RugbyRebels

Please, for pity's sake, call time on Mike Brown's international career.

All the quins looked fecked. Both mentally and physically

padprop wrote:Genge was poor, got roasted in the scrum and seemed to go off script from the team whenever he gets the ball

Robshaw as awful, I know its just a baabaas game but surely his positon must be under threat. Hes just not athletic enough.

Daly again proving that he is our best back

Wilson good when he came on, but should have been for Robshaw

Mercer good.

Robson was poor, and I really hope it was just a blip performance.

Agreed on all of that. I thought Curry and Singleton were decent.

Test match or not, conceding 9 tries is unforgivable.

I’d normally defend Robshaw as he gets way more stick than he deserves, but today he was shocking. He was nowhere near on those missed tackles.

Didn't get to see the game. Seems an entertaining one!

Just wondering how the Worcester boys did?

How did Singleton do? Did Schonert get on at all?

Scrumhead wrote:

padprop wrote:Genge was poor, got roasted in the scrum and seemed to go off script from the team whenever he gets the ball

Robshaw as awful, I know its just a baabaas game but surely his positon must be under threat. Hes just not athletic enough.

Daly again proving that he is our best back

Wilson good when he came on, but should have been for Robshaw

Mercer good.

Robson was poor, and I really hope it was just a blip performance.

Agreed on all of that. I thought Curry and Singleton were decent.

Test match or not, conceding 9 tries is unforgivable.

I’d normally defend Robshaw as he gets way more stick than he deserves, but today he was shocking. He was nowhere near on those missed tackles.

Stupid game imo.

Warrior85 wrote:Didn't get to see the game. Seems an entertaining one!

Just wondering how the Worcester boys did?

How did Singleton do? Did Schonert get on at all?

Singleton went very well. Didn’t see much of Schonert - not really a game for a scrummaging prop.

Robshaw. Quite simply appalling!! Truly spectacularly shite!

Just the 63 points shipped, a defence coach wouldn't be in demand if this kept up

Poor old Robshaw. Just got pasted. None of the loosies from either side had to make that many tackles, but man, he missed all of his but one. According to ESPN stats the territory and possession was pretty even, but the Babas made over twice the metres. Tuisova made 214, while Mike brown made....1. The lack of penetration from the English forwards when the set piece was taken out of consideration (not a real test match, I understand) will have made a young, keen Bok pack take some serious notice I think. Rassie Erasmus has selected 17 new caps in the wider Bok squad, and has recalled some old guard (Bismarck du Plessis, Duane Vermeulen, Frans Steyn[!]) to balance it. If their centres get some go forward, the English backs will have a tough time. Damian de Allende is a freak. You so need loose forwards that are up for it it's not funny. Well, it's kind of funny.

I forgot to record it. Worth finding a replay? How was Vito?

morepork wrote:Poor old Robshaw. Just got pasted. None of the loosies from either side had to make that many tackles, but man, he missed all of his but one. According to ESPN stats the territory and possession was pretty even, but the Babas made over twice the metres. Tuisova made 214, while Mike brown made....1. The lack of penetration from the English forwards when the set piece was taken out of consideration (not a real test match, I understand) will have made a young, keen Bok pack take some serious notice I think. Rassie Erasmus has selected 17 new caps in the wider Bok squad, and has recalled some old guard (Bismarck du Plessis, Duane Vermeulen, Frans Steyn[!]) to balance it. If their centres get some go forward, the English backs will have a tough time. Damian de Allende is a freak. You so need loose forwards that are up for it it's not funny. Well, it's kind of funny.

Given that the pack were missing Vunipola, George, Itoje, and Vunipola, I suspect there's not too much that the Boks will draw from that forward performance. Well, apart from Robshaw looking miles off the pace - I'm usually a fan, but he's been ground into the dirt by Quins both mentally and physically and should not be going on tour. Same for Brown.

I think the major thing that I learned from that game was that Josh Matavesi has a very weird laugh.

Puja

CONVEX HULL wrote:

Spiffy wrote:

Spiffy wrote:Quite an entertaining Sunday afternoon display of unopposed rugby.
Highlight of the first half - George Ford overhauling overrated "flyer" Ashton from behind with ease.

Highlight of the second half - George does it to him again.

http://www.rugbyworld.com/countries/fra ... cord-90935

Perhaps he was a bit tired after equalling the Top 14 record?

Fair play to Ashton - he is a very good try poacher with the knack of being in the right place at the right time. Just making the point that he is not actually all that fast. And he's not that good a defender either. He's been great in the Top 14. I don't expect to see him in an England shirt again, even if he returns from France. If Jones won't look at Wade, the best finisher in the PL, and a pretty tough defender now, he won't look at Ashton.

Lizard wrote:I forgot to record it. Worth finding a replay? How was Vito?

Got to express his inner globetrotter, mixed in with some solid close quarter work. Standard Victor really. Not strictly test animal but is really worth following around the park.

Spiffy wrote:

CONVEX HULL wrote:

Spiffy wrote:
Highlight of the second half - George does it to him again.

http://www.rugbyworld.com/countries/fra ... cord-90935

Perhaps he was a bit tired after equalling the Top 14 record?

Fair play to Ashton - he is a very good try poacher with the knack of being in the right place at the right time. Just making the point that he is not actually all that fast. And he's not that good a defender either. He's been great in the Top 14. I don't expect to see him in an England shirt again, even if he returns from France. If Jones won't look at Wade, the best finisher in the PL, and a pretty tough defender now, he won't look at Ashton.

Ashton's second try, from the chip, was a classic "fuck contact" reflex. It came off, but was flipping the coin really. Fair play to him, but not a chap you want in the foxhole.

Puja wrote:

morepork wrote:Poor old Robshaw. Just got pasted. None of the loosies from either side had to make that many tackles, but man, he missed all of his but one. According to ESPN stats the territory and possession was pretty even, but the Babas made over twice the metres. Tuisova made 214, while Mike brown made....1. The lack of penetration from the English forwards when the set piece was taken out of consideration (not a real test match, I understand) will have made a young, keen Bok pack take some serious notice I think. Rassie Erasmus has selected 17 new caps in the wider Bok squad, and has recalled some old guard (Bismarck du Plessis, Duane Vermeulen, Frans Steyn[!]) to balance it. If their centres get some go forward, the English backs will have a tough time. Damian de Allende is a freak. You so need loose forwards that are up for it it's not funny. Well, it's kind of funny.

Given that the pack were missing Vunipola, George, Itoje, and Vunipola, I suspect there's not too much that the Boks will draw from that forward performance. Well, apart from Robshaw looking miles off the pace - I'm usually a fan, but he's been ground into the dirt by Quins both mentally and physically and should not be going on tour. Same for Brown.

I think the major thing that I learned from that game was that Josh Matavesi has a very weird laugh.

Puja

Fair point, but there is a chance that the Bokke will be able to pull off a japan RWC upset, at least in the first test, if Erasmus is wise to it. The Robshaw and Brown holes are too big not to drive a bus through.

Given that none of the absent Saracens featured in the "Premiership Rugby Team of the Year", can we assume that England's team yesterday was the about the best that EJ can offer?

Spiffy wrote:

CONVEX HULL wrote:

Spiffy wrote:
Highlight of the second half - George does it to him again.

http://www.rugbyworld.com/countries/fra ... cord-90935

Perhaps he was a bit tired after equalling the Top 14 record?

Fair play to Ashton - he is a very good try poacher with the knack of being in the right place at the right time. Just making the point that he is not actually all that fast. And he's not that good a defender either. He's been great in the Top 14. I don't expect to see him in an England shirt again, even if he returns from France. If Jones won't look at Wade, the best finisher in the PL, and a pretty tough defender now, he won't look at Ashton.

Ashton scored a lot more tries than Wade last season, although I agree he won't play for England again. I not so sure that Sarries would be as welcoming to a returning Ashton as they have been for Strettle, either.

Likewise, if you just go on premiership statistics, Goode is a country mile ahead of Brown. But, whatever his other failings, Ashton was second to none when it comes to scoring tries in European club matches last season.

CONVEX HULL wrote:

Spiffy wrote:

CONVEX HULL wrote:

http://www.rugbyworld.com/countries/fra ... cord-90935

Perhaps he was a bit tired after equalling the Top 14 record?

Fair play to Ashton - he is a very good try poacher with the knack of being in the right place at the right time. Just making the point that he is not actually all that fast. And he's not that good a defender either. He's been great in the Top 14. I don't expect to see him in an England shirt again, even if he returns from France. If Jones won't look at Wade, the best finisher in the PL, and a pretty tough defender now, he won't look at Ashton.

Ashton scored a lot more tries than Wade last season, although I agree he won't play for England again. I not so sure that Sarries would be as welcoming to a returning Ashton as they have been for Strettle, either.

Likewise, if you just go on premiership statistics, Goode is a country mile ahead of Brown. But, whatever his other failings, Ashton was second to none when it comes to scoring tries in European club matches last season.

Sure. Ashton is a very good club wing. But just like Varndell, or Woodburn recently, he's not really international class.

"George Ford has admitted England’s record-breaking defeat at the hands of the Barbarians was “embarrassing” and questioned his side’s effort following a fourth successive loss under Eddie Jones.

England conceded their most points in 20 years and their most ever at Twickenham as Chris Ashton ran in a 22-minute hat-trick for the invitational side, who had been together only five days and had only three training sessions. England were without 15 players from Exeter and Saracens, who had contested the Premiership final 24 hours earlier, but missed 34 tackles and conceded nine tries in a first loss to the Barbarians since 2014.

Asked if the 63-45 loss was embarrassing, Ford – co-captain with Chris Robshaw for the day – said: “It is, yeah – it’s not great is it? We didn’t start well, some of the tries seemed like easy, soft scores. I know there were some great scores from the BaaBaas but defence is a mental thing, an effort thing, an attitude thing. We’re massively disappointed in the changing room. No matter what game you’re playing in, when you put the England shirt on you expect to be better than that.

“I don’t know if it’s confidence. It’s more a concentration, energy, attitude-type thing. We’ve definitely addressed some things defensively from the Six Nations in training but you have to make that come to life in a game. You can’t expect it to happen, so we have to question our effort there at times. We tried addressing it during the game, after the first score, the second score, at half-time. We said, ‘We need more life to us, more energy to us, more desire and hunger in defence’.”

I've never got the Ashton is the rapidest thing on Planet Earth thing. To see him unable to outpace Ford was hilarious and nailed that particular untruth. Fair dos though, he does know where to be at the crucial moment.

Stom wrote:

CONVEX HULL wrote:

Spiffy wrote:
Fair play to Ashton - he is a very good try poacher with the knack of being in the right place at the right time. Just making the point that he is not actually all that fast. And he's not that good a defender either. He's been great in the Top 14. I don't expect to see him in an England shirt again, even if he returns from France. If Jones won't look at Wade, the best finisher in the PL, and a pretty tough defender now, he won't look at Ashton.

Ashton scored a lot more tries than Wade last season, although I agree he won't play for England again. I not so sure that Sarries would be as welcoming to a returning Ashton as they have been for Strettle, either.

Likewise, if you just go on premiership statistics, Goode is a country mile ahead of Brown. But, whatever his other failings, Ashton was second to none when it comes to scoring tries in European club matches last season.

Sure. Ashton is a very good club wing. But just like Varndell, or Woodburn recently, he's not really international class.

You have to be more specific than that. He just scored a hat trick against england is that not international class by definition? His tackling isn't great but then other england regulars are pretty poor.

Cold light of day, Daly is class, Ford played well, Launchbury was busy, Curry very good and Mercer played well (no idea why he was taken off). Francis showed some class.

And Robshaw was horrific! Truly terrible. Like another level of shite altogether.

twitchy wrote:

Stom wrote:

CONVEX HULL wrote:
Ashton scored a lot more tries than Wade last season, although I agree he won't play for England again. I not so sure that Sarries would be as welcoming to a returning Ashton as they have been for Strettle, either.

Likewise, if you just go on premiership statistics, Goode is a country mile ahead of Brown. But, whatever his other failings, Ashton was second to none when it comes to scoring tries in European club matches last season.

Sure. Ashton is a very good club wing. But just like Varndell, or Woodburn recently, he's not really international class.

You have to be more specific than that. He just scored a hat trick against england is that not international class by definition? His tackling isn't great but then other england regulars are pretty poor.

One of those three was given to him to be fair.

His defence was its usual rubbish, his passing was iffy and his pace was slow.

He’s always been good at tracking finding gaps and finishing. Beyond that there’s little he offers.

If you are going to be a one trick pony, scoring tries is a pretty good trick.

Epaminondas Pules wrote:Cold light of day, Daly is class, Ford played well, Launchbury was busy, Curry very good and Mercer played well (no idea why he was taken off). Francis showed some class.

And Robshaw was horrific! Truly terrible. Like another level of shite altogether.

Ford and Francis were 2 of the main reasons we lost yesterday, their channel in defence was laughable. Francis had a couple of nice moments but the damage was done. We had pretty even possession and territory stats yet Ford as usual did nothing to manage the game in our favor.