RugbyRebels

We have a Moiraine

No idea what Wheel of Time is, but if Rosamund Pike is in it then I’m watching.

Mellsblue wrote:No idea what Wheel of Time is, but if Rosamund Pike is in it then I’m watching.

Epic fantasy - she'll be a fireball-throwing type wizard

Which Tyler wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:No idea what Wheel of Time is, but if Rosamund Pike is in it then I’m watching.

Epic fantasy - she'll be a fireball-throwing type wizard

I've always meant to give Jordan (it is Robert Jordan, right?) another go. Read something of his as a teenager and couldn't get into it, but heard good things about him.

Stom wrote:

Which Tyler wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:No idea what Wheel of Time is, but if Rosamund Pike is in it then I’m watching.

Epic fantasy - she'll be a fireball-throwing type wizard

I've always meant to give Jordan (it is Robert Jordan, right?) another go. Read something of his as a teenager and couldn't get into it, but heard good things about him.

That's the one - his series had some really strong books, and some utter tripe. However, it is at least, finished, along with fan reactions; so they'll be able to plan out the whole thing in advance and know where they need to add and where they need to cut (heavily).
Quite honestly, I wouldn't bother with the reading (maybe an audiobook as it's less time consuming if you feel like it); and just trust the show to know what's what - it might not work, but there's over 11,000 pages of material to read in there.

It looks like they've spent a fair amount of cash on this I may give it a go.

Which Tyler wrote:

Stom wrote:

Which Tyler wrote: Epic fantasy - she'll be a fireball-throwing type wizard

I've always meant to give Jordan (it is Robert Jordan, right?) another go. Read something of his as a teenager and couldn't get into it, but heard good things about him.

That's the one - his series had some really strong books, and some utter tripe. However, it is at least, finished, along with fan reactions; so they'll be able to plan out the whole thing in advance and know where they need to add and where they need to cut (heavily).
Quite honestly, I wouldn't bother with the reading (maybe an audiobook as it's less time consuming if you feel like it); and just trust the show to know what's what - it might not work, but there's over 11,000 pages of material to read in there.

I read the series a few years ago. Some really excellent stuff and some garbage as well. Those two books mid series where he tried to describe the taming of the source from different perspectives in two novels just didn’t work. I know a lot of people who hated the final book, although I quite enjoyed it, and if I remember correctly the original author died and it was finished by his brother (?) using notes

. I’m intrigued to see how they take this series forward.


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Died whilst writing it, and another author working for the same publishing company wrote the last 3 (Brandon Sanderson)

TV show starts tomorrow!
https://www.ign.com/articles/the-wheel- ... pisode-1-3

I'm in the middle of book three, and, well, I don't get that this would make a particularly good TV show...

Also, feminism with the Aes Sedai? I'm not sure I get it: most of them are pretty repellant characters with little in the way of a female touch.

I think I'd have much preferred Feist's Riftwar series as an epic fantasy TV show.

Stom wrote:I'm in the middle of book three, and, well, I don't get that this would make a particularly good TV show...

Also, feminism with the Aes Sedai? I'm not sure I get it: most of them are pretty repellant characters with little in the way of a female touch.

I think I'd have much preferred Feist's Riftwar series as an epic fantasy TV show.

The feminism thing is hugely overblown in my opinion. It is a matriarchal society but it’s clear that there are flaws with this and if anything Jordan seems to me to be arguing for balance, not supremacy of one sex. And some of the female characters are terrible, I never took to Egwene.


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Sandydragon wrote:

Stom wrote:I'm in the middle of book three, and, well, I don't get that this would make a particularly good TV show...

Also, feminism with the Aes Sedai? I'm not sure I get it: most of them are pretty repellant characters with little in the way of a female touch.

I think I'd have much preferred Feist's Riftwar series as an epic fantasy TV show.

The feminism thing is hugely overblown in my opinion. It is a matriarchal society but it’s clear that there are flaws with this and if anything Jordan seems to me to be arguing for balance, not supremacy of one sex. And some of the female characters are terrible, I never took to Egwene.


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most fantasy writers are white middle aged men. They're not going to get their balance right with female or ethnic minority characters. It's why high fantasy with orcs and elves is often better, as those are you distinct races and you don't have to think about reality.

I'm interested to see what a Trolloc looks like, and how they differentiate from an Ogier, but I can't say any of the characters really look like they did in my imagination. I understand the desire to 'ethnic it up', but the whole point is that they're from an inbred backwater - they're meant to all look similar...EXCEPT RAND. But he's not the main character, is he? That's going to be Moraine, which seems like telling a different story to me.

As I said, I think the Riftwar had a lot more scope for this. You could change the race of characters quite cleanly without problem, and the main antagonists, and then later on the allies are Asian. So it's, well, a lot more balanced. And, to me, seems a lot better written. So far, The Wheel of Time is, for me, fast paced for the sake of fast paced. There's not much in the way of variance, characters make decisions for the purpose of the plot alone...

Well, I guess that last point sets it up perfectly as a successor to GoT, lol. The series, at least.

Stom wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:

Stom wrote:I'm in the middle of book three, and, well, I don't get that this would make a particularly good TV show...

Also, feminism with the Aes Sedai? I'm not sure I get it: most of them are pretty repellant characters with little in the way of a female touch.

I think I'd have much preferred Feist's Riftwar series as an epic fantasy TV show.

The feminism thing is hugely overblown in my opinion. It is a matriarchal society but it’s clear that there are flaws with this and if anything Jordan seems to me to be arguing for balance, not supremacy of one sex. And some of the female characters are terrible, I never took to Egwene.


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most fantasy writers are white middle aged men. They're not going to get their balance right with female or ethnic minority characters. It's why high fantasy with orcs and elves is often better, as those are you distinct races and you don't have to think about reality.

I'm interested to see what a Trolloc looks like, and how they differentiate from an Ogier, but I can't say any of the characters really look like they did in my imagination. I understand the desire to 'ethnic it up', but the whole point is that they're from an inbred backwater - they're meant to all look similar...EXCEPT RAND. But he's not the main character, is he? That's going to be Moraine, which seems like telling a different story to me.

As I said, I think the Riftwar had a lot more scope for this. You could change the race of characters quite cleanly without problem, and the main antagonists, and then later on the allies are Asian. So it's, well, a lot more balanced. And, to me, seems a lot better written. So far, The Wheel of Time is, for me, fast paced for the sake of fast paced. There's not much in the way of variance, characters make decisions for the purpose of the plot alone...

Well, I guess that last point sets it up perfectly as a successor to GoT, lol. The series, at least.

Rand is the central character in the books so it will be interesting to see how they handle him in the series. Book one did seem him as very much under Moraines’ influence so if this is season one and it’s going to focus on the first book then Moraine was a dominant character.


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Also keen to see how it’s brought to life. Whoever plays Lan has a lot to live up to and Trollocks vs Ogier is also curious


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podcast herewhere Judkins says the original plan was 10 episodes a season and they had to recalibrate to fit everything into 8, and it was hard going from 10 to 8 hours. Also, apparently everything in the premiere would have been across 2 episodes originally.

Whilst the tower itself looks like...

Which Tyler wrote:

Whilst the tower itself looks like...

That’s not far from how I imagined it. Look pretty cool.

I've not read the books but have been watching the tv series.

Its quite enjoyable but not in the same league as GoT.

fivepointer wrote:I've not read the books but have been watching the tv series.

Its quite enjoyable but not in the same league as GoT.

I’m quite enjoying it. Not as gripping as GOT was in the first four seasons but I hope it can keep going as it has been given the tv producers have the entire book series to work with.

The children of the light are a bit of a let down though.

I plan to watch it, but want to get through the books first. Just started book 4. I'll be honest, they're fine, but they're never going to be my favorite series ever. I saw someone saying how amazing Jordan's depictions of different cultures were and I just think of Tolkien and Feist and Martin and think "really"?

I mean, the books usually end very well, but the first 5 or 6 chapters of each book so far have been a real drag. No side-character has any real depth, it feels. I know that's common in fantasy, but still: this is meant to be one of the best series of the genre and while it's a nicely woven story, I don't feel it belongs up there, tbh. Characters make decisions based upon the plot, and obviously so, which is a real frustration.

Would be good to read some fantasy written by a really good writer, tbh, rather than by really good world builder who is an OK writer. I still love Gemmell. He's not seen as a great of fantasy, and his writing is far from polished, but he builds emotional attachments to characters fantastically.

Also loved Conn Iggulden. Was a member of his forums for a very long time. Not sure they exist anymore.

Gemmell was the all time best afaic. Miles ahead of anyone else I've read. Other fantasy writers get lost in their own bullshit but Gemmell just kept it 'real'. I usually like Iggulden too.

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Donny osmond wrote:Gemmell was the all time best afaic. Miles ahead of anyone else I've read. Other fantasy writers get lost in their own bullshit but Gemmell just kept it 'real'. I usually like Iggulden too.

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Druss the Legend is a great character (weren’t they going to make a film?) and Waylander also a great anti hero. Gemmells strength is in keeping the story telling to the front and not getting too carried away with distractions. There’s the source and some supernatural elements but much of the plot could be set in a medieval landscape without the magic.


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Which Tyler wrote:

Stom wrote:

Which Tyler wrote: Epic fantasy - she'll be a fireball-throwing type wizard

I've always meant to give Jordan (it is Robert Jordan, right?) another go. Read something of his as a teenager and couldn't get into it, but heard good things about him.

That's the one - his series had some really strong books, and some utter tripe. However, it is at least, finished, along with fan reactions; so they'll be able to plan out the whole thing in advance and know where they need to add and where they need to cut (heavily).
Quite honestly, I wouldn't bother with the reading (maybe an audiobook as it's less time consuming if you feel like it); and just trust the show to know what's what - it might not work, but there's over 11,000 pages of material to read in there.

So I’m half way through book 4 now and… it’s sometimes a struggle. Any time characters interact with each other it’s just terrible. The history and the section with Rand in Rhuidean was really good for me, I loved piecing together the history instead of having it told to me in one go.

But my God, if they’re all like this, I’m going to struggle to finish this. I hear Sanderson is better, but that’s a good 2 million words away…

Stom wrote:

Which Tyler wrote:

Stom wrote:
I've always meant to give Jordan (it is Robert Jordan, right?) another go. Read something of his as a teenager and couldn't get into it, but heard good things about him.

That's the one - his series had some really strong books, and some utter tripe. However, it is at least, finished, along with fan reactions; so they'll be able to plan out the whole thing in advance and know where they need to add and where they need to cut (heavily).
Quite honestly, I wouldn't bother with the reading (maybe an audiobook as it's less time consuming if you feel like it); and just trust the show to know what's what - it might not work, but there's over 11,000 pages of material to read in there.

So I’m half way through book 4 now and… it’s sometimes a struggle. Any time characters interact with each other it’s just terrible. The history and the section with Rand in Rhuidean was really good for me, I loved piecing together the history instead of having it told to me in one go.

But my God, if they’re all like this, I’m going to struggle to finish this. I hear Sanderson is better, but that’s a good 2 million words away…

The middle books are hard work. It’s worth it at the other end but Jordan tries a few things mid series that don’t really work.


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Stom wrote: So I’m half way through book 4 now and… it’s sometimes a struggle. Any time characters interact with each other it’s just terrible. The history and the section with Rand in Rhuidean was really good for me, I loved piecing together the history instead of having it told to me in one go.

But my God, if they’re all like this, I’m going to struggle to finish this. I hear Sanderson is better, but that’s a good 2 million words away…

If you've made it past the opening 3 books with their bog-standard hero's journey and hunt for the McGuffin; I'd recommend getting to the end of book 7 before really re-assessing commitment.

There's an event in Book 6 that I suspect the show writers have been told they'll be allowed to reach more-or-less regardless (given second season before S1 aired, and a 3rd already greenlit about half way through the first season.)

In terms of plot books 4-7 are the peak of the series - but that's mostly looking back in retrospect.