RugbyRebels

There's no escaping the plots in some American TV shows and films. The Russians, North Koreans and/or some Arab states tend to be portrayed as the villains that have to be stopped and the US saves the day. Hooray!

It's entertainment, but it can be used as propaganda that no doubt helps the irrational fear in some people of those countries.

It's a popular and reliable narrative in many game stories too.

It got me thinking. I'm well aware of pro-Russian news using propaganda against the US and other western states. I'm sure it happens in North Korea and in the Middle East too, but how about in TV shows and films from those countries?

Do they feature plots where a US government funded group is threatening to drop a nuke on Pyongyang? Maybe some mad US scientist is threatening to release the horror of all horrors virus in downtown Moscow unless he's paid ₽10,000,000,000,000 within 24 hours...the clock is ticking!

In my experience, anti-US propaganda isn't a thing. I haven't been to North Korea and am very skeptical about what we are told about that country, since I do know most of what we are told about the other countries/regions you mentioned is itself propaganda. That's not to say the politicians and a few of the state-funded publications don't attack US policies - justifiably or otherwise. But I don't think any other country has either the budget nor the will to develop a massive propaganda industry the way the US has done with its mainstream media, film and televison. The only country that even comes close would be Britain, which did so much to pioneer this mode of psychological warfare. When your agenda is to invade and subjugate other peoples all over the world, and thereby control their resources, impose your own culture and dominate all rivals, you need first to condition the minds of the populace to accept it.

Some shows like 24 manage to have an external and internal villain. The bad guy from the middle east who is going to blow up half of LA with a nuke supported by the government insider with their own agenda.

There almost certainly are shows where the US is the bad guy, I doubt they are as widely circulated as anything from Hollywood. That said, the US TV and film industry has been running with conspiracy theories and insider jobs for years, its almost like they are trying to make up for the lack of competition

rowan wrote:In my experience, anti-US propaganda isn't a thing. I haven't been to North Korea and am very skeptical about what we are told about that country, since I do know most of what we are told about the other countries/regions you mentioned is itself propaganda. That's not to say the politicians and a few of the state-funded publications don't attack US policies - justifiably or otherwise. But I don't think any other country has either the budget nor the will to develop a massive propaganda industry the way the US has done with its mainstream media, film and televison. The only country that even comes close would be Britain, which did so much to pioneer this mode of psychological warfare. When your agenda is to invade and subjugate other peoples all over the world, and thereby control their resources, impose your own culture and dominate all rivals, you need first to condition the minds of the populace to accept it.

It very much is, its just not in the same format.

Sandydragon wrote:

rowan wrote:In my experience, anti-US propaganda isn't a thing. I haven't been to North Korea and am very skeptical about what we are told about that country, since I do know most of what we are told about the other countries/regions you mentioned is itself propaganda. That's not to say the politicians and a few of the state-funded publications don't attack US policies - justifiably or otherwise. But I don't think any other country has either the budget nor the will to develop a massive propaganda industry the way the US has done with its mainstream media, film and televison. The only country that even comes close would be Britain, which did so much to pioneer this mode of psychological warfare. When your agenda is to invade and subjugate other peoples all over the world, and thereby control their resources, impose your own culture and dominate all rivals, you need first to condition the minds of the populace to accept it.

It very much is, its just not in the same format.

Just my view, and I've lived in Russia and China short term, as well as the Middle East long-term.

A quick search unearths this lot, some of which is modern by North Korea, Iran.

It does appear that the Soviets made a film in the 80s that reversed the usual Hollywood stereotype.

http://www.cracked.com/photoplasty_1590 ... ropaganda/

Sandydragon wrote:A quick search unearths this lot, some of which is modern by North Korea, Iran.

It does appear that the Soviets made a film in the 80s that reversed the usual Hollywood stereotype.

http://www.cracked.com/photoplasty_1590 ... ropaganda/

& the ultimate irony here is that you've chosen an amateurish American source with a painfully leftist agenda and dorky variety of humor, which accepts contributions from any crackpot who wishes to contribute to it.

http://www.returnofkings.com/51878/5-un ... d-magazine

I found this:
https://www.quora.com/Do-Russian-films- ... world-view

It lists a few Russian films where the west (not just the US) is the enemy but the list is short.

I've seen loads of films and tv shows, including animated stuff (American Dad, Family Guy, Archer etc, etc) where they use Russia/NK/ME as the enemy or just the butt of their jokes. I just wondered what went on in the other countries in the name of entertainment.

My preconception is to imagine NK to be the worst of the lot with infomercial style shows telling the masses how evil the US is.

As for Russia, I expect (but may be wrong) that they see a lot of American films/shows, I often wonder how they feel about being cast as the bad guy or basically being mocked in a lot of shows?

WaspInWales wrote:I found this:
https://www.quora.com/Do-Russian-films- ... world-view

It lists a few Russian films where the west (not just the US) is the enemy but the list is short.

I've seen loads of films and tv shows, including animated stuff (American Dad, Family Guy, Archer etc, etc) where they use Russia/NK/ME as the enemy or just the butt of their jokes. I just wondered what went on in the other countries in the name of entertainment.

My preconception is to imagine NK to be the worst of the lot with infomercial style shows telling the masses how evil the US is.

As for Russia, I expect (but may be wrong) that they see a lot of American films/shows, I often wonder how they feel about being cast as the bad guy or basically being mocked in a lot of shows?

Probably a little bit like the Native Americans when they watched Westerns. That was all intentionally designed propaganda as well, of course; just like the Vietnam War films that followed, and now the Middle East Wars variety.

As usual, Pilger puts it best: http://johnpilger.com/articles/why-the-oscars-are-a-con

WaspInWales wrote:
My preconception is to imagine NK to be the worst of the lot with infomercial style shows telling the masses how evil the US is.

It's (or was) mostly music, some movies shown over and over, and chat about their glorious leaders or nice places like Iran. If there is a villain of the piece in NK media it would be South Korea and their oppression of their people rather than the USA.

In a further irony this thread was started exactly 70 years to the day after state-run Voice of America began transmitting its propaganda to the Soviet Union. This was one year after the start of the Cold War, of course. The USSR began jamming the station in 1948 due to the increasingly biased nature of the broadcasts - which it regarded as an attempt to 'brainwash' Russian citizens. However, many people in the countryside were still able to listen in, as were those well off enough to afford a shortwave radio. This provides an early example of post-war America's determination to begin imposing its values on the rest of the world.

Off the top of my head, and I'm not one for watching loads of films, Team America is clearly anti-US foreign policy. The latest season of Homeland is shaping up that way, too.

Part of the problem is that both the US and, to a much lesser extent, the U.K. dominate big budget, English spoken movies. The movies that will be seen all over the world. There are therefore bound to be a lot more 'US good, US enemy bad' movies out there purely because there are a lot more US movies out there.

Don't get me wrong, the amount of Stars and Stripes fluttering away in the background does grind quite a bit, Armageddon sticks out, but I think that sort of thing has lessened in the last ten years or so (may be wrong as, again, I don't watch that many movies) Probably a correlation with unpopular decisions over Iraq and Afghanistan.

All that said, there are alot of anti-US documentaries produced by US citizens.

What up

Mellsblue wrote:Off the top of my head, and I'm not one for watching loads of films, Team America is clearly anti-US foreign policy. The latest season of Homeland is shaping up that way, too.

Part of the problem is that both the US and, to a much lesser extent, the U.K. dominate big budget, English spoken movies. The movies that will be seen all over the world. There are therefore bound to be a lot more 'US good, US enemy bad' movies out there purely because there are a lot more US movies out there.

Don't get me wrong, the amount of Stars and Stripes fluttering away in the background does grind quite a bit, Armageddon sticks out, but I think that sort of thing has lessened in the last ten years or so (may be wrong as, again, I don't watch that many movies) Probably a correlation with unpopular decisions over Iraq and Afghanistan.

All that said, there are alot of anti-US documentaries produced by US citizens.

Good call on Team America. There are quite a few similar examples and as you mentioned, anti-US documentaries made in the US.

I was enquiring more about the films and tv shows made in the countries that are on the receiving end of US entertainment. Russia, NK and a whole host of ME states for example.

cashead wrote:What up

Snake Plissken - All American hero.

WaspInWales wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:Off the top of my head, and I'm not one for watching loads of films, Team America is clearly anti-US foreign policy. The latest season of Homeland is shaping up that way, too.

Part of the problem is that both the US and, to a much lesser extent, the U.K. dominate big budget, English spoken movies. The movies that will be seen all over the world. There are therefore bound to be a lot more 'US good, US enemy bad' movies out there purely because there are a lot more US movies out there.

Don't get me wrong, the amount of Stars and Stripes fluttering away in the background does grind quite a bit, Armageddon sticks out, but I think that sort of thing has lessened in the last ten years or so (may be wrong as, again, I don't watch that many movies) Probably a correlation with unpopular decisions over Iraq and Afghanistan.

All that said, there are alot of anti-US documentaries produced by US citizens.

Good call on Team America. There are quite a few similar examples and as you mentioned, anti-US documentaries made in the US.

I was enquiring more about the films and tv shows made in the countries that are on the receiving end of US entertainment. Russia, NK and a whole host of ME states for example.

Can't say I've seen many Russian films. Perhaps that'll be where the present Scandi noir leads to. If they're half as good as The Bridge and Blue Eyes then I'll watch.

Soviet films rarely actually had the US as villains for whatever reason.

Also, if we want other films where the US govt is the villain, you can also throw in Children of Men and V For Vendetta - set in the UK, with a UK government as the naughty boys, but it's pretty fucking blatant whom they were casting sideways glances at.

Sleeping Dogs/Smith's Dream.

WaspInWales wrote:

cashead wrote:What up

Snake Plissken - All American hero.

The US government are unsympathetic fascist jackasses in the first movie, and they're outright villains in the second one.

cashead wrote:

WaspInWales wrote:

cashead wrote:What up

Snake Plissken - All American hero.

The US government are unsympathetic fascist jackasses in the first movie, and they're outright villains in the second one.

That has to be one of the worst sequels ever. Basically the same plot from New York moved to LA.

rowan wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:A quick search unearths this lot, some of which is modern by North Korea, Iran.

It does appear that the Soviets made a film in the 80s that reversed the usual Hollywood stereotype.

http://www.cracked.com/photoplasty_1590 ... ropaganda/

& the ultimate irony here is that you've chosen an amateurish American source with a painfully leftist agenda and dorky variety of humor, which accepts contributions from any crackpot who wishes to contribute to it.

http://www.returnofkings.com/51878/5-un ... d-magazine

Thats why I thought you'd like it.

Although the examples are from elsewhere so its not really important on which website I linked, the source material is more important.

cashead wrote:

WaspInWales wrote:

cashead wrote:What up

Snake Plissken - All American hero.

The US government are unsympathetic fascist jackasses in the first movie, and they're outright villains in the second one.

True, but an American film which still features an American hero.

The map of the world according to who every country thinks is most dangerous



https://www.indy100.com/article/map-of- ... mp-7590086

The British in Hidden Agenda (loosely based on the Stalker Affair).



There's more literature on the nefarious villainy of both. OTTOMH, Mark Curtis is worth a read.

Any reason why the seppos have been chosen?



Have a read about what the Japs did in Nanking, the Russians in Chechnya, the holodomor, the Egyptians in Yemen etc. etc.

Why limit it to the septics?!