RugbyRebels

Yep. Best possible result. Australia loses without the opposition looking at all threatening.

Our attack was awful. But both sides struggled to get quick ball.

Winning ugly is fine with me though. Holding our nerve was critical and we got that bloody monkey off our backs at last.

Attack was awful because we had no quick ball

This was down to 2 things - the forwards ability to create quick ball which is always an issue against Australia -That improved when Jenkins and Hill came on.

We also suffered from Gareth Davies inability/refusal to move the ball quickly. He almost got caught a couple of times with the "ball out" call from the back of the ruck.

If Were going to play Anscombe at 10, I really think we need T Williams starting. - I think we missed Webb yesterday.

On the plus side, we really are building up a very strong 23 and more than adequate cover in the wider squad. Things are definitely on the up.

I’d like Tomos Williams to get a start against Tonga. He did look sharper when he came on and deserves a start.

Oh yes. When we beat Scotland, we said "that won't be enough to beat Australia". It wasn't, but in the end it didn't take that much more. So now, we say yesterday's performance won't be enough to beat SA, Ireland or England. And it won't. But progress like we are making gives reason to believe that when those tests come, we might be ready. I want to see much more in attack obviously, but establishing the winning habit is paramount right now.

And against teams that don’t have Popper in the backrow, we should get a greater degree of quick ball.

It would help if our line out was operating properly but it has been good for a while now so I’m putting yesterday down to one of those days. Same with Halfpenny.


On a real positive we have competition in most positions, or at least we have a capable backup. None of our first XV can take their eye off the ball and there are a couple who could do with a prompt.

Sandydragon wrote:
On a real positive we have competition in most positions, or at least we have a capable backup.

That's just such a pleasant change, isn't it?

I could pick my preferred XXIII for SA now, see Gats pick virtually none of them, and still feel like we had a chance.

A couple of years ago I felt that this was the big difference between us and England (and to a lesser extent, Ireland). We had at least as many world class players as them - arguably more - but beneath that, at the "solid international" class, we had dramatically fewer. They could lose a chunk of their first XV and still be competitive. We would lose two or three stars and have no chance. In the modern game with injuries unavoidable, that's just not a sustainable situation.

You could argue that this current Wales squad is lower on true star-quality players than we have been recently; but there now seems to be a decently-sized core of quality professionals, who are good enough to keep us in with a chance in most games. It's very encouraging.

To my mind of thinking that is the best performance I have seen from Tipuric in International rugby, I have criticised his lack of tunrovers in the past, but to win MOM when playing against the most savvy breakdown operators there are speaks volumes.

A good if not altogether satisfying win, I'll be interested to see who he plays against Tonga.

Numbers wrote:To my mind of thinking that is the best performance I have seen from Tipuric in International rugby, I have criticised his lack of tunrovers in the past, but to win MOM when playing against the most savvy breakdown operators there are speaks volumes.

A good if not altogether satisfying win, I'll be interested to see who he plays against Tonga.

I always thought that Tips was a good player but one who lacked a bit of grunt. So very happy to be proven utterly wrong.

The team for next Saturday is intriguing. On the one hand, the pressure to win one game during the AIs is off which makes a huge change. It is tempting to make huge changes, but equally part of me thinks it’s best to keep some momentum before the final match against the Bokke. I’d love to have 4 from 4. That would do our confidence the world of good.

Even if we put a strong team out, there are some players who do need a rest for various reasons, North and Halfpenny in particular due t knocks, whilst I’d keep AWJ wrapped in cotton wool where possible. There are some bench players who deserve a start too, Tomos Williams and Dee spring to mind. I suppose it will dobe the ne if Gatland wants to limit games to 3/4 which will have an impact.

Numbers wrote:To my mind of thinking that is the best performance I have seen from Tipuric in International rugby, I have criticised his lack of tunrovers in the past, but to win MOM when playing against the most savvy breakdown operators there are speaks volumes.

A good if not altogether satisfying win, I'll be interested to see who he plays against Tonga.

I remember being lectured at length at how good England were at winning ugly when necessary and how poor old Wales who play some pretty rugby and come up short. I’ll take a win may have been short on tries or excitement for the neutral but proved that we can’t beat th bloody Aussies after som many knock backs.

Sandydragon wrote:

Numbers wrote:To my mind of thinking that is the best performance I have seen from Tipuric in International rugby, I have criticised his lack of tunrovers in the past, but to win MOM when playing against the most savvy breakdown operators there are speaks volumes.

A good if not altogether satisfying win, I'll be interested to see who he plays against Tonga.

I remember being lectured at length at how good England were at winning ugly when necessary and how poor old Wales who play some pretty rugby and come up short.

You have a good memory. When was this the mid 90's?

Sandydragon wrote:

Numbers wrote:To my mind of thinking that is the best performance I have seen from Tipuric in International rugby, I have criticised his lack of tunrovers in the past, but to win MOM when playing against the most savvy breakdown operators there are speaks volumes.

A good if not altogether satisfying win, I'll be interested to see who he plays against Tonga.

I always thought that Tips was a good player but one who lacked a bit of grunt. So very happy to be proven utterly wrong.

The team for next Saturday is intriguing. On the one hand, the pressure to win one game during the AIs is off which makes a huge change. It is tempting to make huge changes, but equally part of me thinks it’s best to keep some momentum before the final match against the Bokke. I’d love to have 4 from 4. That would do our confidence the world of good.

Even if we put a strong team out, there are some players who do need a rest for various reasons, North and Halfpenny in particular due t knocks, whilst I’d keep AWJ wrapped in cotton wool where possible. There are some bench players who deserve a start too, Tomos Williams and Dee spring to mind. I suppose it will dobe the ne if Gatland wants to limit games to 3/4 which will have an impact.

I think I'd be happy with a team that looked something like this:

Rob Evans
Elliot Dee
Leon Brown
Cory Hill
Jake Ball
Aaron Wainwright
Ellis Jenkins
Tomos Williams
Dan Biggar
Luke Morgan
Owen Watkin
Tyler Morgan
Jonah Holmes
Liam Williams

Reps: Wyn Jones, Ryan Elias, Dillon Lewis, Bradley Davies, Justin Tipuric, Aled Davies, Jarrod Evans, Steff Evans

I think that should have enough experience to get us a result.

Numbers wrote:
I think I'd be happy with a team that looked something like this:

Rob Evans
Elliot Dee
Leon Brown
Cory Hill
Jake Ball
Aaron Wainwright
Ellis Jenkins
Tomos Williams
Dan Biggar
Luke Morgan
Owen Watkin
Tyler Morgan
Jonah Holmes
Liam Williams

Reps: Wyn Jones, Ryan Elias, Dillon Lewis, Bradley Davies, Justin Tipuric, Aled Davies, Jarrod Evans, Steff Evans

I think that should have enough experience to get us a result.

I hope that Patchell will be back at 10 for this one but otherwise I'd broadly agree, perhaps a little less experimental. In reality I think the team for Tonga will be stronger than this - I don't see Gatland risking losing this one.

All due "respect" to Tonga, but the idea that there is a risk that 3rd-ranked team in the world, and 6N runners-up, might lose to the 12th ranked team is ludicrous. Look, everyone knows Wales had a bit of a bad run against 2nd tier sides but that was a playing generation ago and they should by now be over whatever psychological damage Manu Samoa did in the '90s.

Tonga is competitive with the likes of Italy and Georgia. Wales is up there with England and the Boks. That's not even the same league. Tonga have never beaten Wales, even in the worst times, and have beaten nobody of any note since France in RWC2011.* Wales, on the other hand, haven't slipped on a banana skin at all since Japan in 2013 and at home since Samoa in 2012. Since then they are on a 5 match winning streak against Pacific Island teams.

*OK, they beat Scotland in 2012 but that was a 10th-ranked Scotland, then the 6N Wooden-Spooner which had not finished that tournament out of the bottom two for six seasons.

Watkin and Morgan are centres I want to see getting game time. Both have promising futures.

Son of Mathonwy wrote:

Numbers wrote:
I think I'd be happy with a team that looked something like this:

Rob Evans
Elliot Dee
Leon Brown
Cory Hill
Jake Ball
Aaron Wainwright
Ellis Jenkins
Tomos Williams
Dan Biggar
Luke Morgan
Owen Watkin
Tyler Morgan
Jonah Holmes
Liam Williams

Reps: Wyn Jones, Ryan Elias, Dillon Lewis, Bradley Davies, Justin Tipuric, Aled Davies, Jarrod Evans, Steff Evans

I think that should have enough experience to get us a result.

I hope that Patchell will be back at 10 for this one but otherwise I'd broadly agree, perhaps a little less experimental. In reality I think the team for Tonga will be stronger than this - I don't see Gatland risking losing this one.

I'd like to see Patchell back too, I'm not sure Tonga is the game to bring someone back from a head injury tho.

Numbers wrote:

Son of Mathonwy wrote:

Numbers wrote:
I think I'd be happy with a team that looked something like this:

Rob Evans
Elliot Dee
Leon Brown
Cory Hill
Jake Ball
Aaron Wainwright
Ellis Jenkins
Tomos Williams
Dan Biggar
Luke Morgan
Owen Watkin
Tyler Morgan
Jonah Holmes
Liam Williams

Reps: Wyn Jones, Ryan Elias, Dillon Lewis, Bradley Davies, Justin Tipuric, Aled Davies, Jarrod Evans, Steff Evans

I think that should have enough experience to get us a result.

I hope that Patchell will be back at 10 for this one but otherwise I'd broadly agree, perhaps a little less experimental. In reality I think the team for Tonga will be stronger than this - I don't see Gatland risking losing this one.

I'd like to see Patchell back too, I'm not sure Tonga is the game to bring someone back from a head injury tho.

Fair point though he wouldn't agree I think!

Though by the same token I'd say we shouldn't be playing such teams at all - better to support European minnows. ( Oh, wait, we did that 2 weeks ago )

Son of Mathonwy wrote:

Numbers wrote:

Son of Mathonwy wrote: I hope that Patchell will be back at 10 for this one but otherwise I'd broadly agree, perhaps a little less experimental. In reality I think the team for Tonga will be stronger than this - I don't see Gatland risking losing this one.

I'd like to see Patchell back too, I'm not sure Tonga is the game to bring someone back from a head injury tho.

Fair point though he wouldn't agree I think!

Though by the same token I'd say we shouldn't be playing such teams at all - better to support European minnows. ( Oh, wait, we did that 2 weeks ago )

Ha,ha! The Jocks could do us a favour this weekend by softening up the Boks.

Both sides will be looking to play at a hundred miles an hour and the Boks could be a little frazzled going into their final game after a long and hard international season.

normanski wrote:

Son of Mathonwy wrote:

Numbers wrote:
I'd like to see Patchell back too, I'm not sure Tonga is the game to bring someone back from a head injury tho.

Fair point though he wouldn't agree I think!

Though by the same token I'd say we shouldn't be playing such teams at all - better to support European minnows. ( Oh, wait, we did that 2 weeks ago )

Ha,ha! The Jocks could do us a favour this weekend by softening up the Boks.

Both sides will be looking to play at a hundred miles an hour and the Boks could be a little frazzled going into their final game after a long and hard international season.

That promises to be a really interesting game. I wouldn’t like to pick the winner of that one.

Sandydragon wrote:

normanski wrote:

Son of Mathonwy wrote: Fair point though he wouldn't agree I think!

Though by the same token I'd say we shouldn't be playing such teams at all - better to support European minnows. ( Oh, wait, we did that 2 weeks ago )

Ha,ha! The Jocks could do us a favour this weekend by softening up the Boks.

Both sides will be looking to play at a hundred miles an hour and the Boks could be a little frazzled going into their final game after a long and hard international season.

That promises to be a really interesting game. I wouldn’t like to pick the winner of that one.

If it's wet then I would lean towards the Saffers, if dry (as it's supposed to be) then Scotland, I don't think they'll be much in it as you say.