RugbyRebels

I don't know whether anyone else saw the story about Lam recounting a conversation where Lansdowne said he'd grown "bored of rugby" and that he was giving Lam latitude to play expansively, even if it meant losing. Quite apart from the concern about one of the major financial pillars keeping the league alive expressing boredom in the sport, bringing Mata in is very much a signing in that kind of vein.

Mind, Bristol have become more successful than they have been in a long time since returning to their old ways, suggesting that they should never have tried to adapt after Quins traumatised them with two comebacks in a row. The lesson to be learned apparently should've been "Quins gonna Quin, no matter what you do," rather than trying to add depth to their game.

Puja

Johnny Gray leaves Exeter with immediate effect. Heading off to Bordeaux for next season so it's probable he's heading there early.

Whagwan wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 11:32 am Maggie Bradbury heading home to Edinburgh. Real shame as he's been outstanding this season, Mata has big shoes to fill.

https://www.bristolbearsrugby.com/news/ ... edinburgh/

Yup, a big loss for us. Not sure if he was going back and that moved Mata to us or Mata came to us and that left Bradbury looking for a new club.

Hopefully, it means that either Grondona and/or an academy lad is going to get more game time and break through.

Bath academy intake, confirming those coming from the old LI academy

https://www.bathrugby.com/content/class ... bath-rugby

FKAS wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 1:06 pm Johnny Gray leaves Exeter with immediate effect. Heading off to Bordeaux for next season so it's probable he's heading there early.

Strange ending to his run there, but good for him. He's worn himself down to a nub over the last few years. I hope he might get a late-career injury-free run at some point, like his brother.

Epaminondas Pules wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 1:48 pm Bath academy intake, confirming those coming from the old LI academy

https://www.bathrugby.com/content/class ... bath-rugby

Really leveraging their links with the University. Smart play by Bath.

Puja

Peter Hewatt formerly of London Irish set to join Tigers as attack coach.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union ... ts-defeat/

FKAS wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 6:57 pm Peter Hewatt formerly of London Irish set to join Tigers as attack coach.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union ... ts-defeat/

About fucking time. I appreciate that we've had a difficult situation with Dickens being on medical leave, but it's inexcusable that we've been an entire season without an attack coach (and frankly bizarre that Dickens was signed in the first place as he showed nothing of quality with the England U20s and didn't appear to be McKellar's choice). Good news is that the Japanese season ends in May, so we can have him coming in for a full pre-season, instead of signing someone who might only just rock up in September and force us to have yet another season of "bedding in".

Puja

Puja wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 7:35 pm

FKAS wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 6:57 pm Peter Hewatt formerly of London Irish set to join Tigers as attack coach.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union ... ts-defeat/

About fucking time. I appreciate that we've had a difficult situation with Dickens being on medical leave, but it's inexcusable that we've been an entire season without an attack coach (and frankly bizarre that Dickens was signed in the first place as he showed nothing of quality with the England U20s and didn't appear to be McKellar's choice). Good news is that the Japanese season ends in May, so we can have him coming in for a full pre-season, instead of signing someone who might only just rock up in September and force us to have yet another season of "bedding in".

Puja

Dickens wasn't on medical leave. We placed him on gardening leave following allegations from his time with England under 20s which were ultimately dismissed. Having put him on gardening leave if we'd hired a replacement it would have led to him filing constructive dismissal charges and we could have ended up having to pay out quite a bit of compensation. I'm sure we were hoping that the matter would end quickly and not drag on for months before finally reaching a conclusion after which he apparently didn't want to come back. Good riddance quite frankly.

FKAS wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 7:39 pm

Puja wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 7:35 pm

FKAS wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 6:57 pm Peter Hewatt formerly of London Irish set to join Tigers as attack coach.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union ... ts-defeat/

About fucking time. I appreciate that we've had a difficult situation with Dickens being on medical leave, but it's inexcusable that we've been an entire season without an attack coach (and frankly bizarre that Dickens was signed in the first place as he showed nothing of quality with the England U20s and didn't appear to be McKellar's choice). Good news is that the Japanese season ends in May, so we can have him coming in for a full pre-season, instead of signing someone who might only just rock up in September and force us to have yet another season of "bedding in".

Puja

Dickens wasn't on medical leave. We placed him on gardening leave following allegations from his time with England under 20s which were ultimately dismissed. Having put him on gardening leave if we'd hired a replacement it would have led to him filing constructive dismissal charges and we could have ended up having to pay out quite a bit of compensation. I'm sure we were hoping that the matter would end quickly and not drag on for months before finally reaching a conclusion after which he apparently didn't want to come back. Good riddance quite frankly.

Oosh. That's not ideal, yeah.

Only downside of Hewat joining is that a McKellar/Hewat/Palmer triumverate will almost certainly be looking to the Australia vacancy when Schmidt leaves after the B&I Lions tour in 2025, so we could be setting ourselves up for losing yet another backroom staff to the international game. Only one season to impress though - DanM certainly won't be getting hired on this year's evidence.

Puja

Palmer and McKellar have contracts for another season after next so the Aussies would need to be paying us off. After the stick they are getting for the Eddie debacle is imagine they want some cost effective options. If Schmidt works out, which I very much suspect he will I can see him signing an extension until the world cup.

My concern with Hewat is that it might be a little to much like getting the old band back together. The only one missing is Laurie Fisher and you've got the old Brumbies back room staff in there.

I don’t really see anything wrong with getting the band back together sort of thing.

Hewat been in Japan for 3 seasons and is a London Irish legend so not like he’s lacking in experience away from the other two.

Tigersman wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 10:38 pm I don’t really see anything wrong with getting the band back together sort of thing.

Hewat been in Japan for 3 seasons and is a London Irish legend so not like he’s lacking in experience away from the other two.

I think Hewat could be a good appointment. He's got experience, works well with McKellar and also has prior for bringing through and developing backs (which we need). He's head coach currently as well so must be rated over in Japan though Black Rams don't seem to have the budget of some of the other Japanese sides.

The concern about getting the band back together is that if McKellar does go for whatever reason we're likely to see the coaching staff gutted again, as Puja mentions. Is this also a yes man on the coaching team. Tigers under McKellar have been hit and miss, I'm undecided on whether another former Brumbies coach is good to reinforce McKellar or whether we should have looked at someone who's been successful elsewhere to mix things up. I guess we'll see, I'm erring more to the optimistic side though.

Regan Grace properly signs at Bath
https://www.bathrugby.com/content/grace ... bath-rugby
No news on length of contract, or when he's available (might be this weekend, might be September). Thought to be a 1 year contract, presumably with a view to extending on improved terms if injury free and successful at Union.

Which Tyler wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2024 11:13 am Regan Grace properly signs at Bath
https://www.bathrugby.com/content/grace ... bath-rugby
No news on length of contract, or when he's available (might be this weekend, might be September). Thought to be a 1 year contract, presumably with a view to extending on improved terms if injury free and successful at Union.

He'll be in the Wales squad for the summer then.

Puja

FKAS wrote: ↑Tue Apr 23, 2024 7:48 pm Palmer and McKellar have contracts for another season after next so the Aussies would need to be paying us off. After the stick they are getting for the Eddie debacle is imagine they want some cost effective options. If Schmidt works out, which I very much suspect he will I can see him signing an extension until the world cup.

You would've thought so, wouldn't you, but he's been pretty adamant that he wants 2 years and 2 years only because of his family issues. May be that he finds he can work in Australia and still give the care and attention to his family that he wants, but at present, he's in there as a repair job, rather than as a full-time main coach.

Mind, the way the Brumbies are going in Super Rugby, you'd've thought the job was Larkham's to lose, so it may all be moot in the end.

Puja

Puja wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2024 11:42 amHe'll be in the Wales squad for the summer then.

They'll certainly be desperate to cap him.
A] Because they're desperate
B] The risk of England capping him
C] To get him back in Wales to help boost crowds in the URC

Tigers academy leavers:

Leicester Tigers Senior Academy 2023/2024 Farewells

Jacob Cusick, Tiger #2361

Oliver Crane, Tiger #2417

Sam Edwards, Tiger #2363

Morgan Meredith, Tiger #2370

Simon Koroiyadi, Tiger #2371

Cusick and Edwards are rumoured to be off to Bristol. Edwards is an early release.

Meredith is playing for England students, he's a tidy flyhalf. I'd have liked to see him kept on personally.

Epaminondas Pules wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2024 11:53 am Tigers academy leavers:

Leicester Tigers Senior Academy 2023/2024 Farewells

Jacob Cusick, Tiger #2361

Oliver Crane, Tiger #2417

Sam Edwards, Tiger #2363

Morgan Meredith, Tiger #2370

Simon Koroiyadi, Tiger #2371

I'm worried about the Tigers academy - upsetting seeing our England age-group contributions dwindling and players who were seen as promising drift away, like Cusick and Koroiyadi.

Starting to feel like it did about 12-13 years ago, when we brought through the last cadre of Youngs/Manu/Ford et al and then just shut up shop for the longest while. There were players talked up as being good, but they never came to anything and left the same way some of these are going - we produced the occasional Henry Purdys and Alex Lewingtons for other clubs, but nothing for ourselves and no further superstars.

You're fairly plugged in to these things - is it just a bad run or have we cut back on academy work and talent finding like we did 12 years ago?

Puja

The last cadre of academy players is surely the crop of Whitcombe, Martin, JVP, Steward?
I don't think it's that bad yet.
England age grade is a good indicator but not a final marker. Woodward is the same age grade as Cusick and kept for example.

Even not including any extras our senior dev is 24 players with over half Age grade internationals at U20/U19 level, which is potentially too big anyway.

Epaminondas Pules wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2024 11:53 am Tigers academy leavers:

Leicester Tigers Senior Academy 2023/2024 Farewells

Jacob Cusick, Tiger #2361

Oliver Crane, Tiger #2417

Sam Edwards, Tiger #2363

Morgan Meredith, Tiger #2370

Simon Koroiyadi, Tiger #2371

Sam Edwards has been confirmed as joining Bristol.

Also joining are:
Steele Barker, 23yrs, Lock from Cornish Pirates (assume he's replacing Ed Holmes who has a high lights reel on youtube now)
Tom Doughty, 27yrs, hooker from Doncaster & formerly Bath

Bit worried that Doughty coming means Thacker or Capon might be off.....

Tigersman wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:36 pm The last cadre of academy players is surely the crop of Whitcombe, Martin, JVP, Steward?
I don't think it's that bad yet.
England age grade is a good indicator but not a final marker. Woodward is the same age grade as Cusick and kept for example.

Even not including any extras our senior dev is 24 players with over half Age grade internationals at U20/U19 level, which is potentially too big anyway.

Sorry, when I said the last cadre I was referring to the one before we shut up shop 12-13 years ago. We obviously rebooted our focus on the academy, brought through some quality home-grown talent and shockingly moved up the table. I just don't want a repeat where Martin, JVP, and Steward are 27 and still the last good products from the academy.

Puja

Puja wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:54 pm

Tigersman wrote: ↑Wed Apr 24, 2024 1:36 pm The last cadre of academy players is surely the crop of Whitcombe, Martin, JVP, Steward?
I don't think it's that bad yet.
England age grade is a good indicator but not a final marker. Woodward is the same age grade as Cusick and kept for example.

Even not including any extras our senior dev is 24 players with over half Age grade internationals at U20/U19 level, which is potentially too big anyway.

Sorry, when I said the last cadre I was referring to the one before we shut up shop 12-13 years ago. We obviously rebooted our focus on the academy, brought through some quality home-grown talent and shockingly moved up the table. I just don't want a repeat where Martin, JVP, and Steward are 27 and still the last good products from the academy.

Puja

Ah fair enough.

I don’t think the current academy crop have done that well. Sam Byrd who played for Scotland U18 is meant to look promising.

I struggle to see how the club will be able to keep 24+ players happy with a 10 team league without any A league to play them in.
I wouldn’t be surprised if we feel Woodward and Myall are more promising than Cusick now question is if that’s going to be the case or not