RugbyRebels

Come on boys don’t let heads drop now. 11 points is much better than most people expected.

Mistake from Sheedy gives England a line out 10 m out.

And it’s all over.

England’s set piece was far better and their bench started to win the breakdown.

It could have been much worse.

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Graigwen wrote:It could have been much worse.

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Yeah. Lots more positives this week, particularly in physicality.

I’d love to suggest that our attack is liking better but it’s hard to make any statement on it when we can’t get a solid platform.

Sandydragon wrote:Another scrum penalty to England.

Yes but the English tight head was not straight and was boring in on Francis.

We missed Ken Owens today.

normanski wrote:We missed Ken Owens today.

It is not a new problem.

How do out hookers train? They are clearly not throwing balls through tyres all day. I don't think they are great at scrummaging. Has everything been sacrificed for mobility round the field?

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normanski wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:Another scrum penalty to England.

Yes but the English tight head was not straight and was boring in on Francis.

Some refs decide early and that's it. It's tough to change their minds. in 2013 in was our turn. Today, not so much.

One of the highlights of the Swedish commentary was the assertion that "Francis' haircut is actually better than normal, in fact." Hugely outdone by some of the English barnets today, mind.

Better than I'd feared. We even looked like we could win it at a few stages in the match.

Good solid defensive work (and it needed to be), but no success on turnovers. Poor work undér high ball (although England seemed to be able to place blockers with impunity). Daly was lucky not to see yellow for that shoulder to Adams's face. Hard to know if our scrum was bad or if it was just Polite. Great miracle try to open the game, worrying that we didn't get near the try line after that.

So considering the possession and territory, the score was acceptable. How we get better %s? Improve scrum, improve line out, win turnovers (although with our back row injuries, we have excuses). So, we have some way to go, despite clear improvement.

normanski wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:Another scrum penalty to England.

Yes but the English tight head was not straight and was boring in on Francis.

...and there was fraudulent scoring...two tries weren't even counted

England scored more points than they had players on the pitch

Some of England's points were scored by dead people and China was definitely involved along with drug money from Venezuela

There was definite scoring suppression going on too

The WRU's lawyer will be filing lawsuits on Monday to contest the result and Rudy Giuliani doesn't need evidence.

Son of Mathonwy wrote:Better than I'd feared. We even looked like we could win it at a few stages in the match.

Good solid defensive work (and it needed to be), but no success on turnovers. Poor work undér high ball (although England seemed to be able to place blockers with impunity). Daly was lucky not to see yellow for that shoulder to Adams's face. Hard to know if our scrum was bad or if it was just Polite. Great miracle try to open the game, worrying that we didn't get near the try line after that.

So considering the possession and territory, the score was acceptable. How we get better %s? Improve scrum, improve line out, win turnovers (although with our back row injuries, we have excuses). So, we have some way to go, despite clear improvement.

England definitely had the better of the ref. We were rubbish at scrum time and the line outs were also very flakey. I think that Poites refereeing of the scrum was a bit of a mystery at times. At least we didn’t get a yellow as a result. And the English bench took the game away from us.

England were deserved winners despite the iffy calls. It’s just annoying when it goes against you.

Positives were much increased physicality. Jonny Williams and Zammit looked very at home. Zammit almost got away twice and it took a last gasp tackle to get a piece of him. Adams was pretty solid as well without much of the ball.

Ball carried well and Faletaunwas very busy. Both flankers were industrious and weren’t shown up.

According to Wales Online, Wales are going to file a complaint to World Rugby about Poite’s performance. I think there were some obvious refereeing mistakes that led directly to points being scored, but Pivac seems to do a fair bit of griping about refs post match. Not too sure I am keen on it. The better side won today.

Wallpaperman wrote:According to Wales Online, Wales are going to file a complaint to World Rugby about Poite’s performance. I think there were some obvious refereeing mistakes that led directly to points being scored, but Pivac seems to do a fair bit of griping about refs post match. Not too sure I am keen on it. The better side won today.

That's a very bad sign for his coaching regime if it's true.

And to add to the intrigue, there’s an interesting video clip doing the rounds where Ellis Genge appears to head butt Tomas Francis. From the angle provided it looks pretty bad.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.rugb ... n-twitter/

Here’s the clip.

Sandydragon wrote:And to add to the intrigue, there’s an interesting video clip doing the rounds where Ellis Genge appears to head butt Tomas Francis. From the angle provided it looks pretty bad.

Having just said that I don’t like complaining about refs post match, I have to agree ! Obvious wrong decision to award England the penalty at the scrum, too.

Wallpaperman wrote:According to Wales Online, Wales are going to file a complaint to World Rugby about Poite’s performance. I think there were some obvious refereeing mistakes that led directly to points being scored, but Pivac seems to do a fair bit of griping about refs post match. Not too sure I am keen on it. The better side won today.

I try not to moan about the ref too much, but that tackle on Biggar whilst he is in the air could easily have been checked before Farrell took the conversion. I completely understand how the Genge incident could be missed, but it still looks very bad and I hope its looked at properly.

Sandydragon wrote:

Wallpaperman wrote:According to Wales Online, Wales are going to file a complaint to World Rugby about Poite’s performance. I think there were some obvious refereeing mistakes that led directly to points being scored, but Pivac seems to do a fair bit of griping about refs post match. Not too sure I am keen on it. The better side won today.

I try not to moan about the ref too much, but that tackle on Biggar whilst he is in the air could easily have been checked before Farrell took the conversion. I completely understand how the Genge incident could be missed, but it still looks very bad and I hope its looked at properly.

Agreed re Biggar. That was very disappointing. And having seen some of the Pro12 decisions this year I’m surprised that Daly wasn’t penalised for the tackle on Josh Adams. I’m having hypocrisy pie for supper tonight.

Sandydragon wrote:https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.rugb ... n-twitter/

Here’s the clip.

I rewound the match to check that one. Genge launches himself at Francis but with the only angle given we can't see where he hits him. It was right in front of Poite, so I'd like to think he'd have seen contact with the head, but it's Poite so who knows?

Son of Mathonwy wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.rugb ... n-twitter/

Here’s the clip.

I rewound the match to check that one. Genge launches himself at Francis but with the only angle given we can't see where he hits him. It was right in front of Poite, so I'd like to think he'd have seen contact with the head, but it's Poite so who knows?

There is definitely a push/ touch from another England player but the way he springs forward is totally out proportion to how much force could be generated by his team mate. The camera pans away and then back to a fracas on the floor so it’s fair to say that players reacted to it. Francis tried to complain and is marched back 10m instead.

I’m not a fan of Poite but I do wonder if he felt that the criticism of MacNeill after the Ulster-Scarlets game led to Poite distrusting him, and thus not bothering to use the TMO?

I can't see you'd every be able to cite him from that angle. Surely his defence is that he was being pulled down by Francis already and then knocked off balance by LCD. The push alone wouldn't make him fall forward like that but with a 20 stone prop hanging off him is a different picture

We've got serious problems going forward unless we unearth a few gems over the next few years.
Without Foxy, whose best years are obviously behind him who is there to take over?
Tompkins isn't a 13, doesn't have the physicality, pace or defensive nous. It's arguably the most important defensive position on the pitch.
Williams was good at 12, Watkin is also a good option there but I'm not sure either of them have the cutting edge needed at 13.
Who else do we have that can slot in there? Can't think of anyone which is a bit sad.
North has filled in there & could do a job but is also suspect defensively.
Any kids coming through the academy set ups at 13? Mason Grady at Cardiff is highly rated but not sure if he's a 12 or 13.

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PoolerSaint wrote:We've got serious problems going forward unless we unearth a few gems over the next few years.
Without Foxy, whose best years are obviously behind him who is there to take over?
Tompkins isn't a 13, doesn't have the physicality, pace or defensive nous. It's arguably the most important defensive position on the pitch.
Williams was good at 12, Watkin is also a good option there but I'm not sure either of them have the cutting edge needed at 13.
Who else do we have that can slot in there? Can't think of anyone which is a bit sad.
North has filled in there & could do a job but is also suspect defensively.
Any kids coming through the academy set ups at 13? Mason Grady at Cardiff is highly rated but not sure if he's a 12 or 13.

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Tyler Morgan or possibly Lane? Hallam Amos as an outside shot?