morepork wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 5:19 pm
Jesus Starmer is such a wet blanket. Does he still live with his parents or what? So many bland vanilla politicians on the left, if the left actually exists anymore. I feel for you guys but try deciding between two old Grandads with the possibility of martial law for non-whites and a policy platform that makes the 1950’s blush. How the fuck do we stop this obsession with the centre , which is constantly crabbing right?
What’s the alternative? A communist dictatorship?! No thank you!
Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 1:59 pm
How is it even possible they go in to a debate not prepared for "Labour are bad with money"?
It is baffling isn't it? If I was asked, before that debate, to bet my house on one thing that Sunak would say during it, it would have been, "Labour plan to raise taxes". And yet Starmer seemed to be taken unawares. I can only assume that the strategy was to "not dignify it with an answer," but that's clearly been a huge success, given the Tory papers are screaming headlines of "Starmer refuses to deny £2,000 tax hike for every household".
Puja
Also, the Tories had already been using the made up £2000 tax figure. He should had gone straight to the prepared response, whether that was 'that's a lie' or 'your own calculations give a bigger figure' eg a made up £3000. But whatever, there must be a response.
Having said that I don't think Starmer was a disaster in the debate. He landed some good points. Personally, and being a fan of neither of them, I don't think there was much between them.
Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Wed Jun 05, 2024 1:59 pm
How is it even possible they go in to a debate not prepared for "Labour are bad with money"?
It is baffling isn't it? If I was asked, before that debate, to bet my house on one thing that Sunak would say during it, it would have been, "Labour plan to raise taxes". And yet Starmer seemed to be taken unawares. I can only assume that the strategy was to "not dignify it with an answer," but that's clearly been a huge success, given the Tory papers are screaming headlines of "Starmer refuses to deny £2,000 tax hike for every household".
Puja
Also, the Tories had already been using the made up £2000 tax figure. He should had gone straight to the prepared response, whether that was 'that's a lie' or 'your own calculations give a bigger figure' eg a made up £3000. But whatever, there must be a response.
Having said that I don't think Starmer was a disaster in the debate. He landed some good points. Personally, and being a fan of neither of them, I don't think there was much between them.
Starmer wasnt exciting, but then he never is. He had the most to lose in that debate yet Sunak didnt land a punch really. The £2000 a year figure is just as believable as the £350m a day from Brexit. I dont think Sunak has the credibility to throw figure around and the right wing press response is being more muted then it could be.
It is baffling isn't it? If I was asked, before that debate, to bet my house on one thing that Sunak would say during it, it would have been, "Labour plan to raise taxes". And yet Starmer seemed to be taken unawares. I can only assume that the strategy was to "not dignify it with an answer," but that's clearly been a huge success, given the Tory papers are screaming headlines of "Starmer refuses to deny £2,000 tax hike for every household".
Puja
Also, the Tories had already been using the made up £2000 tax figure. He should had gone straight to the prepared response, whether that was 'that's a lie' or 'your own calculations give a bigger figure' eg a made up £3000. But whatever, there must be a response.
Having said that I don't think Starmer was a disaster in the debate. He landed some good points. Personally, and being a fan of neither of them, I don't think there was much between them.
Starmer wasnt exciting, but then he never is. He had the most to lose in that debate yet Sunak didnt land a punch really. The £2000 a year figure is just as believable as the £350m a day from Brexit. I dont think Sunak has the credibility to throw figure around and the right wing press response is being more muted then it could be.
I’m not sure that’s as encouraging as you suggest.
It is baffling isn't it? If I was asked, before that debate, to bet my house on one thing that Sunak would say during it, it would have been, "Labour plan to raise taxes". And yet Starmer seemed to be taken unawares. I can only assume that the strategy was to "not dignify it with an answer," but that's clearly been a huge success, given the Tory papers are screaming headlines of "Starmer refuses to deny £2,000 tax hike for every household".
Puja
Also, the Tories had already been using the made up £2000 tax figure. He should had gone straight to the prepared response, whether that was 'that's a lie' or 'your own calculations give a bigger figure' eg a made up £3000. But whatever, there must be a response.
Having said that I don't think Starmer was a disaster in the debate. He landed some good points. Personally, and being a fan of neither of them, I don't think there was much between them.
Starmer wasnt exciting, but then he never is. He had the most to lose in that debate yet Sunak didnt land a punch really. The £2000 a year figure is just as believable as the £350m a day from Brexit. I dont think Sunak has the credibility to throw figure around and the right wing press response is being more muted then it could be.
Christ. Moments of this feel straight out of Brass Eye.
He's going to be Tory leader in a couple of years and trample all over Starmer isn't he?
Re: Snap General Election called
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2024 7:50 am
by Donny osmond
Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:10 am
Christ. Moments of this feel straight out of Brass Eye.
He's going to be Tory leader in a couple of years and trample all over Starmer isn't he?
No.
"He shows you can get ahead even if you are a racist" is not a line that is trampling all over anything other than our ability to take the piss.
Re: Snap General Election called
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2024 7:57 am
by Mikey Brown
Ha. I meant Farage not the Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall lookalike in the video.
Re: Snap General Election called
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:22 pm
by Banquo
Rishi inadvertently throws the towel in and hands Remain even more votes in one of the all time worst pieces of political judgement. And it was planned nearly 2 months ago.
Re: Snap General Election called
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2024 1:05 pm
by Stom
Banquo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:22 pm
Rishi inadvertently throws the towel in and hands Remain even more votes in one of the all time worst pieces of political judgement. And it was planned nearly 2 months ago.
lol, that is hilarious
Re: Snap General Election called
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2024 1:38 pm
by Puja
Banquo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:22 pm
Rishi inadvertently throws the towel in and hands Remain even more votes in one of the all time worst pieces of political judgement. And it was planned nearly 2 months ago.
Was watching HIGNFY from last week and Victoria Coren-Mitchell kept stopping her evisceration of the various cock-ups of the campaigns so far to ask, "How are they *SO* *BAD* at this?!" It's a soundbite that's been playing on a loop in my head every time I think of this news story.
It is such an incredible own-goal. Sunak was already in danger of losing the white, reactionary, and racist demographic to Reform, both because Farage is so good at pandering to them and because Sunak isn't white. Farage was already playing the dog-whistle tune of "Sunak doesn't seem patriotic or to love this country as much as I do" even before this happened, and this will just play straight into his hands. This is the kind of blunder that could hand Reform 5-6 seats, and potentially knock the Conservatives down to double digit MPs.
I will take a moment of enjoyment that Sunak has spent so long stoking bullshit culture wars, only for Farage to swoop in at the last minute and steal the harvest of them.
Banquo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:22 pm
Rishi inadvertently throws the towel in and hands Remain even more votes in one of the all time worst pieces of political judgement. And it was planned nearly 2 months ago.
Was watching HIGNFY from last week and Victoria Coren-Mitchell kept stopping her evisceration of the various cock-ups of the campaigns so far to ask, "How are they *SO* *BAD* at this?!" It's a soundbite that's been playing on a loop in my head every time I think of this news story.
It is such an incredible own-goal. Sunak was already in danger of losing the white, reactionary, and racist demographic to Reform, both because Farage is so good at pandering to them and because Sunak isn't white. Farage was already playing the dog-whistle tune of "Sunak doesn't seem patriotic or to love this country as much as I do" even before this happened, and this will just play straight into his hands. This is the kind of blunder that could hand Reform 5-6 seats, and potentially knock the Conservatives down to double digit MPs.
Puja
yup
Re: Snap General Election called
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2024 2:18 pm
by Puja
Nigel Farage wrote:"He [Sunak] is completely disconnected from the centre of this country and he’s proved to me that he basically is not a patriotic leader of the Conservative party."
Subtext in flashing neon lights there.
The thought has occurred that this could actually cost Sunak his seat in Parliament. The MRP polls the other week only gave him a 61% chance of holding onto it even before Farage came into the equation and this damage to his personal brand could see him losing even more votes to Reform. All it would take is for them to go from 10%ish to 15%ish and Rishi could be the first serving Prime Minister to lose his seat in an election.
Nigel Farage wrote:"He [Sunak] is completely disconnected from the centre of this country and he’s proved to me that he basically is not a patriotic leader of the Conservative party."
Subtext in flashing neon lights there.
The thought has occurred that this could actually cost Sunak his seat in Parliament. The MRP polls the other week only gave him a 61% chance of holding onto it even before Farage came into the equation and this damage to his personal brand could see him losing even more votes to Reform. All it would take is for them to go from 10%ish to 15%ish and Rishi could be the first serving Prime Minister to lose his seat in an election.
Puja
Reform were nowhere in the polls till Sunak took over. What can it mean???
Banquo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:22 pm
Rishi inadvertently throws the towel in and hands Remain even more votes in one of the all time worst pieces of political judgement. And it was planned nearly 2 months ago.
Was watching HIGNFY from last week and Victoria Coren-Mitchell kept stopping her evisceration of the various cock-ups of the campaigns so far to ask, "How are they *SO* *BAD* at this?!" It's a soundbite that's been playing on a loop in my head every time I think of this news story.
It is such an incredible own-goal. Sunak was already in danger of losing the white, reactionary, and racist demographic to Reform, both because Farage is so good at pandering to them and because Sunak isn't white. Farage was already playing the dog-whistle tune of "Sunak doesn't seem patriotic or to love this country as much as I do" even before this happened, and this will just play straight into his hands. This is the kind of blunder that could hand Reform 5-6 seats, and potentially knock the Conservatives down to double digit MPs.
I will take a moment of enjoyment that Sunak has spent so long stoking bullshit culture wars, only for Farage to swoop in at the last minute and steal the harvest of them.
Banquo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:22 pm
Rishi inadvertently throws the towel in and hands Remain even more votes in one of the all time worst pieces of political judgement. And it was planned nearly 2 months ago.
Was watching HIGNFY from last week and Victoria Coren-Mitchell kept stopping her evisceration of the various cock-ups of the campaigns so far to ask, "How are they *SO* *BAD* at this?!" It's a soundbite that's been playing on a loop in my head every time I think of this news story.
It is such an incredible own-goal. Sunak was already in danger of losing the white, reactionary, and racist demographic to Reform, both because Farage is so good at pandering to them and because Sunak isn't white. Farage was already playing the dog-whistle tune of "Sunak doesn't seem patriotic or to love this country as much as I do" even before this happened, and this will just play straight into his hands. This is the kind of blunder that could hand Reform 5-6 seats, and potentially knock the Conservatives down to double digit MPs.
I will take a moment of enjoyment that Sunak has spent so long stoking bullshit culture wars, only for Farage to swoop in at the last minute and steal the harvest of them.
Will the Tories have any seats left? They could go down to fourth or fifth place at this rate.
God I hope so. Not just because I want to see them get humiliated. They **need** to be humiliated so that they can't just say "It was HIS fault.", and have the rest of them let themselves off the hook. Because it's not just Sunak's fault, although he's laughably bad, but it's everything the whole Tory party have done, for the last number of years, has been the wrong thing done for the wrong reasons and they need an absolute humping to help them see that.
Was watching HIGNFY from last week and Victoria Coren-Mitchell kept stopping her evisceration of the various cock-ups of the campaigns so far to ask, "How are they *SO* *BAD* at this?!" It's a soundbite that's been playing on a loop in my head every time I think of this news story.
It is such an incredible own-goal. Sunak was already in danger of losing the white, reactionary, and racist demographic to Reform, both because Farage is so good at pandering to them and because Sunak isn't white. Farage was already playing the dog-whistle tune of "Sunak doesn't seem patriotic or to love this country as much as I do" even before this happened, and this will just play straight into his hands. This is the kind of blunder that could hand Reform 5-6 seats, and potentially knock the Conservatives down to double digit MPs.
I will take a moment of enjoyment that Sunak has spent so long stoking bullshit culture wars, only for Farage to swoop in at the last minute and steal the harvest of them.
Will the Tories have any seats left? They could go down to fourth or fifth place at this rate.
God I hope so. Not just because I want to see them get humiliated. They **need** to be humiliated so that they can't just say "It was HIS fault.", and have the rest of them let themselves off the hook. Because it's not just Sunak's fault, although he's laughably bad, but it's everything the whole Tory party have done, for the last number of years, has been the wrong thing done for the wrong reasons and they need an absolute humping to help them see that.
Ideal for me would be them down to 4th behind the LibDems and the SNP (Greens would be better but let's keep this at least slightly realistic) but ahead of Farage UK. Humiliation would be great (as you say, for the whole Tory party) but I don't want Reform to be the dominant right wing party.
Of course, they'll probably find a way to sneak into 2nd place through sheer brand loyalty.
Re: Snap General Election called
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2024 5:40 pm
by Son of Mathonwy
Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:10 am
Christ. Moments of this feel straight out of Brass Eye.
He's going to be Tory leader in a couple of years and trample all over Starmer isn't he?
Scary/funny video.
Re: Snap General Election called
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2024 5:53 pm
by morepork
Why are rich people so fucking clueless?
Re: Snap General Election called
Posted: Fri Jun 07, 2024 8:36 pm
by Sandydragon
Banquo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:22 pm
Rishi inadvertently throws the towel in and hands Remain even more votes in one of the all time worst pieces of political judgement. And it was planned nearly 2 months ago.
Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:10 am
Christ. Moments of this feel straight out of Brass Eye.
He's going to be Tory leader in a couple of years and trample all over Starmer isn't he?
Scary/funny video.
Indeed. There needs to be an intelligent conversation over how immigration is managed and how all European countries manage potential increases in migration caused by climate change. But we need to move on from just being worried about the colour of someone’s skin.
Banquo wrote: ↑Fri Jun 07, 2024 12:22 pm
Rishi inadvertently throws the towel in and hands Remain even more votes in one of the all time worst pieces of political judgement. And it was planned nearly 2 months ago.
Was watching HIGNFY from last week and Victoria Coren-Mitchell kept stopping her evisceration of the various cock-ups of the campaigns so far to ask, "How are they *SO* *BAD* at this?!" It's a soundbite that's been playing on a loop in my head every time I think of this news story.
It is such an incredible own-goal. Sunak was already in danger of losing the white, reactionary, and racist demographic to Reform, both because Farage is so good at pandering to them and because Sunak isn't white. Farage was already playing the dog-whistle tune of "Sunak doesn't seem patriotic or to love this country as much as I do" even before this happened, and this will just play straight into his hands. This is the kind of blunder that could hand Reform 5-6 seats, and potentially knock the Conservatives down to double digit MPs.
I will take a moment of enjoyment that Sunak has spent so long stoking bullshit culture wars, only for Farage to swoop in at the last minute and steal the harvest of them.
Will the Tories have any seats left? They could go down to fourth or fifth place at this rate.
It does feel a bit like that.
If the Tories are totally battered then they are ripe for a farage takeover. Long term that isn’t a good thing. One hopes that the conservatives will find their trip to the right battered in 2029 and find some common sense. But there is a very dangerous chance that a farage led United right wing party could do well in 2029
Was watching HIGNFY from last week and Victoria Coren-Mitchell kept stopping her evisceration of the various cock-ups of the campaigns so far to ask, "How are they *SO* *BAD* at this?!" It's a soundbite that's been playing on a loop in my head every time I think of this news story.
It is such an incredible own-goal. Sunak was already in danger of losing the white, reactionary, and racist demographic to Reform, both because Farage is so good at pandering to them and because Sunak isn't white. Farage was already playing the dog-whistle tune of "Sunak doesn't seem patriotic or to love this country as much as I do" even before this happened, and this will just play straight into his hands. This is the kind of blunder that could hand Reform 5-6 seats, and potentially knock the Conservatives down to double digit MPs.
I will take a moment of enjoyment that Sunak has spent so long stoking bullshit culture wars, only for Farage to swoop in at the last minute and steal the harvest of them.
Will the Tories have any seats left? They could go down to fourth or fifth place at this rate.
It does feel a bit like that.
If the Tories are totally battered then they are ripe for a farage takeover. Long term that isn’t a good thing. One hopes that the conservatives will find their trip to the right battered in 2029 and find some common sense. But there is a very dangerous chance that a farage led United right wing party could do well in 2029
If they see Farage as their best chance of victory, they'll adopt him or defect to him. They did it with Johnson.
Although that could leave Labour as the only party that can be taken seriously.
Re: Snap General Election called
Posted: Sat Jun 08, 2024 9:06 am
by Sandydragon
Problem is if you have the right of the Tories and Refirm combined that’s over 30% of the vote which is not insubstantial.
Could be lots of smoke and noise like Corbyn and no electoral success but the lack of any sensible opposition isn’t great.