RugbyRebels

Just to get ball rolling it would be nice to make a few experiments against Tonga so how about? (also gives Itoje, T Curry, Farrell, Ford, Youngs, Sinckler, Mako etc some more rest)

1.Genge
2.Cowan-Dickie
3.Stuart
4.Isiekwe
5.Lawes
6.Underhill
7.Sam Simmonds
8.Dombrandt
9.Randall
10.Smith (C)
11.May
12.Slade
13.Tuilagi
14.Radwan
15.Steward

It will partly depend how well the team plays previously. If performances are poor, there will be more pressure to let the established players have another crack.

But Simmonds won't play, let alone at 7. And Slade won't play 12. Isiekwe likewise won't be in the squad.

I just want to see a back line of:

Randall
Smith
May
Tuilagi
Marchant
Radwan
Malins

That would be explosive.

Peej wrote:It will partly depend how well the team plays previously. If performances are poor, there will be more pressure to let the established players have another crack.

But Simmonds won't play, let alone at 7. And Slade won't play 12. Isiekwe likewise won't be in the squad.

This seems to be the habit of England over playing its first choices and then having real issues with succession planning : no.8, lock, Scrum half and Centres ( as always!) being cases in point

Stom wrote:I just want to see a back line of:

Randall
Smith
May
Tuilagi
Marchant
Radwan
Malins

That would be explosive.

That would be quite pleasant indeed. Although I'm still not 100% convinced on Randall - when he's good, he's very very good, but when he's bad his passing goes to arse. Mind, that's on brand for Eddie's England 9s.

I don't know if I would prefer that backline or to fit Steward in at 15 (maybe drop Radwan and put Malins on the wing?) - he's just so incredibly solid at the back that it's hard to leave him out. Plus, Watson's back this weekend with plenty of time to show form before the AIs - this is the most exciting bunch of back three options that we've had in a while.

Puja

jngf wrote:Just to get ball rolling it would be nice to make a few experiments against Tonga so how about? (also gives Itoje, T Curry, Farrell, Ford, Youngs, Sinckler, Mako etc some more rest)

1.Genge
2.Cowan-Dickie
3.Stuart
4.Isiekwe
5.Lawes
6.Underhill
7.Sam Simmonds
8.Dombrandt
9.Randall
10.Smith (C)
11.May
12.Slade
13.Tuilagi
14.Radwan
15.Steward

Giving the captaincy to a newbie who already has no experienced playmaker to back him up, with a midfield that we've seen never quite fulfill its potential on his third cap? That really is an awful idea. Dombrandt, Genge, Lawes or Underhill would be far more logical choices as captain.

I'm not sure I'd risk Manu against Tonga. Put Marchant in there and give him a chance. Similarly Slade's woeful start to the season doesn't deserve rewarding with selection. A Lawrence/Marchant combination would be interesting, maybe too green.

Can we really take the approach of ‘not risking’ Manu? It feels pointless selecting him for a squad at all if we’re accepting he can only go 1 game at a time without getting injured.

I think if we’re doing that we need to get Lawrence in running the same spots and stick with whatever midfield shape that is.

It’s such a shame there seems no real logical spot (long-term) for Marchant. Unless form suddenly starts being a consideration for Slade/Daly etc.

Peej wrote: Isiekwe likewise won't be in the squad.

My eyes went funny reading that bit.

Beasties wrote:

Peej wrote: Isiekwe likewise won't be in the squad.

My eyes went funny reading that bit.

Hadn't noticed that, but now I can see nothing else.

I think Dombrandt may have played himself out of the England 8 shirt last night. It's all very well being great when the game is fast and loose and tailored to your strengths, but international rugby is more likely to be the high pressure environment that Sale put him under and he didn't show up.

Quirke answered a lot of my questions last night though.

Puja

FKAS wrote:

jngf wrote:Just to get ball rolling it would be nice to make a few experiments against Tonga so how about? (also gives Itoje, T Curry, Farrell, Ford, Youngs, Sinckler, Mako etc some more rest)

1.Genge
2.Cowan-Dickie
3.Stuart
4.Isiekwe
5.Lawes
6.Underhill
7.Sam Simmonds
8.Dombrandt
9.Randall
10.Smith (C)
11.May
12.Slade
13.Tuilagi
14.Radwan
15.Steward

Giving the captaincy to a newbie who already has no experienced playmaker to back him up, with a midfield that we've seen never quite fulfill its potential on his third cap? That really is an awful idea. Dombrandt, Genge, Lawes or Underhill would be far more logical choices as captain.

I'm not sure I'd risk Manu against Tonga. Put Marchant in there and give him a chance. Similarly Slade's woeful start to the season doesn't deserve rewarding with selection. A Lawrence/Marchant combination would be interesting, maybe too green.

Agree on all of the above. Why would Smith be selected as captain when he’s never performed that role at club or age grade level? Just weird …

No point in brining Simmonds back in to play at 7 when he hasn’t played that role in years either.

I’d much prefer Lawrence and Marchant as a 12/13 combo.

Puja wrote: I think Dombrandt may have played himself out of the England 8 shirt last night. It's all very well being great when the game is fast and loose and tailored to your strengths, but international rugby is more likely to be the high pressure environment that Sale put him under and he didn't show up.

Quirke answered a lot of my questions last night though.

Puja

I take your point, but let’s face it, it’s not as though Billy hasn’t had lots of quiet, ineffectual games. Dombrandt definitely needs to find a way to be more effective in tight games, but I think there’s also a growing expectation on him to product 9/10 performances week on week which isn’t realistic.

100% agree on Quirke.

Puja wrote:

Beasties wrote:

Peej wrote: Isiekwe likewise won't be in the squad.

My eyes went funny reading that bit.

Hadn't noticed that, but now I can see nothing else.

I think Dombrandt may have played himself out of the England 8 shirt last night. It's all very well being great when the game is fast and loose and tailored to your strengths, but international rugby is more likely to be the high pressure environment that Sale put him under and he didn't show up.

Quirke answered a lot of my questions last night though.

Puja

Some good points. Although shifting to the wing may not suit him, I'm not convinced Marchant is a game-affecting international though I'd not be bothered by him being tried to prove it one way or the other.

Until we know if Jones is going to play more open rugby, picking a team is a lottery.

Picking one's first names on the teamsheet is what counts, perhaps. If I was picking a first-choice unit, I'd say Itoje and Marler immediately. Then, I'd go with Curry, Sinckler and LCD. Beyond that six, though? It's then favourite time. I'd have Smith and Sam Simmonds probably.

For this match, I haven't a clue without knowing Jones's directional thinking. I'd definitely play Smith and Simmonds because they are the two biggest question marks.

1. Genge
2. Cowan-Dickie
3. Stuart
4. Isiekwe
5. Itoje
6. Curry
7. Underhill
8. Willis

09. Youngs
10. Smith
11. Radwan
12. Manu
13. Marchant
14. Watson
15. Mallins



16. Dunn, 17. Obano, 18. Heyes, 19. Lawes, 20. Simmonds
21. Quirke, 22. Ford, 23. Steward


HK, THP and FH are because it's Tonga, for the rest of the AI George benches, Sinkler starts (Stuart to bench)and Ford starts with Smith on the bench

LCD is broken by the looks of it. Don't think Willis has been the squad, and don't see him getting a call up at this stage.

Willis was in the extended training squad in the summer, but wasn’t retained for the tests.

I was surprised at the time (I’d definitely have had him in over Chick for example) and I’m also surprised he didn’t make the recent training squad. He’s been consistently very good for Wasps.