RugbyRebels

Son of Mathonwy wrote:I'm particularly impressed with the way that, even in the second wave, the UKs daily Covid deaths often exceed South Korea's total deaths to date.

I haven’t looked at the numbers but I’m guessing you can add Italy, Spain, France and Germany to that list. I’m guessing Belgium might not make the grade but that’s probably be due their population size.
It’s almost as if comparing large European countries to S Korea isn’t comparing like for like.

Mellsblue wrote:

Son of Mathonwy wrote:I'm particularly impressed with the way that, even in the second wave, the UKs daily Covid deaths often exceed South Korea's total deaths to date.

I haven’t looked at the numbers but I’m guessing you can add Italy, Spain, France and Germany to that list. I’m guessing Belgium might not make the grade but that’s probably be due their population size.
It’s almost as if comparing large European countries to S Korea isn’t comparing like for like.

Why? There are 52m living there, with 10m in Seol and 25m in the metropolitan area. I’d say that’s comparable to large European countries. Slightly smaller but not incomparably smaller.

Stom wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:

Son of Mathonwy wrote:I'm particularly impressed with the way that, even in the second wave, the UKs daily Covid deaths often exceed South Korea's total deaths to date.

I haven’t looked at the numbers but I’m guessing you can add Italy, Spain, France and Germany to that list. I’m guessing Belgium might not make the grade but that’s probably be due their population size.
It’s almost as if comparing large European countries to S Korea isn’t comparing like for like.

Why? There are 52m living there, with 10m in Seol and 25m in the metropolitan area. I’d say that’s comparable to large European countries. Slightly smaller but not incomparably smaller.

Piffle, there are 38 million people just in Seoul, a very stable genius said so. #overturn the vote

Stom wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:

Son of Mathonwy wrote:I'm particularly impressed with the way that, even in the second wave, the UKs daily Covid deaths often exceed South Korea's total deaths to date.

I haven’t looked at the numbers but I’m guessing you can add Italy, Spain, France and Germany to that list. I’m guessing Belgium might not make the grade but that’s probably be due their population size.
It’s almost as if comparing large European countries to S Korea isn’t comparing like for like.

Why? There are 52m living there, with 10m in Seol and 25m in the metropolitan area. I’d say that’s comparable to large European countries. Slightly smaller but not incomparably smaller.

Cos it’s not just about population size?

Mellsblue wrote:

Stom wrote:

Mellsblue wrote: I haven’t looked at the numbers but I’m guessing you can add Italy, Spain, France and Germany to that list. I’m guessing Belgium might not make the grade but that’s probably be due their population size.
It’s almost as if comparing large European countries to S Korea isn’t comparing like for like.

Why? There are 52m living there, with 10m in Seol and 25m in the metropolitan area. I’d say that’s comparable to large European countries. Slightly smaller but not incomparably smaller.

Cos it’s not just about population size?

But about reaction of the authorities, cultural differences in attitudes toward authority, and healthiness of the population. And, yeah, well...

2 of those are failings of the current and past Uk governments, the other is something the UK like to think they’re like (we know how to queue!), but in fact are appalling with authority.

Stom wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:

Stom wrote:
Why? There are 52m living there, with 10m in Seol and 25m in the metropolitan area. I’d say that’s comparable to large European countries. Slightly smaller but not incomparably smaller.

Cos it’s not just about population size?

But about reaction of the authorities, cultural differences in attitudes toward authority, and healthiness of the population. And, yeah, well...

2 of those are failings of the current and past Uk governments, the other is something the UK like to think they’re like (we know how to queue!), but in fact are appalling with authority.

That also means you need to blame the failings of the current and past govts in Spain, France, Italy, Belgium and Germany, too, and praise the Orban and previous Hungarian govt...
You could also look at things such as obesity rates - SK 3% v 28% UK - amongst a myriad of other factors.
Anyway, I’m not getting dragged down this rabbit hole again and I’m not trying to claim the U.K. govt has done a particularly good job. I’d just like comparisons to be more, well, comparable.

Mellsblue wrote:

Stom wrote:

Mellsblue wrote: Cos it’s not just about population size?

But about reaction of the authorities, cultural differences in attitudes toward authority, and healthiness of the population. And, yeah, well...

2 of those are failings of the current and past Uk governments, the other is something the UK like to think they’re like (we know how to queue!), but in fact are appalling with authority.

That also means you need to blame the failings of the current and past govts in Spain, France, Italy, Belgium and Germany, too, and praise the Orban and previous Hungarian govt...
You could also look at things such as obesity rates - SK 3% v 28% UK - amongst a myriad of other factors.
Anyway, I’m not getting dragged down this rabbit hole again and I’m not trying to claim the U.K. govt has done a particularly good job. I’d just like comparisons to be more, well, comparable.

lol. Well, the govt. here did something right in the first wave, that's for sure. They were quick to lockdown and shut borders and we had some of the lowest numbers around. This time around, cases are a lot higher, and the decisions have been...questionable.

But, yes, I do think that the past and current governments of many countries have failed their populaces when it comes to health and wellbeing. It's a major global problem being bought to a head by the willingness of the new generation to go out and help themselves, and the rise of fascism.

But that's not Covid

I think most of Europe has got this very, very wrong.

I fail to see how you can put in place border controls for the population...unless you're off doing business. The virus doesn't ignore businessmen! A complete shutdown of all cross border travel would have been a far better idea, with the only exceptions made for the transport of necessary components for food and essential industry.

But that's just one part of it.

It really feels like most countries were like: Oh, the human cost. Oh, the economic cost. Oh, let's make a fudge of the 2...and surprise, surprise, it didn't work.

"doing business".

I think the world is sick and fucking tired of the "businessman" being the exalted entity in society. What a load of shit. Nurses, essential. Food suppliers and distributors, essential. Business people, stay home you free loading cunts.

Quite, who needs jobs and money! Wastrels all

Digby wrote:Quite, who needs jobs and money! Wastrels all

Yeah, ha fuckin ha.

Shit rolls downhill beatch.

So, Is Boris about to cancel Christmas? Pressure is mounting for the Christmas lockdown easing to be reconsidered.

they might shrink the number of days in the relaxation period. but there has to be some thought given to what will happen no matter any edict

Sandydragon wrote:So, Is Boris about to cancel Christmas? Pressure is mounting for the Christmas lockdown easing to be reconsidered.

I don't really see that he can. Public trust has been eroded to the extent that a lot of people are just brazenly ignoring the restrictions anyway and cancelling Christmas would just push that further.

No leader should ever make a proclamation that they know won't be obeyed and can't be enforced because it weakens their power.

Puja

Puja wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:So, Is Boris about to cancel Christmas? Pressure is mounting for the Christmas lockdown easing to be reconsidered.

I don't really see that he can. Public trust has been eroded to the extent that a lot of people are just brazenly ignoring the restrictions anyway and cancelling Christmas would just push that further.

No leader should ever make a proclamation that they know won't be obeyed and can't be enforced because it weakens their power.

Puja

Get Brexit Done

Build back Better

I lead a life of blameless domesticity and always have done.

Digby wrote:

Puja wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:So, Is Boris about to cancel Christmas? Pressure is mounting for the Christmas lockdown easing to be reconsidered.

I don't really see that he can. Public trust has been eroded to the extent that a lot of people are just brazenly ignoring the restrictions anyway and cancelling Christmas would just push that further.

No leader should ever make a proclamation that they know won't be obeyed and can't be enforced because it weakens their power.

Puja

Get Brexit Done

Build back Better

I lead a life of blameless domesticity and always have done.

That's "Won't be Believed" rather than "Won't be Obeyed"!

Puja

Puja wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:So, Is Boris about to cancel Christmas? Pressure is mounting for the Christmas lockdown easing to be reconsidered.

I don't really see that he can. Public trust has been eroded to the extent that a lot of people are just brazenly ignoring the restrictions anyway and cancelling Christmas would just push that further.

No leader should ever make a proclamation that they know won't be obeyed and can't be enforced because it weakens their power.

Puja

Thats the main issue here - people have largely stopped listening to Boris. And it is a predictable outcome following Barnard Castle Gate.

My personal concern is that my parents who live in Wales may not be able to travel to our house for Christmas. We aren't seeing anyone else so we aren't being irresponsible but I'm dependent on Boris and the Welsh Government sticking to the original plan on this one.

I suspect Boris will keep Christmas as it is and pray January is a month that we can all accept being written off by a severe lockdown.

I just hope that by May I can get to the UK to visit family...

Don't worry. Anti-vaxxers are going into rapture over this now. Its their best christmas present eva. They will piss on the fire and this shit should be hitting everyone in waves for at least another year. The Free West: the paper womble of the modern world.

Did I hear correctly we just found more positive test results down the back of a sofa? Again one wonders what (lack of) controls are in place this can happen, are we using prison inmates with no education to collate results on the cheap?

Digby wrote:Did I hear correctly we just found more positive test results down the back of a sofa? Again one wonders what (lack of) controls are in place this can happen, are we using prison inmates with no education to collate results on the cheap?

Nope, we're paying them £600 a day (at least).

Sandydragon wrote:

Digby wrote:Did I hear correctly we just found more positive test results down the back of a sofa? Again one wonders what (lack of) controls are in place this can happen, are we using prison inmates with no education to collate results on the cheap?

Nope, we're paying them £600 a day (at least).

They've already pulled this weird stunt of losing count, it's astonishing how lax they're being. And it's weird because it's not even hard to have checks in place to stop this kind of thing, so they're actively choosing to be at risk of manual fuck ups. You wouldn't expect that for £200/day

Yay - we really are world beating - our Covid Corruption is headline worthy in Trumpland!
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020 ... tracts.htm

Waste, Negligence and Cronyism: Inside Britain’s Pandemic Spending
In the desperate scramble for protective gear and other equipment, politically connected companies reaped billions.

It's really getting to quite a stage when a US newspaper is running an expose on this corruption. When will our media get on top of this and start detailing what has been going on.
The Good Law Project has been shining a light on this and there are one or two MP's taking an interest, but this is corruption on a grand scale and really should be getting far greater exposure.

Sweden's approach has been seen now to fall short with the winter surge:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-55347021
Even Germany is struggling to get a grip tbf, and Fra needed a 5 week lockdown. Seems a question of 'assume the position' for many.
Tier 3 measures have shown to be effective here, yet again the question may be asked why some areas were exempt from this earlier and is asking everyone to be 'jolly careful' over the xmas period likely to have any effect overall.

And it's all change on the policy front, all change please, all change. Would they please sort their shit out, they keep passing up on chances to be more controlled in advance, and they keep reacting after the obvious facts with changes in what's permissible and messaging