RugbyRebels

Beasties wrote:

twitchy wrote:We have gone from hooker being a problem position to some actual depth.

Yup. Still standing at the no 12 bus stop though.

We are, but I think Mallinder and Williams have the potential to be good options in the next few seasons provided they keep developing.

I know Mallinder has his Twelvetrees moments, but I'm hoping he can eradicate those with experience.

Puja wrote: And scrum-halves. We've not had a decent 9 in the U20s at all - Robson's sudden blossoming was an awful surprise as he was exceedingly average at U20s. I'm hearing good things about this year's batch though.

Robson looked a good player for the u20s, he just looked a poor 9 and it seemed he had only been put there due to his size. With hindsight the coaches knew what they were doing gaining him some experience in the role (or just got very lucky)

Scrumhead wrote:

Beasties wrote:

twitchy wrote:We have gone from hooker being a problem position to some actual depth.

Yup. Still standing at the no 12 bus stop though.

We are, but I think Mallinder and Williams have the potential to be good options in the next few seasons provided they keep developing.

I know Mallinder has his Twelvetrees moments, but I'm hoping he can eradicate those with experience.

From what I've seen of Mallinder so far he seems less prone to those 12T moments than Billy. His potential looks better and he's a big lump but he needs to sort his defending out. If he does that then he will do well. Been here before with others though.

Has mallinder been playing 12 for saints recently?

Scrumhead wrote: Harry Randall looked good in the U20 World Cup, but he is literally tiny. He could bulk up, but he's unlikely to grow from his current 5'6" unless he has a very late growth spurt. Even with Laidlaw going, he'll still be competing with another 2 or 3 average foreign journeymen 9 signings at Gloucester too.

Fixed that for you. I don't know why any young 9s even bother going to Glaws academy anymore.

Robson's blossoming that I referred to was the one at Glaws, where he suddenly became quite good overnight. I am a little bit concerned about his new status as saviour, as his passing does sometimes go very wobbly and he gets caught at the base far too often. I'd still be happier having him than Youngs at the moment, but I'm a little worried that he might not be able to step up to the top level.

Puja

Beasties wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:

Beasties wrote: Yup. Still standing at the no 12 bus stop though.

We are, but I think Mallinder and Williams have the potential to be good options in the next few seasons provided they keep developing.

I know Mallinder has his Twelvetrees moments, but I'm hoping he can eradicate those with experience.

From what I've seen of Mallinder so far he seems less prone to those 12T moments than Billy. His potential looks better and he's a big lump but he needs to sort his defending out. If he does that then he will do well. Been here before with others though.

His defence is the real problem. Nothing wrong with his technique or size, but if you watch him during a game, he backs off and backs out far too much. With his build, he should be smashing people and loving it, but he appears to have a Varndell-esque aversion to putting his shoulder in.

Hopefully that'll get beaten out of him, cause the rest of his game's very good.

Puja

Puja wrote:

Scrumhead wrote: Harry Randall looked good in the U20 World Cup, but he is literally tiny. He could bulk up, but he's unlikely to grow from his current 5'6" unless he has a very late growth spurt. Even with Laidlaw going, he'll still be competing with another 2 or 3 average foreign journeymen 9 signings at Gloucester too.

Fixed that for you. I don't know why any young 9s even bother going to Glaws academy anymore.

Robson's blossoming that I referred to was the one at Glaws, where he suddenly became quite good overnight. I am a little bit concerned about his new status as saviour, as his passing does sometimes go very wobbly and he gets caught at the base far too often. I'd still be happier having him than Youngs at the moment, but I'm a little worried that he might not be able to step up to the top level.

Puja

Quite true ... I dare say Laidlaw will be replaced by an ageing foreigner to add to Willi Heinz.

Braley and Randall might end up kicking their heels. I think the other young guy they have Ben Vellacott is a Scotland age grade international, so I'm less conncered about him.

Puja wrote:

Beasties wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:
We are, but I think Mallinder and Williams have the potential to be good options in the next few seasons provided they keep developing.

I know Mallinder has his Twelvetrees moments, but I'm hoping he can eradicate those with experience.

From what I've seen of Mallinder so far he seems less prone to those 12T moments than Billy. His potential looks better and he's a big lump but he needs to sort his defending out. If he does that then he will do well. Been here before with others though.

His defence is the real problem. Nothing wrong with his technique or size, but if you watch him during a game, he backs off and backs out far too much. With his build, he should be smashing people and loving it, but he appears to have a Varndell-esque aversion to putting his shoulder in.

Hopefully that'll get beaten out of him, cause the rest of his game's very good.

Puja

Thing is, you'd have thought that if he was ever going to have a love of tackling he'd have realised it by now. Most players develop this love around mid teens? It makes me wonder if he'll ever become good at it. Never say never though, Cips tackles generally these days whilst displaying an obvious dislike for it.

He's never going to love it like Barritt does, but as long as he learns to organise a defensive line and make sure he holds his own (which he definitely should be able to) then it shouldn't be at all an issue. I'd say that going forward he needs to learn how to use his bulk better - he should be smashing players of him, but I haven't really seen that - but he was only 20 in June so he has a lot of time to get a lot better on these things.

I'd be much happier about his development if he was playing outside a high quality, attacking 10, which he just won't at Saints unless they sign someone, but as long as he's getting time he should develop fine.

He's definitely a more talented player than 12Ts, and could be a star, but he needs the right coaching and commitment. He's got better raw ingredients than anyone else we have at 12 (less technically gifted than Slade, but his bulk gives him a slight edge) but until Jones is comfortable with his defending he won't go anywhere near him

What's Mallinder's ruck work like? Can't be easy for him to match shoulder heights but that's not the only thing.

Mallinder has been carrying the ball a lot harder recently.

Beasties wrote: Thing is, you'd have thought that if he was ever going to have a love of tackling he'd have realised it by now. Most players develop this love around mid teens? It makes me wonder if he'll ever become good at it. Never say never though, Cips tackles generally these days whilst displaying an obvious dislike for it.

It's a shame that he's not in an England squad actually, as that's the kind of detail work that they could hammer into him. He needs to work with whoever taught Christian Wade, who also used to be a bit powderpuff, but now always puts his shoulder in.

Puja

Another player unavailable....

Saracens second row George Kruis has become the latest player join England's injury list ahead of the autumn Tests.

Kruis, 26, an ever-present part of Eddie Jones' England side in 2016, has had minor surgery on an ankle injury.

Sarries boss Mark McCall expects Kruis to be out for "a number of weeks", adding "we are in all in agreement it's in the best interests of the player to undergo this minor procedure now".

Very interesting to see what happens now if it is a case of Lawes vs an actual 7.

As far as I can tell Kruis has been the real lineout boss so far with Lawes probably having held the role the most after that? That could play a part.

I instantly thought Launch-Itoje but you prob have a point about the lineout. Has Itoje never ran a lineout? Would've thought it'd be like falling off a log for him.

Kruis is a big loss, but at least we have the depth at lock to cover adequately.

I'd assume Lawes comes in to the row alongside Launchbury with Itoje on the flank. After an indifferent season last year, Lawes has been playing really well so it's not a disaster.

What is happening with injury replacements? Obviously the news on Kruis and LCD is pretty fresh, but I haven't heard of any replacements being drafted in for Jones, Nowell or Watson?

I know it's a big squad, but presumably cover will be drafted in?

He does seem to be playing the best since he was last paired with Launch. The funny thing is the (rather outdated) trait of the the openside having to hare off the scrum and nail the 10 would probably suit Lawes more than any other English player. Maybe the problem has been Itoje isn't big enough to play openside and we need 6'7" Lawes.

I'm not sure that would suit Lawes. It tended to be more he and Launch closed the middle of the pitch more rapidly than most locks do (or could) and that was used to put pressure on the halves to kick the ball away, shift ball wide with pressure already in place, or get nailed.

Hartley with not a lot of time to recover from that showing which is perhaps best surmised as weak. I know I don't want him in the team, but even allowing for that bias it really wasn't a good showing.

Our best two hookers are Jamie George and daylight.

Taylor has started the season well, but Hartley does have credit in the bank, and he's confirmed as captain so that's likely that

Digby wrote:I'm not sure that would suit Lawes. It tended to be more he and Launch closed the middle of the pitch more rapidly than most locks do (or could) and that was used to put pressure on the halves to kick the ball away, shift ball wide with pressure already in place, or get nailed.

I wasn't being totally serious about putting him in the 7 shirt.

Mikey Brown wrote:

Digby wrote:I'm not sure that would suit Lawes. It tended to be more he and Launch closed the middle of the pitch more rapidly than most locks do (or could) and that was used to put pressure on the halves to kick the ball away, shift ball wide with pressure already in place, or get nailed.

I wasn't being totally serious about putting him in the 7 shirt.

I was, as usual, being totally serious

Maro had an x ray on his hand after the scarlets game.

Let's hope Itoje's hand injury is a minor one.

We can absorb the other losses, but losing Itoje would be a huge blow. He's such a massive contributor to everything.

Luckily we're not playing a vintage Sprinbok side, but these injuries are really starting to hurt us.