RugbyRebels

Sandydragon wrote:

Digby wrote:Outstanding work by Raab to get out in front of the report which Lewis will surely release into Russian interference by releasing his own report saying when we told you Russia wasn't interfering that was true bar the part about it being true.

Notice he didn’t mention the Brexit vote. Either the formal report isn’t conclusive on it or he hopes by getting ahead of its release it will take the sting out of that revelation.

Well that was only an advisory vote, nothing major came of it. They do seem to be correctly gauging most people simply don't care

Digby wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:

Digby wrote:Outstanding work by Raab to get out in front of the report which Lewis will surely release into Russian interference by releasing his own report saying when we told you Russia wasn't interfering that was true bar the part about it being true.

Notice he didn’t mention the Brexit vote. Either the formal report isn’t conclusive on it or he hopes by getting ahead of its release it will take the sting out of that revelation.

Well that was only an advisory vote, nothing major came of it. They do seem to be correctly gauging most people simply don't care

Ardent Brexiteers will not care, ardent remainers will be incensed and everyone else will just wish it was all over and done with.

Sandydragon wrote:

Digby wrote:

Sandydragon wrote: Notice he didn’t mention the Brexit vote. Either the formal report isn’t conclusive on it or he hopes by getting ahead of its release it will take the sting out of that revelation.

Well that was only an advisory vote, nothing major came of it. They do seem to be correctly gauging most people simply don't care

Ardent Brexiteers will not care, ardent remainers will be incensed and everyone else will just wish it was all over and done with.

Everyone else will just wish it was all over and done with?

Are you mental?

https://www.ft.com/content/4fd04fd9-720 ... 466f226159

The ore "project fear" is shown to be "project reality", the fewer people "don't care" about having been lied to, and the Russian interference.

Equally, the more Russia is shown to have interfered with the democratic process both here and in the US - the fewer people don't care about Russian interference.

Oh, and yes, it's possible that that's my bubble ad my bias talking - but Brexit is popping up again in conversation, MSM and social media, having been pretty much dead since February.

canta_brian wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:

Digby wrote:
Well that was only an advisory vote, nothing major came of it. They do seem to be correctly gauging most people simply don't care

Ardent Brexiteers will not care, ardent remainers will be incensed and everyone else will just wish it was all over and done with.

Everyone else will just wish it was all over and done with?

Are you mental?

https://www.ft.com/content/4fd04fd9-720 ... 466f226159

Do you seriously think that any substantial number of the general public understands that, cares about It, or has any idea how it might affect them?

Stones of granite wrote:

canta_brian wrote:

Sandydragon wrote: Ardent Brexiteers will not care, ardent remainers will be incensed and everyone else will just wish it was all over and done with.

Everyone else will just wish it was all over and done with?

Are you mental?

https://www.ft.com/content/4fd04fd9-720 ... 466f226159

Do you seriously think that any substantial number of the general public understands that, cares about It, or has any idea how it might affect them?

Nope, though I wish they did. And I wish too the cabinet would take note of the fact that whilst the meddling happens to have helped their machinations in this instance such actors are here to sow discord not act in advancement of Boris, Jacob and Agent Cummings and Goings. That Boris et al will be on the receiving end of this at some point has some personal satisfaction, but that's of sod all use to the UK

canta_brian wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:

Digby wrote:
Well that was only an advisory vote, nothing major came of it. They do seem to be correctly gauging most people simply don't care

Ardent Brexiteers will not care, ardent remainers will be incensed and everyone else will just wish it was all over and done with.

Everyone else will just wish it was all over and done with?

Are you mental?

https://www.ft.com/content/4fd04fd9-720 ... 466f226159

For many people, this is no longer interesting. We've left the EU so that's that.

I don't agree with that position, but I hear it expressed too often for it to be just a few people.

Good news:
Some geeks in Southampton have repurposed a drug that may help COVID patients avoid the need for a respirator.
Bad news:
Very early stages from a trial of only 101 people

Good news:
The geeks at Oxford have seen their vaccine pass the latest stage of the trial of their vaccine. Good results on both antibodies and T cell production.
Bad news:
It’ll give you a fever or headache

Bad news:
Study shows that direct and indirect consequences of lockdown may cause 200,000 extra deaths in the long term
Good news:
erm...that is worst case scenario.

Mellsblue wrote:Bad news:
Study shows that direct and indirect consequences of lockdown may cause 200,000 extra deaths in the long term
Good news:
erm...that is worst case scenario.

I am disapproving of how this is being presented in the press (I know, press not being trustworthy in reporting on science ) as that figure is including the deaths due to all of the jobs and economic growth lost in lockdown, without taking into account that a "no lockdown" scenario would cause massive economic disruption through 1-4% of the population dying and almost certainly result in a worse hit than a lockdown did.

Puja

Puja wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:Bad news:
Study shows that direct and indirect consequences of lockdown may cause 200,000 extra deaths in the long term
Good news:
erm...that is worst case scenario.

I am disapproving of how this is being presented in the press (I know, press not being trustworthy in reporting on science ) as that figure is including the deaths due to all of the jobs and economic growth lost in lockdown, without taking into account that a "no lockdown" scenario would cause massive economic disruption through 1-4% of the population dying and almost certainly result in a worse hit than a lockdown did.

Puja

I’m disapproving of the fact I’ve put it in the wrong thread.

Puja wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:Bad news:
Study shows that direct and indirect consequences of lockdown may cause 200,000 extra deaths in the long term
Good news:
erm...that is worst case scenario.

I am disapproving of how this is being presented in the press (I know, press not being trustworthy in reporting on science ) as that figure is including the deaths due to all of the jobs and economic growth lost in lockdown, without taking into account that a "no lockdown" scenario would cause massive economic disruption through 1-4% of the population dying and almost certainly result in a worse hit than a lockdown did.

Puja

If you lock down or don't lock down, there will be an economic impact, plus a hit on other areas, cancer treatment for example. An uncle of mine is effectively waiting to die from cancer after not being able to get help when symptoms first appeared (just before lockdown).

But the consequences of not locking down would have been far worse and we would still have had an economic impact. That's the key message, but the media doesn't really go for that level of nuance.

What the actual bleep happened in PMQs today?

Has Boris had a stroke, which is possible during his Covid recovery, was he drunk, or have they decided the only message which works for him/them is 'get Brexit done'? Boris needs to get some serious work done during the holiday on how he responds to Starmer, yes most of the population probably pay no attention week to week, but plenty of the PCP and PLP do if not all, and the messaging around competency (or really a lack of) will spread

Digby wrote:What the actual bleep happened in PMQs today?

Has Boris had a stroke, which is possible during his Covid recovery, was he drunk, or have they decided the only message which works for him/them is 'get Brexit done'? Boris needs to get some serious work done during the holiday on how he responds to Starmer, yes most of the population probably pay no attention week to week, but plenty of the PCP and PLP do if not all, and the messaging around competency (or really a lack of) will spread

It absolutely would not surprise me if Johnson doesn't lead the Conservatives into the next General Election.

Once Brexit is done and any fall out can be pinned on him and his current team of cretinous ministers, I think there will be a putsch. Johnson has never been that popular with MPs.

Sandydragon wrote:

Digby wrote:What the actual bleep happened in PMQs today?

Has Boris had a stroke, which is possible during his Covid recovery, was he drunk, or have they decided the only message which works for him/them is 'get Brexit done'? Boris needs to get some serious work done during the holiday on how he responds to Starmer, yes most of the population probably pay no attention week to week, but plenty of the PCP and PLP do if not all, and the messaging around competency (or really a lack of) will spread

It absolutely would not surprise me if Johnson doesn't lead the Conservatives into the next General Election.

Once Brexit is done and any fall out can be pinned on him and his current team of cretinous ministers, I think there will be a putsch. Johnson has never been that popular with MPs.

I don't know if Boris is still struggling with Covid, some people are reporting ongoing issues arising in a number of ways, but right now he doesn't seem right even for Boris. Today was a mix of a little bit shocking in his ineptitude, and depressing that this is our leader. About the best you can say is it wasn't the utter car crash of Trump trying to answer questions

We shouldnt be surprised by just how appalling Johnson is. We've been given plenty of evidence before he was PM.

John Crace nails it - https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... etty-sight

"The only person unable to see quite how damaged Boris is, is Boris himself. He is the emperor with no clothes and it’s not a pretty sight. Even when he’s losing badly, he imagines himself to be a winner. The Tory MP Nusrat Ghani suggested he might care to spend his staycation recess reading Winnie the Pooh. Boris’s eyes lit up. There were too many Eeyores on the Labour benches. What the country needed was a Tigger like him. Except it doesn’t. What the UK really needs is a grown-up in charge. And what we’ve got is an infantile narcissist"

I'm not surprised he's a lazy, incompetent spoofer when it comes to policy and detail, I am surprised he's proving this ineffective as a public speaker. Given it's a very limited audience he speaks to in PMQs maybe he survives, but he's putting a lot of extra pressure on himself with these performances

I may be being a little dense here, but I’m a bit confused by Boris Bunter’s flying visit to Scotland to “boost support for the Union”. Can anyone explain how a visit to a thinly populated archipelago 250 miles North of Scotland’s population centres followed by a visit to a military base populated by mainly English servicemen was intended to achieve this?

Surely an open-topped Boris-mobile procession through the industrial Central Belt to receive the acclamation of a populace grateful for the handouts of borrowed money would have been a better plan.

Stones of granite wrote:I may be being a little dense here, but I’m a bit confused by Boris Bunter’s flying visit to Scotland to “boost support for the Union”. Can anyone explain how a visit to a thinly populated archipelago 250 miles North of Scotland’s population centres followed by a visit to a military base populated by mainly English servicemen was intended to achieve this?

Surely an open-topped Boris-mobile procession through the industrial Central Belt to receive the acclamation of a populace grateful for the handouts of borrowed money would have been a better plan.

They want to boost support for the Union. Avoiding any Scots coming into contact with Boris is the best way of doing this.

Puja

The Scottish Parliamentary elections are due in 9 months time, and the Scottish press has been making a lot out of divisions within the independence movement within the country. However, the other parties are clearly considering their strategies for this too, and there have been calls for Richard Leonard to step down as leader of Scottish Labour.

More dramatically, though, Jackson Carlaw, who became Scottish Conservative leader a mere six months ago after Ruth Davidson resigned following her inability to work with Boris Johnson, has suddenly resigned. It is strongly rumoured that this was not entirely of his own choosing, and that the Tories have been less than impressed with his performance.

Strangely, the rumoured leader-in-waiting, Douglas Ross, has also crossed swords with Central Office, having resigned his Government office in protest at the Cummings-Barnard Castle fiasco. He is, however, a hardcore Brexiteer. The biggest problem is that he is a Westminster MP rather than an MSP, so expect some chair shuffling to find him a “safe” Scottish seat.

Stones of granite wrote:The Scottish Parliamentary elections are due in 9 months time, and the Scottish press has been making a lot out of divisions within the independence movement within the country. However, the other parties are clearly considering their strategies for this too, and there have been calls for Richard Leonard to step down as leader of Scottish Labour.

More dramatically, though, Jackson Carlaw, who became Scottish Conservative leader a mere six months ago after Ruth Davidson resigned following her inability to work with Boris Johnson, has suddenly resigned. It is strongly rumoured that this was not entirely of his own choosing, and that the Tories have been less than impressed with his performance.

Strangely, the rumoured leader-in-waiting, Douglas Ross, has also crossed swords with Central Office, having resigned his Government office in protest at the Cummings-Barnard Castle fiasco. He is, however, a hardcore Brexiteer. The biggest problem is that he is a Westminster MP rather than an MSP, so expect some chair shuffling to find him a “safe” Scottish seat.

Not paving the way for a Ruth comeback?

Banquo wrote:

Stones of granite wrote:The Scottish Parliamentary elections are due in 9 months time, and the Scottish press has been making a lot out of divisions within the independence movement within the country. However, the other parties are clearly considering their strategies for this too, and there have been calls for Richard Leonard to step down as leader of Scottish Labour.

More dramatically, though, Jackson Carlaw, who became Scottish Conservative leader a mere six months ago after Ruth Davidson resigned following her inability to work with Boris Johnson, has suddenly resigned. It is strongly rumoured that this was not entirely of his own choosing, and that the Tories have been less than impressed with his performance.

Strangely, the rumoured leader-in-waiting, Douglas Ross, has also crossed swords with Central Office, having resigned his Government office in protest at the Cummings-Barnard Castle fiasco. He is, however, a hardcore Brexiteer. The biggest problem is that he is a Westminster MP rather than an MSP, so expect some chair shuffling to find him a “safe” Scottish seat.

Not paving the way for a Ruth comeback?

It has been mooted. Tories interviewed on BBC Scotland yesterday afternoon were mischievously suggesting her as an option, but when pressed, admitted that she unlikely to want the job. She is anti-Brexit and has a strong dislike for Johnson. Personally, I think she has rather too much integrity to want to deal with the current set of shysters.

Stones of granite wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Stones of granite wrote:The Scottish Parliamentary elections are due in 9 months time, and the Scottish press has been making a lot out of divisions within the independence movement within the country. However, the other parties are clearly considering their strategies for this too, and there have been calls for Richard Leonard to step down as leader of Scottish Labour.

More dramatically, though, Jackson Carlaw, who became Scottish Conservative leader a mere six months ago after Ruth Davidson resigned following her inability to work with Boris Johnson, has suddenly resigned. It is strongly rumoured that this was not entirely of his own choosing, and that the Tories have been less than impressed with his performance.

Strangely, the rumoured leader-in-waiting, Douglas Ross, has also crossed swords with Central Office, having resigned his Government office in protest at the Cummings-Barnard Castle fiasco. He is, however, a hardcore Brexiteer. The biggest problem is that he is a Westminster MP rather than an MSP, so expect some chair shuffling to find him a “safe” Scottish seat.

Not paving the way for a Ruth comeback?

It has been mooted. Tories interviewed on BBC Scotland yesterday afternoon were mischievously suggesting her as an option, but when pressed, admitted that she unlikely to want the job. She is anti-Brexit and has a strong dislike for Johnson. Personally, I think she has rather too much integrity to want to deal with the current set of shysters.

Surely in politics you sometimes have to hold your nose and try and change from within. See Starmer.

Banquo wrote:

Stones of granite wrote:

Banquo wrote: Not paving the way for a Ruth comeback?

It has been mooted. Tories interviewed on BBC Scotland yesterday afternoon were mischievously suggesting her as an option, but when pressed, admitted that she unlikely to want the job. She is anti-Brexit and has a strong dislike for Johnson. Personally, I think she has rather too much integrity to want to deal with the current set of shysters.

Surely in politics you sometimes have to hold your nose and try and change from within. See Starmer.

Given Scotland's current lack of power in both the UK generally and the Conservative party specifically, what change do you think she could accomplish by lending her face and reputation to this lot?

Puja

The messaging by Boris, Hancock and Agent Cummings has gone from god awful to much worse over the last 24 hours, it's almost impressive to be this inept

Puja wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Stones of granite wrote: It has been mooted. Tories interviewed on BBC Scotland yesterday afternoon were mischievously suggesting her as an option, but when pressed, admitted that she unlikely to want the job. She is anti-Brexit and has a strong dislike for Johnson. Personally, I think she has rather too much integrity to want to deal with the current set of shysters.

Surely in politics you sometimes have to hold your nose and try and change from within. See Starmer.

Given Scotland's current lack of power in both the UK generally and the Conservative party specifically, what change do you think she could accomplish by lending her face and reputation to this lot?

Puja

Well it might help quell independence calls for a start. It would also be a welcome addition to 'this lot' who like it or lump are likely to be in power for at least 4 more years.