up there on public opinion, but it's plainly obvious that the man is too thick, or just totally deluded of his own ability to deal with people/anything.

The midterms could be a real eye-opener for him, but again, he lacks the intelligence to deal with the potential set-back. If it goes to shit for the GOP, he'll be blaming the fake news...but by then, those who are calling the shots will probably want nothing more to do with the fat cunt.

I honestly believe the man is a simpleton, and you never go full retard, but he has gone above and beyond.


The other possibility is Mueller coming up 'trumps' on Trump. I still can't see that happening though. Fringe players are being indicted and possibly striking deals, but unless Mueller has a look at Trump/Kushner finances, I can't see the big boys being particularly bothered.

I know man. I know. In the meantime he oozes a complete lack of informed leadership on issues that he is completely out of his depth in. His social media tirades are just outrageously inappropriate.

[SerjeantWildgoose]

I wonder if anybody has bothered to consider what the outcome will be when one of these armed teachers wakes up one morning and thinks their life will be fixed if they go to work and shoot a few kids?

There are around 3.2 million professional school teachers in the US. If 20% of them are armed then that means 640,000 of them are taking a gun to school every day.

The incidence of PTSD in the general population of the US is estimated at between 7-8%, which can be extrapolated to suggest that somewhere between 44,800 and 51,200 people would be walking into American schools every morning armed with a weapon and some form of mental disorder.

But wait! If the intent is to concentrate the carriage of guns into a 20% of "gun-adept teachers with military or special training experience," then the incidence of PTSD in the military population must be taken into consideration. According to peer-reviewed research (Psychological Services Vol9, No4, 361-382 (2012)) the prevalence of PTSD among former Servicemen and women who have served in recent conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan is between 14-16%. This would suggest that between 89,600 and 102,400 people would be walking into school in the US every morning armed with a weapon, a mental disorder and military training!

Has he thought this through?

[Digby]

Has he thought this through?

Duh, the bad teachers will go to the schools that aren't white majority.

[rowan]

The problem is that American politics is subject to open bribery and the NRA is a major donor during campaigning. Same reason Washington will always support Israel and Saudi regardless how many war crimes they commit. Truth is, the oligarchs pulling the strings do not care about the victims of mass shootings any more than they care about the millions who have died as a result of American-backed wars. In fact, a violent society is precisely what they want in order to achieve their objective of world hegemony. The desensitization process and glorification of war begins early with TV, film and video war-games, and is an ongoing process throughout the average American's life, as they spend more time in front of a screen, by far, than they do in the education system. Mass shootings are a by-product of America's warmongering ideology.

[Which Tyler]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-43164634
So... there was a trained, armed officer at the school - who arrived at the building, hung around for a bit, and wandered off again

He said video footage showed Mr Peterson arriving at the building where the shooting was taking place about 90 seconds after the first shots were fired and that he remained outside for about four minutes. The attack lasted six minutes, Sheriff Israel said.

I do'nt particularly like hanging the officer up to dry like that without hearing his story, but it's still pretty damning.

Nevermind though, I'm also sure that random Geography teacher #3 would have been so much better.

What a world we are living when the answer to the question "How we we stop guns being fired in schools?" is "Let's put more guns in schools."
Takes a real fucking genious (or more likely, sociopath) to come up with that one!

[Which Tyler]

I wonder if anybody has bothered to consider what the outcome will be when one of these armed teachers wakes up one morning and thinks their life will be fixed if they go to work and shoot a few kids?

There are around 3.2 million professional school teachers in the US. If 20% of them are armed then that means 640,000 of them are taking a gun to school every day.

The incidence of PTSD in the general population of the US is estimated at between 7-8%, which can be extrapolated to suggest that somewhere between 44,800 and 51,200 people would be walking into American schools every morning armed with a weapon and some form of mental disorder.

But wait! If the intent is to concentrate the carriage of guns into a 20% of "gun-adept teachers with military or special training experience," then the incidence of PTSD in the military population must be taken into consideration. According to peer-reviewed research (Psychological Services Vol9, No4, 361-382 (2012)) the prevalence of PTSD among former Servicemen and women who have served in recent conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan is between 14-16%. This would suggest that between 89,600 and 102,400 people would be walking into school in the US every morning armed with a weapon, a mental disorder and military training!

Has he thought this through?

Very, very good post; not "like" worthy - as there's very little to actually like in this.
I'm gonna nick your stats though

[Stones of granite]

I wonder if anybody has bothered to consider what the outcome will be when one of these armed teachers wakes up one morning and thinks their life will be fixed if they go to work and shoot a few kids?

There are around 3.2 million professional school teachers in the US. If 20% of them are armed then that means 640,000 of them are taking a gun to school every day.

The incidence of PTSD in the general population of the US is estimated at between 7-8%, which can be extrapolated to suggest that somewhere between 44,800 and 51,200 people would be walking into American schools every morning armed with a weapon and some form of mental disorder.

But wait! If the intent is to concentrate the carriage of guns into a 20% of "gun-adept teachers with military or special training experience," then the incidence of PTSD in the military population must be taken into consideration. According to peer-reviewed research (Psychological Services Vol9, No4, 361-382 (2012)) the prevalence of PTSD among former Servicemen and women who have served in recent conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan is between 14-16%. This would suggest that between 89,600 and 102,400 people would be walking into school in the US every morning armed with a weapon, a mental disorder and military training!

Has he thought this through?

Very, very good post; not "like" worthy - as there's very little to actually like in this.
I'm gonna nick your stats though

I'm not sure those stats are correct. I'm sure that I read somewhere that something like 75% of teachers suffer from work-related stress, so I think it could be worse than the old gander suggests.

[OptimisticJock]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-43164634
So... there was a trained, armed officer at the school - who arrived at the building, hung around for a bit, and wandered off again

He said video footage showed Mr Peterson arriving at the building where the shooting was taking place about 90 seconds after the first shots were fired and that he remained outside for about four minutes. The attack lasted six minutes, Sheriff Israel said.

I do'nt particularly like hanging the officer up to dry like that without hearing his story, but it's still pretty damning.

Nevermind though, I'm also sure that random Geography teacher #3 would have been so much better.

What a world we are living when the answer to the question "How we we stop guns being fired in schools?" is "Let's put more guns in schools."
Takes a real fucking genious (or more likely, sociopath) to come up with that one!

There are an awful lot of people gobbing off about a guy not trained for a tactical scenario like that not going in blind, by himself and killing someone armed with a superior weapon system. Most of the people I've read gobbing off have absolutely no concept or training of what it takes to do undertake combat OBUA (lets be under no illusions as thats what this effectively was) as a well drilled and equiped unit let alone as a person armed with nothing more than a pistol.

[OptimisticJock]

Is he actually aware that 20% of teachers... are still fucking teachers!

Special forces teachers?

To be fair I had a teacher who could hit you clean in th head with a blackboard duster from across the class room. Crack shot she was, could probably stop a gun man in his tracks wth a box file.

Selection is a bit much. Surely Juniors would do.

In fact, why not just get Brecon trained soldiers to teach? They've been taught how to deliver lessons and are proficient in infantry tactics and weapon systems.