Edinburgh 25/26

[BaldiePete]

That’s a long list of unavailable players. The players listed as being rested were going to have to get that break at some point. Everitt probably thought the best chance of a win was the home match against Toulon so play them last week, rest them this week and then see what the youngsters can do. I would expect them to lose but hopefully they’ll learn from the experience. Not having a lock on the bench is bad but they have six full time professionals listed as locks and four of them are unavailable. I suppose they could have brought in an academy player but didn’t want to risk it. It will definitely go tits up in the 2nd half when Young and Hunter-Hill are knackered (or if they get injured at any time) and they have to move a back row (McConnell?) into the 2nd row. Given that it’s a young team anyway I’d rather they brought in an academy 2nd row.

There’s precisely zero chance of a win away at Bath but it’s definitely possible to beat Gloucester in Edinburgh. The top 4 in the group qualify for the knockouts so that should be enough and definitely enough to drop into the diddy cup.

[BaldiePete]

Nilled FFS, how very Edinburgh after beating Toulon last week. They had opportunities in the first half but couldn’t take them. I was watching a recording but accidentally saw the result early in the 2nd half so saved myself the pain of watching the last 35 minutes by switching over to watch the Bath match live.

#EverittOut

[Cameo]

That was a bit of a weird game. As you say, actually quite an encouraging first half. Second half the pressure told, but so did the injuries. Think they ended with a back three of Boyle, Shiel and McConnell.

Castre were quite fun, some cool moves in the backs.

Some promise from the youngsters. Douglas got at least three turnovers, one of them a great one after a break by Castre. OBL looked solid again. Mikey Jones looked decent when he came on. Lewis Wells looks like a good player and boy do we need some young wings.

[septic 9]

That was a bit of a weird game. As you say, actually quite an encouraging first half. Second half the pressure told, but so did the injuries. Think they ended with a back three of Boyle, Shiel and McConnell.

Castre were quite fun, some cool moves in the backs.

Some promise from the youngsters. Douglas got at least three turnovers, one of them a great one after a break by Castre. OBL looked solid again. Mikey Jones looked decent when he came on. Lewis Wells looks like a good player and boy do we need some young wings.

yes, injuries before the game and during it were very unfortunate, but until Edinburgh have a coach who has a clue how to manage a squad it won't really become clear what Edinburgh need player wise. Except a scrum half

[BaldiePete]

In today’s least surprising news Venter is going back to SA with the Lions.

[BaldiePete]

In today’s least surprising news Venter is going back to SA with the Lions.

[BaldiePete]

The Weegies have done a Rassie and named their team yesterday (Tuesday), four days before the 1872 game against Edinburgh this weekend. It would need a massive brain fart of truly epic proportions for this team to lose to Edinburgh. I just hope we can make them work for it.

Ollie Smith, Kyle Steyn (capt), Stafford McDowall, Sione Tuipulotu, Jamie Dobie; Adam Hastings, George Horne; Nathan McBeth, Gregor Hiddleston, Zander Fagerson, Max Williamson, Scott Cummings, Matt Fagerson, Rory Darge, Jack Dempsey.

Replacements: Seb Stephen, Rory Sutherland, Sam Talakai, Alex Craig, Gregor Brown, Ally Miller, Ben Afshar, Dan Lancaster.

[septic 9]

The Weegies have done a Rassie and named their team yesterday (Tuesday), four days before the 1872 game against Edinburgh this weekend. It would need a massive brain fart of truly epic proportions for this team to lose to Edinburgh. I just hope we can make them work for it.

Ollie Smith, Kyle Steyn (capt), Stafford McDowall, Sione Tuipulotu, Jamie Dobie; Adam Hastings, George Horne; Nathan McBeth, Gregor Hiddleston, Zander Fagerson, Max Williamson, Scott Cummings, Matt Fagerson, Rory Darge, Jack Dempsey.

Replacements: Seb Stephen, Rory Sutherland, Sam Talakai, Alex Craig, Gregor Brown, Ally Miller, Ben Afshar, Dan Lancaster.

there is no reason why an Edin team like this should not be competitive
Shoeman Ashman Hill Gilchrist Hunter-Hill McConnell Douglas Bradbury Vellacott Scott VDM O'Connor Currie Graham Goosen. Bench Morris Venter OBL Young Dodd Shiel Thomson Wells

And that will be pretty close to what is selected (I expect Everitt to swop Young and CHH))
At least no reason on paper, except at scrum half, why they should be be very competitive

[septic 9]

the early naming of he team is an attempt to drum up extra fans for Hampden on the back of that magnificent come back win over Toulouse

[BaldiePete]

The Weegies have done a Rassie and named their team yesterday (Tuesday), four days before the 1872 game against Edinburgh this weekend. It would need a massive brain fart of truly epic proportions for this team to lose to Edinburgh. I just hope we can make them work for it.

Ollie Smith, Kyle Steyn (capt), Stafford McDowall, Sione Tuipulotu, Jamie Dobie; Adam Hastings, George Horne; Nathan McBeth, Gregor Hiddleston, Zander Fagerson, Max Williamson, Scott Cummings, Matt Fagerson, Rory Darge, Jack Dempsey.

Replacements: Seb Stephen, Rory Sutherland, Sam Talakai, Alex Craig, Gregor Brown, Ally Miller, Ben Afshar, Dan Lancaster.

there is no reason why an Edin team like this should not be competitive
Shoeman Ashman Hill Gilchrist Hunter-Hill McConnell Douglas Bradbury Vellacott Scott VDM O'Connor Currie Graham Goosen. Bench Morris Venter OBL Young Dodd Shiel Thomson Wells

And that will be pretty close to what is selected (I expect Everitt to swop Young and CHH))
At least no reason on paper, except at scrum half, why they should be be very competitive

I think the important word there is ‘should’. I think we can all agree that Edinburgh have good players but they don’t have a good coach, they are mentally weak and don’t have the strength of will and team spirit that Glasgow have. That’s down to Everitt.

[BaldiePete]

Good news today. McConnell has signed on for another two years.

[septic 9]

The Weegies have done a Rassie and named their team yesterday (Tuesday), four days before the 1872 game against Edinburgh this weekend. It would need a massive brain fart of truly epic proportions for this team to lose to Edinburgh. I just hope we can make them work for it.

Ollie Smith, Kyle Steyn (capt), Stafford McDowall, Sione Tuipulotu, Jamie Dobie; Adam Hastings, George Horne; Nathan McBeth, Gregor Hiddleston, Zander Fagerson, Max Williamson, Scott Cummings, Matt Fagerson, Rory Darge, Jack Dempsey.

Replacements: Seb Stephen, Rory Sutherland, Sam Talakai, Alex Craig, Gregor Brown, Ally Miller, Ben Afshar, Dan Lancaster.

there is no reason why an Edin team like this should not be competitive
Shoeman Ashman Hill Gilchrist Hunter-Hill McConnell Douglas Bradbury Vellacott Scott VDM O'Connor Currie Graham Goosen. Bench Morris Venter OBL Young Dodd Shiel Thomson Wells

And that will be pretty close to what is selected (I expect Everitt to swop Young and CHH))
At least no reason on paper, except at scrum half, why they should be be very competitive

I think the important word there is ‘should’. I think we can all agree that Edinburgh have good players but they don’t have a good coach, they are mentally weak and don’t have the strength of will and team spirit that Glasgow have. That’s down to Everitt.

yes, "should" is doing some heavy lifting. But I think the issue for Edinburgh is much deeper.
Their current performances are certainly not helped by Everitt, but the up and down and mental frigidity long pre-dates him.
The odd (and from a Glasgow perspective worrying and annoying) thing is that Edinburgh (with the odd exception) invariably up their game hugely to play Glasgow. The players for a decade have clearly seen it as way more than a derby, bragging rights match. Again this season, Everitt has basically admitted prioritising it over europe.
So why is this, why are these players (and their predecessors) unable to raise their game consistently to the same intensity outside a couple of games a season? The answer I'm afraid is the same old...... they may have moved to the Hive on match days but still change in Murrayfield. Still train where the Scotland coach works. Its still too cosy. and still too much of a couple of games v Glasgow and your Scotland squad place is secured - and whether or not that is true it is IMHO how the players feel subconsciously at least

[BaldiePete]

Edinburgh team is pretty much as expected. Very pleased that OBL is getting another start.

15.⁠ ⁠Wes Goosen (62)

14.⁠ ⁠Darcy Graham (86)
13.⁠ ⁠Matt Currie (65)
12.⁠ ⁠Piers O’Conor (7)
11.⁠ ⁠Duhan van der Merwe (108)

10.⁠ ⁠Cammy Scott (23)
9.⁠ ⁠Ben Vellacott (81)

1.⁠ ⁠Pierre Schoeman (140)
2.⁠ ⁠Ewan Ashman (44)
3.⁠ ⁠Ollie Blyth-Lafferty (3)
4.⁠ ⁠Glen Young (54)
5.⁠ ⁠Grant Gilchrist (225)
6.⁠ ⁠Liam McConnell (12)
7.⁠ ⁠Dylan Richardson (5)
8.⁠ ⁠Magnus Bradbury (140) CAPTAIN

Replacements

16.⁠ ⁠Harri Morris (8)
17.⁠ ⁠Boan Venter (96)
18.⁠ ⁠Paul Hill (21)
19.⁠ ⁠Callum Hunter-Hill (23)
20.⁠ ⁠Freddy Douglas (11)
21.⁠ ⁠Conor McAlpine (3)
22.⁠ ⁠Ross Thompson (29)
23.⁠ ⁠Matt Davidson (1)

Unavailable Charlie McCaig (knee), Rhys Litterick (achilles), Rob Carmichael (wrist), Mosese Tuipulotu (knee), Tom Currie (knee), Luke Crosbie (hamstring), D’arcy Rae (ankle), Sam Skinner (hamstring), Paddy Harrison (back), Ben Muncaster (knee), Marshall Sykes (arm), Harry Paterson (hamstring), Findlay Thomson (hand), James Lang (shoulder), Ross McCann (concussion), Jack Brown (concussion), Ross McKnight (ankle).

[Cameo]

Not a bad looking team. Problem is the weakest spots are probably the playmaking ones.

Any news on how long Paterson is out for? Or Harrison?

[Cameo]

Also, should we be worried that so many on the injured list have basically never played? Are these players all getting injured in training?

[BaldiePete]

I think most of those got injured playing, certainly they’ve had games. Litterick was injured in a pre-season friendly. Tuipulotu was injured last season playing against Connacht.

[BaldiePete]

Edinburgh team for the return leg. Lang has recovered from injury so at least they have two actual centres in the team. OBL drops to the bench with his brother, set for his debut, also on the bench. We’ll see how much Everitt thinks of OBL’s prospects by the timing of the tighthead substitution. if Hill gets 75 minutes that’s seriously going to dent his opportunities in the future. It’s a decent set of forwards but I expect the ball will still be kicked away too much and the backs will be blunt in attack since Everitt doesn’t have a game plan which could bring Graham and VDM into the game.

15.⁠ ⁠Wes Goosen (63)

14.⁠ ⁠Darcy Graham (87)
13.⁠ ⁠Matt Currie (66)
12.⁠ ⁠James Lang (81)
11.⁠ ⁠Duhan van der Merwe (109)

10.⁠ ⁠Cammy Scott (24)
9.⁠ ⁠Ben Vellacott (82)

1.⁠ ⁠Pierre Schoeman (141)
2.⁠ ⁠Harri Morris (9)
3.⁠ ⁠Paul Hill (22)
4.⁠ ⁠Glen Young (55)
5.⁠ ⁠Grant Gilchrist (226)
6.⁠ ⁠Liam McConnell (13)
7.⁠ ⁠Dylan Richardson (6)
8.⁠ ⁠Magnus Bradbury (141) CAPTAIN

Replacements

16.⁠ ⁠Jerry Blyth-Lafferty*
17.⁠ ⁠Boan Venter (97)
18.⁠ ⁠Ollie Blyth-Lafferty (4)
19.⁠ ⁠Callum Hunter-Hill (24)
20.⁠ ⁠Freddy Douglas (12)
21.⁠ ⁠Charlie Shiel (80)
22.⁠ ⁠Ross Thompson (30)
23.⁠ ⁠Jack Brown (5)

Unavailable Charlie McCaig (knee), Rhys Litterick (achilles), Rob Carmichael (wrist), Mosese Tuipulotu (knee), Tom Currie (knee), Luke Crosbie (hamstring), D’arcy Rae (ankle), Sam Skinner (hamstring), Paddy Harrison (back), Ben Muncaster (knee), Marshall Sykes (arm), Harry Paterson (hamstring), Findlay Thomson (hand), Ross McKnight (ankle), Ewan Ashman (concussion), Piers O’Conor (concussion).

[BaldiePete]

Glasgow side. There’s been some rotation in the forwards but that’s a very strong bench in the forwards.

1 Patrick Schickerling (15)
2 Johnny Matthews (103)
3 Sam Talakai (29)
4 Alex Craig (7)
5 Alex Samuel (46)
6 Matt Fagerson (132)
7 Angus Fraser (22)
8 Jack Dempsey (59)

9 George Horne (147)
10 Adam Hastings (78)
11 Jamie Dobie (95)
12 Sione Tuipulotu (75)
13 Stafford McDowall (102)
14 Kyle Steyn (C) (99)
15 Ollie Smith (52)

Replacements

16 Gregor Hiddleston (34)
17 Nathan McBeth (63)
18 Zander Fagerson (165)
19 Scott Cummings (149)
20 Gregor Brown (43)
21 Rory Darge (71)
22 Ben Afshar (27)
23 Dan Lancaster (8)

Unavailable for selection: Jamie Bhatti (calf), Euan Ferrie (ankle), Huw Jones (ankle), Josh McKay (hamstring), Kyle Rowe (knee), Charlie Savala (knee), Tavi Tuipulotu (knee)

[Cameo]

The other worry is that a big performance in a wet weather game doesn't really tell us much about their big weakness over the last few years, an inability to play at pace or create much in the backs.

Even Scotland in the early 2000s won the odd big game in the wet. Great days but don't make for great seasons.

Don't like to say "told you so" (okay, I do), but this came to mind when I saw Everitt referring to their game against Toulon when asked about Edinburgh's attack today.

I'm afraid he needs to go. It's not all on him, but he has shown no indication he is the right person to fix it.

[BaldiePete]

The other worry is that a big performance in a wet weather game doesn't really tell us much about their big weakness over the last few years, an inability to play at pace or create much in the backs.

Even Scotland in the early 2000s won the odd big game in the wet. Great days but don't make for great seasons.

I'm afraid he needs to go. It's not all on him, but he has shown no indication he is the right person to fix it.

He most definitely does need to GTF. Yet again Edinburgh show absolutely fuck all in attack. Bradbury and McConnell showed up well but that’s about it. Maybe Douglas when he came on, he was OK. A decent back row does not make a team when everyone else was dreadful.

[Cameo]

On the Offside Line someone suggested Edinburgh just need to sign White, Burke and Redpath.

I know it's not as easy as that, but given it is a New Year we can but dream. Any improvements on those three? Or any that are more realistic signings? I don't know Redpath's contract situation, but if he is keen for international caps, he could do worse than move sonewhere he will be starting every week.

While you are at it, you can name a coach you'd want, or a more realistic option?

[BaldiePete]

Edinburgh have landed in the unfortunate position of having a reputation for failing players and coaches. Why would anyone want to move to the club?

All three mentioned would be a considerable upgrade on the incumbents but I can’t see them wanting to come to Edinburgh. Edinburgh have been so shit for so long who would want to endanger their career by moving there? I suppose Burke has been pushed aside by Farrell returning to Saracens but Farrell is 34, eight years older than Burke so he might want to sit tight for a while till Farrell finally stops playing rather than a move north to a poorly managed club.

As for coaches, I’m not up to speed with coaches within the SRU. I suppose Pete Horne would be a possibility but he’s obviously being lined up to take over at Glasgow when Smith moves on (hopefully to the Scotland job). Externally there’s Leon MacDonald but he appears to have recently taken over at Yokohama Canon Eagles. Maybe Clark Laidlaw but why would he leave the Hurricanes to come back to Scotland to coach a crap team when he’s made his home in New Zealand since 2008.

Edit
I forgot about Greig Laidlaw. He might want to be back in Scotland but his coaching record in Japan has been poor.

[septic 9]

On the Offside Line someone suggested Edinburgh just need to sign White, Burke and Redpath.

I know it's not as easy as that, but given it is a New Year we can but dream. Any improvements on those three? Or any that are more realistic signings? I don't know Redpath's contract situation, but if he is keen for international caps, he could do worse than move sonewhere he will be starting every week.

While you are at it, you can name a coach you'd want, or a more realistic option?

whoever suggested that should stick to fantasy rugby. All 3 are in contract for at least another year and I doubt the SRU have the cash to splash - especially when to be very frank even as a Warriors fan its clear they have a good squad, very good mostly - eve their first pick midfield is a good standard. What they do not have is quality at 9, but the solution is more chances to McAlpine. And what they do not have is good caoching, coaching which works out ways to get Graham and Duhan on the ball in space - watch Glasgow manipulate space to get Steyn etc on the ball in wide areas (as well as going infield a lot more than Edinburgh wingers)
There are better coaches available - Horne, Dalzeil, Murchie and no doubt many abroad who will instill a better all round ethos at Edinburgh. One of the ex Glasgow guys might set a better tone than the desperation and lost look the players have. They look as unhappy as many were under Cockerill the dinosaur

[Cameo]

I saw something suggesting Laidlaw is assisting the u20s. Tend to think he needs to prove himself more as a coach before getting one of the top jobs.

Unless they can get someone really impressive from overseas (I see Boyd, the kiwi coach who had a big impact at Northampton, albeit with mixed results, is consulting at Munster) then I'd rather they gave Horne, Dalziel or Murchie a go. I know they have been poor for a long time, but there is still the attraction of a nice city and a decent squad (and the fact they can't get much worse - I reckon I could coach them and they'd be some sort of upswing).

[BaldiePete]

Edinburgh team for Benetton on Saturday. Forwards probably going to be OK but I wouldn’t expect the backs to be any better than they have been. I can’t see Thompson bringing them any more to bring them into the game than Scott has. In VDMs absence Goosen is playing on the left wing. That’s his 3rd position so far this season. The replacements are uninspiring with McConnell the only one likely to have an impact.

15. Jack Brown (6)

14. Darcy Graham (88)
13. Matt Currie (67)
12. James Lang (82)
11. Wes Goosen (64)

10. Ross Thompson (31)
9. Ben Vellacott (83)

1. Pierre Schoeman (142)
2. Harri Morris (10)
3. Ollie Blyth-Lafferty (5)
4. Glen Young (56)
5. Grant Gilchrist (227)
6. Tom Dodd (16)
7. Freddy Douglas (13)
8. Magnus Bradbury (142) CAPTAIN

Replacements

16. Jerry Blyth-Lafferty (1)
17. James Whitcombe (2)
18. Paul Hill (23)
19. Callum Hunter-Hill (25)
20. Liam McConnell (14)
21. Charlie Shiel (81)
22. Cammy Scott (25)
23. Piers O’Conor (8)



Unavailable: Charlie McCaig (knee), Rhys Litterick (achilles), Rob Carmichael (wrist), Mosese Tuipulotu (knee), Tom Currie (knee), Luke Crosbie (hamstring), D’arcy Rae (ankle), Sam Skinner (hamstring), Paddy Harrison (back), Ben Muncaster (knee), Marshall Sykes (arm), Harry Paterson (hamstring), Findlay Thomson (hand), Ewan Ashman (concussion), Duhan van der Merwe (hip), Boan Venter (neck), Dylan Richardson (ribs).