Re: Anti-Russian rhetoric
Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:06 pm
You deserting a critical discussion...?. I'm surprised.morepork wrote:Ciao.
You deserting a critical discussion...?. I'm surprised.morepork wrote:Ciao.
That John Barnes rap has a lot to answer forSandydragon wrote:Of course, how could I forget that!cashead wrote:I think you've described the crazy person, not kk. Also, don't forget "painting all British people with the same brush because of their colonial past, forever and ever."Sandydragon wrote:So to summarise the alternative viewpoint.
Don’t believe the British government because they lied in 2003.
Do believe Putin because he is an honest and upstanding citizen.
Poisoning people in rural British towns is fine .
The Russians were allowed to do it because the target was a cock.
The Russians were allowed to do it because sovereign governments in Eastern Europe went closer relations with NATO.
I think that covers most of the arguments from RT, Counter Punch, the Labour Party’s official spokesmen and whatever the fuck KK gets his information from.
Thankfully not everyone is that gullible.
If in doubt, blame America/Israel/the West in general/ lizard men/ new world order.
The idea that the Russians produced a secret Organophosphate Toxin 40 years ago that is super toxic and undetectable, but that:kk67 wrote:It's a helluva coincidence. And now that nice Mr.Williamson is giving them a whopping new budget.Zhivago wrote: I must say, it was really fortunate that this attack happened just 7 miles away from where our experts in this field work...
But , let's be clear, this £48million is for chemical weapons 'defence'.
Based on the reading I’ve done in the last 24 hrs:Zhivago wrote:The idea that the Russians produced a secret Organophosphate Toxin 40 years ago that is super toxic and undetectable, but that:kk67 wrote:It's a helluva coincidence. And now that nice Mr.Williamson is giving them a whopping new budget.Zhivago wrote: I must say, it was really fortunate that this attack happened just 7 miles away from where our experts in this field work...
But , let's be clear, this £48million is for chemical weapons 'defence'.
a) our secret services haven't figured it out how to produce it by now despite the US dismantling the testing facility in Uzbekistan.
b) it hasn't killed the targets despite being the most toxic and it was readily detected despite being designed to be undetectable and its origin was established relatively quickly.
That idea is hard to be convinced by.
Zhivago wrote:Here's my theory :
1. US obtained Novichok samples from while decommissioning a testing facility in Uzbekistan in 1999.
2. Skripal was helping Orbis with intel on Russian Trump dossier.
3. CIA or other US organisation (including possibly oligarchs linked to Trump) attempts assassination of Skripal to stop these activities... And uses Russian/Soviet Novichok so that all fingers are pointed at Russia/Putin
So Russia tries to assassinate him = obvious truthDigby wrote:Zhivago wrote:Here's my theory :
1. US obtained Novichok samples from while decommissioning a testing facility in Uzbekistan in 1999.
2. Skripal was helping Orbis with intel on Russian Trump dossier.
3. CIA or other US organisation (including possibly oligarchs linked to Trump) attempts assassination of Skripal to stop these activities... And uses Russian/Soviet Novichok so that all fingers are pointed at Russia/Putin
So you're basically taking Watergate and adding assassination to the cover up?
I can't see the point in considering theories tbh, not without actual evidence to back them up. If you're worried the authorities don't put out the truth in these situations then run for public office.
In situations such as this you can either decide to have some trust in the official version, or you can doubt any take on the situation. What I don't think makes any sense is to doubt an official version and support a conspiracy theory. So yes the CIA get involved in all sorts, so too MI6, so too the GRU or Mossad, and so on and so on.Zhivago wrote:So Russia tries to assassinate him = obvious truthDigby wrote:Zhivago wrote:Here's my theory :
1. US obtained Novichok samples from while decommissioning a testing facility in Uzbekistan in 1999.
2. Skripal was helping Orbis with intel on Russian Trump dossier.
3. CIA or other US organisation (including possibly oligarchs linked to Trump) attempts assassination of Skripal to stop these activities... And uses Russian/Soviet Novichok so that all fingers are pointed at Russia/Putin
So you're basically taking Watergate and adding assassination to the cover up?
I can't see the point in considering theories tbh, not without actual evidence to back them up. If you're worried the authorities don't put out the truth in these situations then run for public office.
US tries to assassinate him = conspiracy theory
What is it do you think the CIA gets up to in its spare time exactly? Conspiracy is its raison d'etre.
I'm not saying it's as I said for sure. By presenting alternative theories I am absolutely doubting what happened. It is impossible for us to know the truth about this.Digby wrote:In situations such as this you can either decide to have some trust in the official version, or you can doubt any take on the situation. What I don't think makes any sense is to doubt an official version and support a conspiracy theory. So yes the CIA get involved in all sorts, so too MI6, so too the GRU or Mossad, and so on and so on.Zhivago wrote:So Russia tries to assassinate him = obvious truthDigby wrote:
So you're basically taking Watergate and adding assassination to the cover up?
I can't see the point in considering theories tbh, not without actual evidence to back them up. If you're worried the authorities don't put out the truth in these situations then run for public office.
US tries to assassinate him = conspiracy theory
What is it do you think the CIA gets up to in its spare time exactly? Conspiracy is its raison d'etre.
I find it much more credible the truth will out in a society like ours than Russia's. I'm not for one moment suggesting we don't have lies and coverups, but it's harder in a more open society to keep the truth locked up, so if I lean one way in instances like this it'd be toward the UK and not Russia.Zhivago wrote:I'm not saying it's as I said for sure. By presenting alternative theories I am absolutely doubting what happened. It is impossible for us to know the truth about this.Digby wrote:In situations such as this you can either decide to have some trust in the official version, or you can doubt any take on the situation. What I don't think makes any sense is to doubt an official version and support a conspiracy theory. So yes the CIA get involved in all sorts, so too MI6, so too the GRU or Mossad, and so on and so on.Zhivago wrote:
So Russia tries to assassinate him = obvious truth
US tries to assassinate him = conspiracy theory
What is it do you think the CIA gets up to in its spare time exactly? Conspiracy is its raison d'etre.
You are being awfully harsh, Diggers. It is perfectly reasonably to denounce a theory, provided by scientists and experts and backed up with evidence and further experts, that puts the theory beyond reasonable doubt only to believe a theory that I assume is taken from Homeland and has absolutely no evidence whatsoever.Digby wrote:I find it much more credible the truth will out in a society like ours than Russia's. I'm not for one moment suggesting we don't have lies and coverups, but it's harder in a more open society to keep the truth locked up, so if I lean one way in instances like this it'd be toward the UK and not Russia.Zhivago wrote:I'm not saying it's as I said for sure. By presenting alternative theories I am absolutely doubting what happened. It is impossible for us to know the truth about this.Digby wrote:
In situations such as this you can either decide to have some trust in the official version, or you can doubt any take on the situation. What I don't think makes any sense is to doubt an official version and support a conspiracy theory. So yes the CIA get involved in all sorts, so too MI6, so too the GRU or Mossad, and so on and so on.
And of course there's the duck test
What evidence?!Mellsblue wrote:You are being awfully harsh, Diggers. It is perfectly reasonably to denounce a theory, provided by scientists and experts and backed up with evidence and further experts, that puts the theory beyond reasonable doubt only to believe a theory that I assume is taken from Homeland and has absolutely no evidence whatsoever.Digby wrote:I find it much more credible the truth will out in a society like ours than Russia's. I'm not for one moment suggesting we don't have lies and coverups, but it's harder in a more open society to keep the truth locked up, so if I lean one way in instances like this it'd be toward the UK and not Russia.Zhivago wrote:
I'm not saying it's as I said for sure. By presenting alternative theories I am absolutely doubting what happened. It is impossible for us to know the truth about this.
And of course there's the duck test
I did guess Homeland but you might have got it from a Matt Damon movie.Zhivago wrote:What evidence?!Mellsblue wrote:You are being awfully harsh, Diggers. It is perfectly reasonably to denounce a theory, provided by scientists and experts and backed up with evidence and further experts, that puts the theory beyond reasonable doubt only to believe a theory that I assume is taken from Homeland and has absolutely no evidence whatsoever.Digby wrote:
I find it much more credible the truth will out in a society like ours than Russia's. I'm not for one moment suggesting we don't have lies and coverups, but it's harder in a more open society to keep the truth locked up, so if I lean one way in instances like this it'd be toward the UK and not Russia.
And of course there's the duck test
You Brexiteers are dragging us into the past, ow it seems you want to bring the cold war back. Lacking an enemy of late, its it? Pathetic.Mellsblue wrote:I did guess Homeland but you might have got it from a Matt Damon movie.Zhivago wrote:What evidence?!Mellsblue wrote: You are being awfully harsh, Diggers. It is perfectly reasonably to denounce a theory, provided by scientists and experts and backed up with evidence and further experts, that puts the theory beyond reasonable doubt only to believe a theory that I assume is taken from Homeland and has absolutely no evidence whatsoever.
I voted remain.Zhivago wrote:You Brexiteers are dragging us into the past, ow it seems you want to bring the cold war back. Lacking an enemy of late, its it? Pathetic.Mellsblue wrote:I did guess Homeland but you might have got it from a Matt Damon movie.Zhivago wrote:
What evidence?!
Wtf kind of question is that?BBD wrote:Weekend at Bernies
what are we doing?
That was a good question 10 pages ago.BBD wrote:Weekend at Bernies
what are we doing?