RugbyRebels

Surprised Smith's gone out on loan. I'd've thought he was ready for Prem rugby based on what we saw of him last year.

Puja

Agreed Puja that's an odd move. Especially with Heinz at 9 and the option to have an experienced midfield outside of him. Unless they think a few months of senior rugby to get him firing and then once the Lions guys are back in and the rest of the team is settled they can start introducing him.

Hmm - that is an odd one. By my reckoning that leaves Owen Williams and Billy Searle with Shillcock covering. Not terrible, but hardly stellar and from what I’ve seen of Fin Smith, I’d certainly have kept him in the squad. He made a huge difference in the final U20s game against Italy. They were coming right back in to it until his game management turned the game strongly back in our favour.

Thought Smith was bound to be in the matchday 23 at the very least.

Be very surprised if he stays with Ampthill for the entire season.

It's especially weird because of the lower quality of Ampthill. I get that they're who Worcester's dual reg agreement is with, but I'm dubious how much he'll learn and develop with the players and coaches available at Ampthill.

Puja

Insert comment about him wishing to play at Goldington Road

Mr Mwenda wrote:Insert comment about him wishing to play at Goldington Road

Lol. Was going to post that he heard he was being loaned to a club in Bedfordshire and just assumed his prayers had been answered.

Puja wrote:Surprised Smith's gone out on loan. I'd've thought he was ready for Prem rugby based on what we saw of him last year.

Puja

As a Quins fan that was a terrifying new page post.

Danno wrote:

Puja wrote:Surprised Smith's gone out on loan. I'd've thought he was ready for Prem rugby based on what we saw of him last year.

Puja

As a Quins fan that was a terrifying new page post.

Sorry!

(not that sorry)

Puja

I THINK Finn Smith is out of contract end of season which might make it even more juicier.

Tigersman wrote:I THINK Finn Smith is out of contract end of season which might make it even more juicier.

Maybe that's why they've shipped him off to Ampthill? Get him out of the shop window while they lock down a new contract?

Puja

Puja wrote:

Tigersman wrote:I THINK Finn Smith is out of contract end of season which might make it even more juicier.

Maybe that's why they've shipped him off to Ampthill? Get him out of the shop window while they lock down a new contract?

Puja

Yes coming off the bench for Ampthill is one way to remain off the radar. I don't think anyone can approach him until end of January officially. He could have told them that he sees his future elsewhere and so they've sent him off to the Championship just to get him out of the squad.

FKAS wrote:

Puja wrote:

Tigersman wrote:I THINK Finn Smith is out of contract end of season which might make it even more juicier.

Maybe that's why they've shipped him off to Ampthill? Get him out of the shop window while they lock down a new contract?

Puja

Yes coming off the bench for Ampthill is one way to remain off the radar. I don't think anyone can approach him until end of January officially. He could have told them that he sees his future elsewhere and so they've sent him off to the Championship just to get him out of the squad.

I’m sure I read in the rugby paper recently that clubs are now allowed to officially approach players any time in their last 12 months of contract. Not sure if that correct or not?

Timbo wrote:

FKAS wrote:

Puja wrote:
Maybe that's why they've shipped him off to Ampthill? Get him out of the shop window while they lock down a new contract?

Puja

Yes coming off the bench for Ampthill is one way to remain off the radar. I don't think anyone can approach him until end of January officially. He could have told them that he sees his future elsewhere and so they've sent him off to the Championship just to get him out of the squad.

I’m sure I read in the rugby paper recently that clubs are now allowed to officially approach players any time in their last 12 months of contract. Not sure if that correct or not?

Could well be. I'm not up to scratch on such things but I'm sure I've heard previously that there's different timescales depending on the player's age. If they are under 21 I think it used to be January though that may have changed.

Even if there's no official offer at the minute I'm sure his agent is having lunch with a few chairman of clubs to discuss the agent's represented players. One of whom might just be Smith. As with all these things the official deal will be dated within the deadline but the majority of the negotiations done long before then.

Who could use a young fly-half? Wasps, Quins, Exeter, Bath, Glaws, Briz, Northampton, and Saracens all have young tyros of their own. Sale have Wilkinson, although he's a bit older than the average tyro without having broken through. Leicester have Lancaster, although he could just as easily be developed as a centre. Do Newcastle have anyone? Irish? You wouldn't've said they were a significant step up from Wuss.

Puja

Puja wrote:Who could use a young fly-half? Wasps, Quins, Exeter, Bath, Glaws, Briz, Northampton, and Saracens all have young tyros of their own. Sale have Wilkinson, although he's a bit older than the average tyro without having broken through. Leicester have Lancaster, although he could just as easily be developed as a centre. Do Newcastle have anyone? Irish? You wouldn't've said they were a significant step up from Wuss.

Puja

Irish would be the obvious choice though as you say not the best option. Falcons have a couple of good youngsters one of whom came off the bench last weekend though they are pretty desperate given Connon is now their only senior option, Hodgson being always injured. Again not the best option though both those clubs would be offering game time and probably more salary due to their need.

Chiefs have Skinner but he's already 23 and doesn't look more than a squad player. Signing someone who could be genuine competition for Simmonds might be a good option. They do have that Wales under 20s flyhalf as well as the dual qualified guy from Australia but their lack of game time so far is its own indicator.

Tigers if the rumours around Ford possibly taking the cash abroad are true could make a move. Burns mentoring Lancaster and Smith would potentially be a good long term plan with Lancaster equally able to play 12.

Bristol are going to lose Sheedy possibly next summer unless there's some extension clauses in his contract due to the Welsh selection rules. Finn Smith in with Lloyd would maybe be to inexperienced for them but they can't keep putting their eggs in a basket for the Welsh to take home.

Puja wrote:Who could use a young fly-half? Wasps, Quins, Exeter, Bath, Glaws, Briz, Northampton, and Saracens all have young tyros of their own. Sale have Wilkinson, although he's a bit older than the average tyro without having broken through. Leicester have Lancaster, although he could just as easily be developed as a centre. Do Newcastle have anyone? Irish? You wouldn't've said they were a significant step up from Wuss.

Puja

Falcons have Louie Johnson who has just come up out of the Academy.

Bristol have dual registered out pretty much the whole academy!

Alex Groves – Hartpury (GKIPA Championship)
Deago Bailey – Hartpury (GKIPA Championship)
Jac Lloyd – Clifton (National Two South)
Tomas Gwilliam – Clifton (National Two South)
George Taylor – Clifton (National Two South)
Matty Jones – Dings Crusaders (National Two South)
Ben Bamber – Dings Crusaders (National Two South)
Harry Rowson – Dings Crusaders (National Two South)
Dylan Power – Dings Crusaders (National Two South)
Jamie Collier - Dings Crusaders (National Two South)
Chay Mullins – Taunton Titans (National Two South)
Charlie Rice – Taunton Titans (National Two South)
Costa Galatalis – Hornets (SW Premier)
Tom Sims – Hornets (SW Premier)
JJ Williams – Weston-super-Mare (SW Premier)

FKAS wrote:

Puja wrote:Who could use a young fly-half? Wasps, Quins, Exeter, Bath, Glaws, Briz, Northampton, and Saracens all have young tyros of their own. Sale have Wilkinson, although he's a bit older than the average tyro without having broken through. Leicester have Lancaster, although he could just as easily be developed as a centre. Do Newcastle have anyone? Irish? You wouldn't've said they were a significant step up from Wuss.

Puja

Irish would be the obvious choice though as you say not the best option. Falcons have a couple of good youngsters one of whom came off the bench last weekend though they are pretty desperate given Connon is now their only senior option, Hodgson being always injured. Again not the best option though both those clubs would be offering game time and probably more salary due to their need.

Chiefs have Skinner but he's already 23 and doesn't look more than a squad player. Signing someone who could be genuine competition for Simmonds might be a good option. They do have that Wales under 20s flyhalf as well as the dual qualified guy from Australia but their lack of game time so far is its own indicator.

Tigers if the rumours around Ford possibly taking the cash abroad are true could make a move. Burns mentoring Lancaster and Smith would potentially be a good long term plan with Lancaster equally able to play 12.

Bristol are going to lose Sheedy possibly next summer unless there's some extension clauses in his contract due to the Welsh selection rules. Finn Smith in with Lloyd would maybe be to inexperienced for them but they can't keep putting their eggs in a basket for the Welsh to take home.

Yep. Good summary.

Hadn’t really occurred to me how reliant Exeter are on Joe Simmonds until he went down injured last week.

Harvey Skinner is an OK player, but not really someone you’d really want to rely on if your main man is out of action. Particularly not in a team chasing silverware.

Fin Smith could do a lot worse than going down there and having the same kind of phased introduction Simmonds had with Steenson.

London Irish wouldn’t be a bad gig either. Even if people are put off by Paddy Jackson’s off-field history, on the park, he’s still a very good 10 to learn from in terms of game management etc.

Or .. if he stays at Worcester, it’s hardly like Owen Williams and Billy Searle are major blockers. Maybe right now, but in a year or two, definitely not.

FKAS wrote: Bristol are going to lose Sheedy possibly next summer unless there's some extension clauses in his contract due to the Welsh selection rules. Finn Smith in with Lloyd would maybe be to inexperienced for them but they can't keep putting their eggs in a basket for the Welsh to take home

Missed this - Sheedy extended his deal last year so assume he's got at least 2 more seasons & probably 3. Lloyd signed a 4 year deal (19/20 season) and think he extended as well.

jimKRFC wrote:

FKAS wrote: Bristol are going to lose Sheedy possibly next summer unless there's some extension clauses in his contract due to the Welsh selection rules. Finn Smith in with Lloyd would maybe be to inexperienced for them but they can't keep putting their eggs in a basket for the Welsh to take home

Missed this - Sheedy extended his deal last year so assume he's got at least 2 more seasons & probably 3. Lloyd signed a 4 year deal (19/20 season) and think he extended as well.

Yes quite right they added on another year for Sheedy to 2022 about a year after his last renewal. I'd missed the second contract top up.

Epaminondas Pules wrote:

Puja wrote:Who could use a young fly-half? Wasps, Quins, Exeter, Bath, Glaws, Briz, Northampton, and Saracens all have young tyros of their own. Sale have Wilkinson, although he's a bit older than the average tyro without having broken through. Leicester have Lancaster, although he could just as easily be developed as a centre. Do Newcastle have anyone? Irish? You wouldn't've said they were a significant step up from Wuss.

Puja

Falcons have Louie Johnson who has just come up out of the Academy.

And they are starting 20 year old Will Haydon-Wood for the game this weekend. They might just find long term answers to the playmaker question already at home.

Adam_P wrote:I think I might add Litchfield to the ones to watch for Saints. Wasn't sure he'd get much first team time this season, but he's featured heavily in pre season so maybe Boyd is keen

Not taken long to get invovled - he's on the bench against Exeter tomorrow.

Adam_P wrote:

Adam_P wrote:I think I might add Litchfield to the ones to watch for Saints. Wasn't sure he'd get much first team time this season, but he's featured heavily in pre season so maybe Boyd is keen

Not taken long to get invovled - he's on the bench against Exeter tomorrow.

Never forget he’s from Bedford

Adam_P wrote:

Adam_P wrote:I think I might add Litchfield to the ones to watch for Saints. Wasn't sure he'd get much first team time this season, but he's featured heavily in pre season so maybe Boyd is keen

Not taken long to get invovled - he's on the bench against Exeter tomorrow.

12 for Bedford this week.