RugbyRebels

Today's game again showing why the refs are not helping themselves. Ludlam is being clearly neck-rolled right in front of Berry who is looking directly at it and does nothing until the assistant ref tells him its a neck-roll.

Epaminondas Pules wrote:Today's game again showing why the refs are not helping themselves. Ludlam is being clearly neck-rolled right in front of Berry who is looking directly at it and does nothing until the assistant ref tells him its a neck-roll.

Still, the refereeing unit at least saw that

I'm pretty sure Francis should have been penalised for his tackle

Just catching up on SCW's nonsense about the Hodge decision. What a nob. Was the ban actually for no use of the arms rather than the fact his shoulder hit Yato's face?

https://www.rugbydump.com/news/clive-wo ... n-decision

I have a touch more sympathy for Hodge having seen the reverse angle where he plants his feet and Yato steps across him, but not much. The idea you have to tackle like that to take down someone so powerful is idiotic.

What's that old saying they teach the minis when they're learning to tackle? No matter how big they are, they can't run if you take their face away.

Mikey Brown wrote:I never really get that line of reasoning anyway. If you're just pottering about and 'accidentally' ending people's games with dangerous tackles in the face then you are just as much in need of a ban.

And yet the ruck remains legalised violence

Digby wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:I never really get that line of reasoning anyway. If you're just pottering about and 'accidentally' ending people's games with dangerous tackles in the face then you are just as much in need of a ban.

And yet the ruck remains legalised violence

Quite. I've never understood the distinctions between clearing out and tackling without the ball, especially on the fringes of the ruck.

Oakboy wrote:

Digby wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:I never really get that line of reasoning anyway. If you're just pottering about and 'accidentally' ending people's games with dangerous tackles in the face then you are just as much in need of a ban.

And yet the ruck remains legalised violence

Quite. I've never understood the distinctions between clearing out and tackling without the ball, especially on the fringes of the ruck.

if a passive shoulder from Hodge is a 3 week ban there are a decent number of rucks that should be seeing 3 month bans

Yet leading with a forearm into the head of a wannabe tackler can get you 5 points

I’m not sure why me thinking Hodge’s “passive shoulder” (we’re yet to find out how long Yato is injured and unable to play for because of it) means I also think dangerous clearouts or leading with the forearm aren’t a problem...

Or is this just a sudden realisation that the bans handed out don’t tend to be consistent?

I'm quite content the game sanction plays like Hodge's as it's not good enough to claim it's an accident, he was more of a duty of care than that. But it's quite reasonable to mock the lack of action elsewhere

The Arg try saving shoulder charge before HT considered legit. was a puzzler.Pen try. all day for me.- given how Ton picked up and won the 2nd half, that could have made the game interesting.

Hodge’s statement. If you can’t be arsed to read it then, in essence, he says he’s sorry, that it’s not his fault, it’s the administrators at World Rugby’s fault, he’s still sorry.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/49870949

Francis cleared

Pleasantly surprised on Francis.

That Arg/Tonga one was weird. A clear shoulder charge and a penalty try, yet no sanction

I will say, I thought Poite had a good game today. Certainly no howlers, and Kerevi and JAdams were probably right level of sanction. My biggest gripe would be around Wales’ defensive maul, which was all kinds of illegal from those Oz 5m drives. They got away with murder defending our maul in The Principality during the warmup game too.

Timbo wrote:I will say, I thought Poite had a good game today. Certainly no howlers, and Kerevi and JAdams were probably right level of sanction. My biggest gripe would be around Wales’ defensive maul, which was all kinds of illegal from those Oz 5m drives. They got away with murder defending our maul in The Principality during the warmup game too.

Mr. Cheika doesn’t seem to agree

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/49870953

Gloskarlos wrote:

Timbo wrote:I will say, I thought Poite had a good game today. Certainly no howlers, and Kerevi and JAdams were probably right level of sanction. My biggest gripe would be around Wales’ defensive maul, which was all kinds of illegal from those Oz 5m drives. They got away with murder defending our maul in The Principality during the warmup game too.

Mr. Cheika doesn’t seem to agree

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/49870953

He and Mertens are right.

Timbo wrote:I will say, I thought Poite had a good game today. Certainly no howlers, and Kerevi and JAdams were probably right level of sanction. My biggest gripe would be around Wales’ defensive maul, which was all kinds of illegal from those Oz 5m drives. They got away with murder defending our maul in The Principality during the warmup game too.

I disagree. Hooper should have seen yellow for his off the ball shoulder charge - yes he had committed, but he committed with a shoulder charge. Kerevi was harsh. Patchell's piss poor technique was the problem there.

And around the pitch, the Welsh swam up the side of every maul and were constantly offside, the Aussies dived off their feet at every breakdown to seal it off.... I thought Poite had zero authority and was basically a spectator.

I’m struggling with the idea that the Kerevi incident is not a pen. Is it legal to lead with a forearm?

Mellsblue wrote:I’m struggling with the idea that the Kerevi incident is not a pen. Is it legal to lead with a forearm?

As above - I'm confused as to what the defence of this is. Shoving your forearm out isn't a natural carrying motion regardless of what Hooper was trying to argue and if you lead with the forearm and connect with head or neck, then that's your problem rather than the tackler's poor technique.

Puja

Mellsblue wrote:I’m struggling with the idea that the Kerevi incident is not a pen.

Yup, and and as somebody else said, Patchell going lower could very easily mean that elbow/forearm in his face rather than just his chest/throat.

I suppose it's one way to stop high tackles, but seems disingenuous to say that's Patchell's fault.

I've said this a bunch of times but it's one of the things that really made me take against Te'o. The number of times I saw him smash that armguard into people's faces was absurd, and I don't think I ever saw it get called out. Maybe it's fine and I'm just a softie.

I haven't re-watched the incident to pass judgement on it specifically; but my rule of thumb is that if you're leading with that arm, it has to be the hand, not the forearm or elbow (or fist).
Otherwise, you can have your arm tucked to your side / chest, and use it to push the tackler off once contact has been made - but if you mis-time things, and move the arm before the tackler arrives; then it's an illegal fend.


Equally, this is far from the first time when I'd have said penalty, and others have said not - for precisely this event.

One thing I've just noticed watching the Samoa vs Scotland game; the terminology for the referees at the breakdown is "not survived the clear out." Survived? Christ. I think we need to have a higher bar than letting people survive.

Also, just seen a neck roll punished - but the question has to be asked; if referees actually enforced the rule regarding players supporting their own bodyweight at the ruck, would players have to smash in so hard to dislodge 18 stone blokes lying 6 inches off the ground?

Again, it's just about enforcing the laws as they exist.

I agree with everything said. Kerevi was the exact thing I hate seeing. Big guys using big forearms with big protective plates to push players off. It just reminds me of the Saffas with their giant "protective" plates with SMASH written on them. The worst offender being actually Namibian and not at the WC, Quins' Renaldo Bothma.

Rugby isn't about beating people up, it's about scoring tries.

Just look at it!