EPS Watch / Player Form Thread

[Scrumhead]

In fairness to Ackermann, he’s only just come back from about 3 months out and was very good against Saracens and Quins.

I don’t think he’s markedly better than the list of English options listed earlier in the thread though. I’d far sooner invest in developing the likes of Jack Willis and Ted Hill as our future options at 6.

[Spiffy]

Yeah it hadn’t really occurred to me we’d even bother looking at Ackerman.

Interesting to see how far off the map Simmonds has fallen.

Has Simmonds had a long term injury or what? Have not seen much of him lately. I did think he was pretty impressive in a couple of England appearances with his speed and power, despite being on the small side. I'd have him ahead of thet useless lump, Hughes, any day.

[Scrumhead]

Simmonds has been out since October with a serious knee injury.

[Gloskarlos]

Wilson burst onto the scene from relative obscurity pretty quickly and look how everyone is waxing lyrical.

Did he though? Has he not just been a very good player playing for a not that great team for a number of years putting in consistently solid performances week in week out? I'm not remotely surprised he's done well, I am surprised Eddie picked him. For a while.

Thing is there is a plethora of back row players that do exactly that, solid performances week in week out, very good players whether their clubs are doing well or not. At Glos alone we have 4 or 5 who fit that bill. Exeter could probably state the same, and Quins.

Agree that given that synopsis for Eddie to pick him seems extraordinary. Good that he was picked though, I really like him as a player.

Quelle surprise posters stick up for their clubs, WT likes Mercer (not 100% convinced if i'm honest with myself he can break through to the senior back row) Stom likes the quins back row, I would advocate Morgan, Ludlow, even Freddie Clarke who has been phenomenal for us.

Truth is we have a number of 'very good' back row players, any of which given a small purple patch of a few games could, and possibly should, be in with a shout. Coming to consensus on who are the best three to pick individually and as a complimentary unit might never happen though.

It does beggar belief when you put that perspective on it why Shields and Hughes are anywhere near.

[Stom]

Wilson burst onto the scene from relative obscurity pretty quickly and look how everyone is waxing lyrical.

Did he though? Has he not just been a very good player playing for a not that great team for a number of years putting in consistently solid performances week in week out? I'm not remotely surprised he's done well, I am surprised Eddie picked him. For a while.

Thing is there is a plethora of back row players that do exactly that, solid performances week in week out, very good players whether their clubs are doing well or not. At Glos alone we have 4 or 5 who fit that bill. Exeter could probably state the same, and Quins.

Agree that given that synopsis for Eddie to pick him seems extraordinary. Good that he was picked though, I really like him as a player.

Quelle surprise posters stick up for their clubs, WT likes Mercer (not 100% convinced if i'm honest with myself he can break through to the senior back row) Stom likes the quins back row, I would advocate Morgan, Ludlow, even Freddie Clarke who has been phenomenal for us.

Truth is we have a number of 'very good' back row players, any of which given a small purple patch of a few games could, and possibly should, be in with a shout. Coming to consensus on who are the best three to pick individually and as a complimentary unit might never happen though.

It does beggar belief when you put that perspective on it why Shields and Hughes are anywhere near.

If Renaldo Bothma was pulling up trees and was EQP, I would not be calling for him to be picked... As he's not English. Just like Ackerman, he's only EQ through a single club contract. And for me, that's just not enough to play for a nation.

Especially when we're talking about a player who's not demonstrably better than actually English players who came through the system or have been here for longer than a single contract.

[Raggs]

Did he though? Has he not just been a very good player playing for a not that great team for a number of years putting in consistently solid performances week in week out? I'm not remotely surprised he's done well, I am surprised Eddie picked him. For a while.

Thing is there is a plethora of back row players that do exactly that, solid performances week in week out, very good players whether their clubs are doing well or not. At Glos alone we have 4 or 5 who fit that bill. Exeter could probably state the same, and Quins.

Agree that given that synopsis for Eddie to pick him seems extraordinary. Good that he was picked though, I really like him as a player.

Quelle surprise posters stick up for their clubs, WT likes Mercer (not 100% convinced if i'm honest with myself he can break through to the senior back row) Stom likes the quins back row, I would advocate Morgan, Ludlow, even Freddie Clarke who has been phenomenal for us.

Truth is we have a number of 'very good' back row players, any of which given a small purple patch of a few games could, and possibly should, be in with a shout. Coming to consensus on who are the best three to pick individually and as a complimentary unit might never happen though.

It does beggar belief when you put that perspective on it why Shields and Hughes are anywhere near.

If Renaldo Bothma was pulling up trees and was EQP, I would not be calling for him to be picked... As he's not English. Just like Ackerman, he's only EQ through a single club contract. And for me, that's just not enough to play for a nation.

Especially when we're talking about a player who's not demonstrably better than actually English players who came through the system or have been here for longer than a single contract.

Why is Armand different? You've called for him to be picked.

[Which Tyler]

Quelle surprise posters stick up for their clubs, WT likes Mercer (not 100% convinced if i'm honest with myself he can break through to the senior back row) Stom likes the quins back row, I would advocate Morgan, Ludlow, even Freddie Clarke who has been phenomenal for us.

Fair to call me out - though I do think you're being harsh on Mercer who absolutely has standout qualities that put him above the crowd (for me) - whether you like that stand out quality, or think it would translate to the international scene is absolutely fair.
For me, if I were to be picking a Bath player to propose as one of the crowd, it'd be Ellis (and I do propose him, but as one of many who are at the same level as Ackermann). Besides, it's not like I'm a solitary voice calling for Eddie to have a look at Mercer.

[Digby]

Quelle surprise posters stick up for their clubs, WT likes Mercer (not 100% convinced if i'm honest with myself he can break through to the senior back row) Stom likes the quins back row, I would advocate Morgan, Ludlow, even Freddie Clarke who has been phenomenal for us.

Fair to call me out - though I do think you're being harsh on Mercer who absolutely has standout qualities that put him above the crowd (for me) - whether you like that stand out quality, or think it would translate to the international scene is absolutely fair.
For me, if I were to be picking a Bath player to propose as one of the crowd, it'd be Ellis (and I do propose him, but as one of many who are at the same level as Ackermann). Besides, it's not like I'm a solitary voice calling for Eddie to have a look at Mercer.

I'd have been involving Mercer a lot more too, and I promise not to push Moseley players for England. Not least as the closest we come post Jan is something like Buster Lawrence (son of former England fast bowler Syd Lawrence)

[Gloskarlos]

Did he though? Has he not just been a very good player playing for a not that great team for a number of years putting in consistently solid performances week in week out? I'm not remotely surprised he's done well, I am surprised Eddie picked him. For a while.

Thing is there is a plethora of back row players that do exactly that, solid performances week in week out, very good players whether their clubs are doing well or not. At Glos alone we have 4 or 5 who fit that bill. Exeter could probably state the same, and Quins.

Agree that given that synopsis for Eddie to pick him seems extraordinary. Good that he was picked though, I really like him as a player.

Quelle surprise posters stick up for their clubs, WT likes Mercer (not 100% convinced if i'm honest with myself he can break through to the senior back row) Stom likes the quins back row, I would advocate Morgan, Ludlow, even Freddie Clarke who has been phenomenal for us.

Truth is we have a number of 'very good' back row players, any of which given a small purple patch of a few games could, and possibly should, be in with a shout. Coming to consensus on who are the best three to pick individually and as a complimentary unit might never happen though.

It does beggar belief when you put that perspective on it why Shields and Hughes are anywhere near.

If Renaldo Bothma was pulling up trees and was EQP, I would not be calling for him to be picked... As he's not English. Just like Ackerman, he's only EQ through a single club contract. And for me, that's just not enough to play for a nation.

Especially when we're talking about a player who's not demonstrably better than actually English players who came through the system or have been here for longer than a single contract.

Not once have I advocated Ackermann for England if you look back. I am in agreement with you for the most part.

WT, I would have Mercer at Glos very readily, I think hes a great player, I just can't see, right at this minute, that he should be in the England back row. He may well get there and should potentially be given opportunities to do so, along with several others that have been mentioned here.

[Oakboy]

It does beggar belief when you put that perspective on it why Shields and Hughes are anywhere near.

We are back to 'our team' v 'Jones's team'. He tried Simmonds and seemed simply not to like his type of lightweight, pacey game. I assume his obsession with bulk rules his head in selection and that's that. I can just (and only just) see a case for Hughes as a direct replacement for Billy to stay with the prescribed game plan. Once Jones is gone, we'll probably see radical change, assuming the blazers employ someone with a brain (not a given!).

[Which Tyler]

WT, I would have Mercer at Glos very readily, I think hes a great player, I just can't see, right at this minute, that he should be in the England back row. He may well get there and should potentially be given opportunities to do so, along with several others that have been mentioned here.

Specifically on Mercer (I wonder why this is peaking my interest?) I more want him involved, than necessarily selecting him. He certainly wouldn't be first choice in any position; but I'd have him ahead of Hughes or Shields for N8 or BSF; and love the idea of him on the bench, covering all 3 BR positions and providing a hell of an impact against tired legs; especially if Billy has been tiring them for a bit. Of course, I'd have 3-4 BSFs ahead of him to start at 6; and more OSFs there; but only Billy and Morgan ahead of him at 8.
Hell, I'm not sure he starts for Bath with everyone fit! (though he did earn a place ahead of Faletau on merit this season, before Taulupe's injury)

[Gloskarlos]

WT, I would have Mercer at Glos very readily, I think hes a great player, I just can't see, right at this minute, that he should be in the England back row. He may well get there and should potentially be given opportunities to do so, along with several others that have been mentioned here.

Specifically on Mercer (I wonder why this is peaking my interest?) I more want him involved, than necessarily selecting him. He certainly wouldn't be first choice in any position; but I'd have him ahead of Hughes or Shields for N8 or BSF; and love the idea of him on the bench, covering all 3 BR positions and providing a hell of an impact against tired legs; especially if Billy has been tiring them for a bit. Of course, I'd have 3-4 BSFs ahead of him to start at 6; and more OSFs there; but only Billy and Morgan ahead of him at 8.
Hell, I'm not sure he starts for Bath with everyone fit! (though he did earn a place ahead of Faletau on merit this season, before Taulupe's injury)

Then I think we are actually of the same mind.

[Digby]

I would like to see Simmonds again in a side featuring Genge or Mako, George, Sinckler, Itoje, possibly Billy, Manu and Cockanasiga.

Simmonds and Cockanasiga going wide with all those options holding a defence from drifting gives a real problem to defensive resource allocation

[Mikey Brown]

Yep.

Also there was a lot of chat about Simmonds not really being an 8. He's certainly not a Billy style 8, and Baxter's consistency in selecting Kvesic there suggests being an 8 for Exeter doesn't really mean much in terms of how anyone else should view you.

[twitchy]

Dombrandt would seem to me to be the next best thing after billy. Big carrier but has a rugby brain.

[Stom]

Dombrandt would seem to me to be the next best thing after billy. Big carrier but has a rugby brain.

TBF, while he's looked mighty impressive, let's not forget it's his first season and he will have a dip. Time is on his side, let him develop.

[twitchy]

Dombrandt would seem to me to be the next best thing after billy. Big carrier but has a rugby brain.

TBF, while he's looked mighty impressive, let's not forget it's his first season and he will have a dip. Time is on his side, let him develop.

Sure but billy isn't exactly going where soon either.

[Raggs]

Dan Robson has blood clots in his leg(s) apparently, season possibly over.

[Gloskarlos]

Dan Robson has blood clots in his leg(s) apparently, season possibly over.

Probably not helped by sitting on a bench for extended periods of time.

Poor bloke, sounds horrendous.

[Scrumhead]

Yikes. Sounds awful. Hopefully he’s OK.

[Gloskarlos]

Sounds very serious - this from the Times this morning

"Dan Robson has developed blood clots and he is unlikely to play again this season, dealing a serious blow to his hopes of gaining selection for the World Cup in Japan in the autumn.

The Wasps scrum half was due to be on the bench against Scotland today but he left England’s training base on Tuesday after alerting the medical staff to a pain in his leg.

Robson, 27, who has two England caps, developed the clots spontaneously, rather than as a result of a contact injury. He was taken for immediate medical treatment because the condition can be life-threatening. Blood clots can form in veins or arteries.

Specialists are investigating the cause of the problem, with Robson due to undergo tests this weekend. It is understood that he faces months out of action. An extended period on the sidelines risks damaging his chances of winning a place in England’s 31-man squad for the World Cup.

England’s first pre-tournament training camp, for players not involved in the Gallagher Premiership play-offs, begins at the end of June. There are then three warm-up games in August before Eddie Jones, the head coach, has to finalise his squad.

Jones is likely to take only two scrum halves to the World Cup, with Ben Youngs certain to play a part. Robson was already facing stiff competition from experienced rivals Richard Wigglesworth and Danny Care. With both of them injured, Ben Spencer will get a chance to impress after the Saracens scrum half received a call-up to replace Robson on the bench for today’s game.

The RFU initially described Robson’s unavailability as “illness” as they waited for his condition to be assessed. “He’s got some investigations and consultations going on,” Steve Borthwick, the England forwards coach, said on Wednesday. “We’re trying to investigate exactly what it is.”

Quite apart from the serious nature of the condition, the timing for Robson is cruel given how long he has had to wait for his England chance despite his consistently outstanding form for Wasps. Jones selected Robson for the first time last summer but used Spencer as back-up for Youngs in South Africa.

Robson was due to be involved in the autumn but he missed England’s four-game series after requiring surgery to repair ankle ligament damage.

When Robson did eventually win England selection at the start of the Six Nations, he was kept on the bench for the victory over Ireland before making his debut in the final ten minutes of the win against France. Jones did not use him in the defeat by Wales but Robson made a 19-minute appearance against Italy last week, scoring a try in England’s 57-14 win.

An RFU spokesman said: “Dan Robson suffered blood clots which arose spontaneously earlier this week and is being evaluated and treated by specialists at the moment. At this stage it is too early to give a return-to-play date.”

[Oakboy]

I hope that is not as serious for Robson as it sounds. Jones really has backed himself into a corner with his SH policy. Serious injury to Youngs would create quite a crisis at this point.

[Digby]

Is that still treated with rat poison or have things progressed?

[Stom]

Is that still treated with rat poison or have things progressed?

Progressed. My sister had them and made a full recovery quickly and easily. It's seen as life threatening, but I don't think it's quite as bad as it was just 10 years ago.

[Digby]

Is that still treated with rat poison or have things progressed?

Progressed. My sister had them and made a full recovery quickly and easily. It's seen as life threatening, but I don't think it's quite as bad as it was just 10 years ago.

Excellent, for Robson and your sister