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His day has gone. Most see him as a penalty liability. I see him as another whose full potential was not realised. Of all the French exports, I see the biggest loss as Jack Willis.
No.
Fair comment. At this point, I thought Mercer or T Willis would be demanding the same sort of run that Dombrandt got in the last 6N. Who knows where SB will go with the 8 shirt but, assuming BV is out of the running, I'd imagine Earl, Barbeary and Dombrandt are ahead. With Lawes retired and Curry injured, I'd prefer Earl at 7 but the old arguments about line-out prowess will remain. Pick, say, two out of Barbeary, Earl and Underhill and who will join them as a jumper?Which Tyler wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 12:10 pmNo.
His early season matches were brilliant. Then he had a potentially season-ending ankle injury, and came back in December anyway. Judging him on 1 match, 2+ months before he was expected to be fit, is just silly.
https://www.gloucestershirelive.co.uk/s ... ad-8971834
Now whether he's better than he would have been staying in England is a different matter - as he was playing Premiership at International class before leaving, just upsetting Eddie Jones (and now Borthwick)
The thing is...Dombrandt is probably the best 8 in the Prem. It's just that he's not hit his stride in international rugby yet.Oakboy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 12:30 pmFair comment. At this point, I thought Mercer or T Willis would be demanding the same sort of run that Dombrandt got in the last 6N. Who knows where SB will go with the 8 shirt but, assuming BV is out of the running, I'd imagine Earl, Barbeary and Dombrandt are ahead. With Lawes retired and Curry injured, I'd prefer Earl at 7 but the old arguments about line-out prowess will remain. Pick, say, two out of Barbeary, Earl and Underhill and who will join them as a jumper?Which Tyler wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 12:10 pmNo.
His early season matches were brilliant. Then he had a potentially season-ending ankle injury, and came back in December anyway. Judging him on 1 match, 2+ months before he was expected to be fit, is just silly.
https://www.gloucestershirelive.co.uk/s ... ad-8971834
Now whether he's better than he would have been staying in England is a different matter - as he was playing Premiership at International class before leaving, just upsetting Eddie Jones (and now Borthwick)
If we continue to produce slow ball that needs a player we do not have to produce workable ball...we're fooked.Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 10:42 pm I’m at the point I’m not 100% about any of Dombrandt, Earl or Mercer (with Willis/Fisilau very, very promising but entirely unproven options) but Borthwick definitely needs to recognise some sort of game-plan that can make use of their running talents.
Willis (and I think Fisilau) are the options potentially most capable of creating go-forward off slow ball, but we can’t rely on that yet and can’t go on hoping for one of the others to play like 2016 Billy.
If we’re assuming we’ll have slow, poor ball forever we may as well give up completely.
You don't rate Barbeary?Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 10:42 pm I’m at the point I’m not 100% about any of Dombrandt, Earl or Mercer (with Willis/Fisilau very, very promising but entirely unproven options) but Borthwick definitely needs to recognise some sort of game-plan that can make use of their running talents.
Willis (and I think Fisilau) are the options potentially most capable of creating go-forward off slow ball, but we can’t rely on that yet and can’t go on hoping for one of the others to play like 2016 Billy.
If we’re assuming we’ll have slow, poor ball forever we may as well give up completely.
Is Fisilau a particularly strong carrier? I see him as more of an ‘Exeter 8’ performing the Simmonds role rather than the heavy carrying role Ewers was there for.Oakboy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 9:02 amYou don't rate Barbeary?Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 10:42 pm I’m at the point I’m not 100% about any of Dombrandt, Earl or Mercer (with Willis/Fisilau very, very promising but entirely unproven options) but Borthwick definitely needs to recognise some sort of game-plan that can make use of their running talents.
Willis (and I think Fisilau) are the options potentially most capable of creating go-forward off slow ball, but we can’t rely on that yet and can’t go on hoping for one of the others to play like 2016 Billy.
If we’re assuming we’ll have slow, poor ball forever we may as well give up completely.
The snag is that Dombrandt got the whole 6N without showing he owned the shirt. Then BV was picked as the only 8 for the RWC - arguably one of the biggest selection clangers since Robinson picked a schoolboy at centre. Going back, Jones refused to pick the best club 8 in Simmonds.Stom wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 8:23 amIf we continue to produce slow ball that needs a player we do not have to produce workable ball...we're fooked.Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 10:42 pm I’m at the point I’m not 100% about any of Dombrandt, Earl or Mercer (with Willis/Fisilau very, very promising but entirely unproven options) but Borthwick definitely needs to recognise some sort of game-plan that can make use of their running talents.
Willis (and I think Fisilau) are the options potentially most capable of creating go-forward off slow ball, but we can’t rely on that yet and can’t go on hoping for one of the others to play like 2016 Billy.
If we’re assuming we’ll have slow, poor ball forever we may as well give up completely.
It's got to the stage where we just need to pick an 8 and stick with them. Just one of them. Ditto in other slots, too, which is why it would be wonderful if lukewarm boy did go to France.
We also need to find some props or convince Bristol to sack Lam.
Exeter have Roots at 6 for the grunt stuff, together with Vermeulen at 7. Fisilau is a good all-rounder with pace and good hands. He 'punches above his weight' in contact. I think the club has a dilemma with its back-row style because Vintcent is too good to leave out. He's pace rather than grunt of course. Then, there is the Welsh feller (Tshiunza) to come back still - injured, presumably - though he is listed as a lock, I think.Scrumhead wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 9:18 amIs Fisilau a particularly strong carrier? I see him as more of an ‘Exeter 8’ performing the Simmonds role rather than the heavy carrying role Ewers was there for.Oakboy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 9:02 amYou don't rate Barbeary?Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 10:42 pm I’m at the point I’m not 100% about any of Dombrandt, Earl or Mercer (with Willis/Fisilau very, very promising but entirely unproven options) but Borthwick definitely needs to recognise some sort of game-plan that can make use of their running talents.
Willis (and I think Fisilau) are the options potentially most capable of creating go-forward off slow ball, but we can’t rely on that yet and can’t go on hoping for one of the others to play like 2016 Billy.
If we’re assuming we’ll have slow, poor ball forever we may as well give up completely.
Chiefs lock options are doing pretty well this season also. Pearson, Jenkins and Tuima have all played consistently and then Dunne is due back from injury and as you say Tshiunza can play lock or flank.Oakboy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 9:29 amExeter have Roots at 6 for the grunt stuff, together with Vermeulen at 7. Fisilau is a good all-rounder with pace and good hands. He 'punches above his weight' in contact. I think the club has a dilemma with its back-row style because Vintcent is too good to leave out. He's pace rather than grunt of course. Then, there is the Welsh feller (Tshiunza) to come back still - injured, presumably - though he is listed as a lock, I think.
I’m not sure if I’m misinterpreting your comments here but Fisilau getting elevated to the 20 shirt of the senior side is a huge stretch. He’s looked good but no more so than a plethora of other back row players, most of whom have been performing at that level for much longer than he has.Oakboy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 9:20 amThe snag is that Dombrandt got the whole 6N without showing he owned the shirt. Then BV was picked as the only 8 for the RWC - arguably one of the biggest selection clangers since Robinson picked a schoolboy at centre. Going back, Jones refused to pick the best club 8 in Simmonds.Stom wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 8:23 amIf we continue to produce slow ball that needs a player we do not have to produce workable ball...we're fooked.Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 10:42 pm I’m at the point I’m not 100% about any of Dombrandt, Earl or Mercer (with Willis/Fisilau very, very promising but entirely unproven options) but Borthwick definitely needs to recognise some sort of game-plan that can make use of their running talents.
Willis (and I think Fisilau) are the options potentially most capable of creating go-forward off slow ball, but we can’t rely on that yet and can’t go on hoping for one of the others to play like 2016 Billy.
If we’re assuming we’ll have slow, poor ball forever we may as well give up completely.
It's got to the stage where we just need to pick an 8 and stick with them. Just one of them. Ditto in other slots, too, which is why it would be wonderful if lukewarm boy did go to France.
We also need to find some props or convince Bristol to sack Lam.
I think the back row selection is crucial going forward. Quite how you get balance, pace, turnover capability and line-out prowess into the unit I'm not sure.
6. Martin/Chessum
7. Underhill/Earl
8. Dombrandt/Barbeary/Fisilau
????? Having a lock/backrower at 6 offends many but I can't see an effective alternative unless the 8 offers a true line-out option. I do think that pace is essential for at least two of the three positions. Barbeary has great potential for pacey go-forward off the back of the scrum. Fisilau looks the best all-round package - maybe the perfect fit for the 20 shirt?
I'd still pick J Willis at 7 if he was available and his brother, once fit, needs a chance still.
I agree and Fisilau may be symptomatic of our past failure to develop juniors if he is NOT looked at. IMO, it is not so much whether player A, B or C is slightly ahead of him NOW. It is about reasoned judgement by SB and his coaching crew on whether or not he has the highest ceiling. He just might excel at international level.Which Tyler wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 11:52 am This 6N is about the earliest for him to be being looked at by the international coaches.
Last season was his breakthrough year; this year he's playing with a weight of expectation, and opponents having done their video analysis of his game.
He doesn't appear to have been a flash in the pan, unable to bring his age-grade performance to senior rugby (within reason), or particularly suffering from any other variety of second season syndrome.
Now, whether he's high enough in the queue is a different matter, but I personally, have no issue with him being looked at.
Totally agree.fivepointer wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 12:42 pm Fisilau should be in the A team.
He's got a lot going for him but it is early.