Lions

[whatisthejava]

Can’t help but feel we got almost everyone. Gray, and Richie a bit unlucky and mcinally/brown just injured at the wrong time

[whatisthejava]

And I think all 8 have a reasonable chance of starting a test and would expect at least 6 to be in 23 if all play well

[Donny osmond]

Yeah our hookers have been unlucky in their injuries at the wrong time, I reckon either of them would've been in the mix if fit.

I reckon both Gray and Cummings are better 2nd rows than Lawes but Lawes does have bags of experience and a rep for being a hard man (i.e. a fckin thug) that the coaches will be looking for in SA.

I felt the Lions centre selections were quite bizarre and really just set up to defend. It feels like any attacking is just going to be left to the 10 to organise and try and get the ball to the wingers who could be quite an exciting lot except they'll be outside those centres.

Underhill missing from the back row was the biggest surprise to me, altho I know he's had his problems, but taking Conan? JFC.

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[whatisthejava]

Out of everyone i think the 2 guys that have the hardest competition is Fagerson and Watson
Everyone will be horses for courses
Fagerson v Furlong is going to be who plays best, who scrummagers better and who offers the most hard carrying
Watson is really up against it , on one side he has Curry who plays more like a 6 than Watson and the other he has Tipurics skills, none of the 7s play like each other and so it will be really difficult to say who played badly

The english pundits will be bigging up Curry, the welsh Tipuric, so Watson really does need to pinball wizard the fuck into every game

[Cameo]

Anyone else find this board was down the last couple of days?

First reaction to the squad was that it was great to be quibbling round the edges without a general sense of being fed up.

Echo what others have said about Gray and Ritchie and hookers.

A few lucky ones in there. Hill probably the most so. Simmonds you can say has top club form and hasn't had the chance at international level. Daly has no form but has proven it in the past. Whereas Hill has good club form, got a chance to prove it and really didn't show up well. I'm sure he'll do well in the warmups but it'd be a shame I'd they end up having to pick him in the tests.

Anyway, I kind of expect a fairly comfortable win (not by scoreline as I don't think that's how Gatland rolls - but I. terms of the Lions generally looking like the better team). SA weren't that good until the final at the World Cup, and haven't played since.

Nice to be excited though.

[Big D]

Fair play Java, your optimism was rewarded.

I feel like every 50/50 went our way. Some cracking backrow talent left at home. I'd have taken Underhil, Ryan and Ringrose but it ain't my party.

I have seen a few argue about Hill over Gray but to me they are different types of second rows and don't think it was one or the other. I would imagine the lack of "dominant tackles" done for Gray.

I reckon we will see the Lions try and move the ball with the likes of Simmonds popping up around the centres.

Oh and Chris Fucking Harris, get in lad. Up over £100 thanks to him.

[ButchCarlisle]

Oh and Chris Fucking Harris, get in lad. Up over £100 thanks to him.

Yeah me as well. Got a tenner in at 10/1 the day after the France game as had a feeling he might make it, and watched his odds tumble in following weeks. That tenner would've won me 7.50 if I'd put it on last week!

[Mikey Brown]

This was irritating to see but I have to admit it's sort of funny.



With Williams a previous test lion and Daly (regardless of form) surely pencilled in as a versatile, goal-kicking no.23 I can easily see Hogg ending up in the Scotland column, particularly if he makes a big defensive clanger.

[whatisthejava]

The salty tears coming from Ireland right now is something to behold

Complete refusal to acknowledge the way Gatland wants to play doesn't benefit Irish backs or forwards.

Journos literally crawling over broken glass complaining about Sexton and Ringrose

[Big D]

This was irritating to see but I have to admit it's sort of funny.



With Williams a previous test lion and Daly (regardless of form) surely pencilled in as a versatile, goal-kicking no.23 I can easily see Hogg ending up in the Scotland column, particularly if he makes a big defensive clanger.

If someone can't get the LHP and THP order correct for the Scottish lads then it isn't worth looking at.

[whatisthejava]

I really can’t see past a back 3 of

Williams, Hogg, Adams

Centres
Henshaw and Harris


From 9-1 I think it’s totally open

[Cameo]

I don't want to be harsh on the guy but I still struggle to see Harris as a starting lion. I think Aki Henshaw or Farrell Henshaw are both more likely.

[Mikey Brown]

It’s fair. It was hard to see him having an impact at all international level, but then he did. Gatland has never appeared overly bothered about handling skills in his centres and he’ll surely have enjoyed seeing Harris belting people all through the 6 nations.

Biggar, Farrell, Henshaw as a midfield is pretty hilarious but may well happen.

Daly is apparently being viewed as a centre, I’d imagine to some degree just to crowbar his goal-kicking in. It would be nice to actually have some pace in the midfield somewhere but I’d be surprised if he can fulfil what Tandy has been asking of Harris in Scotland defensive system.

Should we even assume Tandy wants to run the same system? Would a current national coach do that with a squad full of rival players?

I don’t think I agree on the back three WITJ. I think it’s wide open. Watson was the form winger in the tournament, with Adams, LRZ, VDM before Williams. Is it worth putting Williams at 11 just to deal with Kolbe?

[septic 9]

can't see past a back 3 of Hogg, Watson and Williams.
can't see past Farrell starting so its either him at 10 with Aki and Henshaw, or him at 12 with Henshaw at 13. I'd guess the former
Prob start Murray, with Davies on bench (although Price would be my pick to start)

Lots of kicking, good chasers, lots of box kicking, 2 wings good in the air, Big lump at 12 to truck it up and set ball up. Top goal kicker.
That's a Gatlandball set of backs

[Soapy]

This was irritating to see but I have to admit it's sort of funny.



With Williams a previous test lion and Daly (regardless of form) surely pencilled in as a versatile, goal-kicking no.23 I can easily see Hogg ending up in the Scotland column, particularly if he makes a big defensive clanger.

If someone can't get the LHP and THP order correct for the Scottish lads then it isn't worth looking at.

If Sutherland gets and stays fully fit he's got a great chance to start. Injury-free I'm hopeful we'll get 4 Scots in the 23 for the 1st test.

[Big D]

Watson, Williams and Hogg are probably in pole position but it is far from nailed on. Adams has probably the most rounded game of them all and is quality. Duhan is the only real "big winger" option and LRZ is improving all the time. Plenty to choose from.

One or two cock ups in the warm up games and someone really grasping the opportunity could see pretty much any combination other than a LRZ, Adams and Duhan combo start a test.

The potential bench options are really interesting up front. Given Itoje rarely needs to come off and AWJ playing 80 mins often, I wonder if we will see a bench without a second row and Bierne covering from 6. Would allow say Tipuric and Simmonds/Conan on the bench to come on and lift the pace.

I do worry a little that the Exeter guys might be suffering a little when it comes to the tour. They, particularly Hogg, are likely to play nearly every game between now and the tour.

[Mikey Brown]

There's very little in it across the whole squad. That's why I suddenly find this tour much more interesting I think. It does make predicting the sides or the number of Scots involved a bit pointless though. They've all got the quality to push for a test spot but some are in areas of huge competition or competing with established Lions.

A few test spots are sewn up like Furlong, Itoje, AWJ, Faletau but outside of that anything could happen. I don't see Hogg at 15 as the lock that some do, even though I think he's generally been great in the last year or so.

[af73]

With so few warm up games the number of combinations and national pairings selected in the squad is instructive. They could have it in their heads that one error or one moment of glory is their only fleeting chance to change the perception.

Of course the message will be one for all etc but they are competitive animals with an opportunity being dangled in front of them.

For the backs in particular something I saw on the last couple of tours, especially in the early games, was a conspicuous attempt to be noticed individually even if that meant to the detriment of the team (and particularly if it meant elevating a rival).

Possibly a symptom of modern media and the obsession with "who scored", the post match interview and MoTM award but overlaps were often ignored and cut-backs instead of the simple pass chosen.

[Big D]

A poster on another board with a few thoughts on a recent article.

https://ontopofthemoon.com/2021/05/18/a ... nds-lions/

[Cameo]

Haha - I enjoyed that. Rugby round the world seems to have more than its fair share of journalists who are there just to create controversy with little regard for the facts.

[Mikey Brown]

https://www.rugbyworld.com/lions-2021/t ... ndy-125252

[Big D]

Ronan Kelleher is training with the Lions. Seems out hookers are at least 2nd choice back up at best.

[whatisthejava]

Ronan Kelleher is training with the Lions. Seems out hookers are at least 2nd choice back up at best.

I rate kellerher but turner has been competing with 3 other class hookers and kellerher has been beaten to selection by Herring.

Looking at what the strengths of a lions forward you would suspect that Turners aggression would have seen him through, then again kellerhers throwing is slightly better

[Big D]

Ronan Kelleher is training with the Lions. Seems out hookers are at least 2nd choice back up at best.

I rate kellerher but turner has been competing with 3 other class hookers and kellerher has been beaten to selection by Herring.

Looking at what the strengths of a lions forward you would suspect that Turners aggression would have seen him through, then again kellerhers throwing is slightly better

Lions coaches obviously see it differently. I do think we have raised Turner above the level of his actual play at times though.

[Puja]

Ronan Kelleher is training with the Lions. Seems out hookers are at least 2nd choice back up at best.

I rate kellerher but turner has been competing with 3 other class hookers and kellerher has been beaten to selection by Herring.

Looking at what the strengths of a lions forward you would suspect that Turners aggression would have seen him through, then again kellerhers throwing is slightly better

If they're literally just looking for someone to chuck the ball in and facilitate whole pack training while LCD and George are away, then it makes sense that they'd pick a strong lineout thrower rather than necessarily the next cab off the rank.

Puja