Australia vs England - First Test

[twitchy]

[FKAS]

He’s the first apprentice to be capped whilst still classed as an apprentice.

Martin was in the 'Shadow Squad' for the 2021 Six Nations and Hill was an apprentice in the warm up camp in Portugal before the Autumn internationals in 2018, but no longer listed as an apprentice when the actual Autumn squad was announced.

I stand corrected on the technicality, but that feels like incredible splitting of hairs between Shadow Squad and apprentice. No-one could think that Martin and Hill and Arundell weren't very similar selections in terms of their accession to the squad.

The difference, of course, is that Arundell is getting a chance at a cap against Australia away, rather than Italy or Japan at home.

Puja

Martin won his only cap Vs Ireland so that was a fairly tough test.

[Puja]

He’s the first apprentice to be capped whilst still classed as an apprentice.

Martin was in the 'Shadow Squad' for the 2021 Six Nations and Hill was an apprentice in the warm up camp in Portugal before the Autumn internationals in 2018, but no longer listed as an apprentice when the actual Autumn squad was announced.

I stand corrected on the technicality, but that feels like incredible splitting of hairs between Shadow Squad and apprentice. No-one could think that Martin and Hill and Arundell weren't very similar selections in terms of their accession to the squad.

The difference, of course, is that Arundell is getting a chance at a cap against Australia away, rather than Italy or Japan at home.

Puja

Martin won his only cap Vs Ireland so that was a fairly tough test.

Gods, will people stop bringing *facts* into these discussions! I did not come here to be attacked like this!

Puja

[FKAS]

I stand corrected on the technicality, but that feels like incredible splitting of hairs between Shadow Squad and apprentice. No-one could think that Martin and Hill and Arundell weren't very similar selections in terms of their accession to the squad.

The difference, of course, is that Arundell is getting a chance at a cap against Australia away, rather than Italy or Japan at home.

Puja

Martin won his only cap Vs Ireland so that was a fairly tough test.

Gods, will people stop bringing *facts* into these discussions! I did not come here to be attacked like this!

Puja

Don't worry, this time tomorrow we'll have a new match to argue over.

[Puja]

Because I'm bored at work, thought I'd have a look at the breakdown of players from the different English clubs vs their performance this season:

Leicester 1st - 6 players in the XXIII
Saracens 2nd - 5 players
Quins 3rd - 3 players
Saints 4th - 2 players
No Glaws players (standard)
Sale 6th - 1 player
Exeter 7th - 3 players
Irish - 1 player
None from Wasps, Bristol, Worcester, Newcastle
Bath - 2 players

So that's 16 from the top 4, which is pretty good in terms of form selections, and all but 2 coming from the top 8. And, for cohesion's sake, 9 of the starting XV are from the top 3 clubs (and 5 of the bench as well).

Puja

[Which Tyler]

"Even more interesting that Smith-Farrell is backed against Samu Kerevi. Because Ford-Farrell wasn't"

Slight difference in that Smith needs every single minute of international rugby available if he's to be a viable option for RWC23, and that I'm pretty damned sure Ford-Farrell has been trusted against Kerevi

Twice in 2016
Then Novemeber 2017
And November 2018 (albeit Ford off the bench, whilst we were still trying to make Te'o an international player)
And of course, RWC 2019 (again, with Ford off the bench)

So of the 5 times Kerevi has faced England, Ford-Farrell started 3 of them, and had 20-30 minutes in the other 2

[Peej]

What did Puja say about facts, Which?

[Puja]

"Even more interesting that Smith-Farrell is backed against Samu Kerevi. Because Ford-Farrell wasn't"

Slight difference in that Smith needs every single minute of international rugby available if he's to be a viable option for RWC23, and that I'm pretty damned sure Ford-Farrell has been trusted against Kerevi

Twice in 2016
Then Novemeber 2017
And November 2018 (albeit Ford off the bench, whilst we were still trying to make Te'o an international player)
And of course, RWC 2019 (again, with Ford off the bench)

So of the 5 times Kerevi has faced England, Ford-Farrell started 3 of them, and had 20-30 minutes in the other 2

I think it's more the fact that Ford was abruptly dropped for the Australia quarter final before being restored for the semi and final. Obviously there was something that made Jones revert for that game, that wasn't there against NZ.

Puja

[Scrumhead]

Perhaps. Although I don’t think we should always assume that we’re changing to try to nullify the opposition’s attacking threats. Maybe that change was made because Eddie felt it was a better way of exploiting the Aussie defence.

[Mikey Brown]

I thought this was based on a quote from Jones himself, but I guess that doesn’t really mean much either.

[FKAS]

"Even more interesting that Smith-Farrell is backed against Samu Kerevi. Because Ford-Farrell wasn't"

Slight difference in that Smith needs every single minute of international rugby available if he's to be a viable option for RWC23, and that I'm pretty damned sure Ford-Farrell has been trusted against Kerevi

Twice in 2016
Then Novemeber 2017
And November 2018 (albeit Ford off the bench, whilst we were still trying to make Te'o an international player)
And of course, RWC 2019 (again, with Ford off the bench)

So of the 5 times Kerevi has faced England, Ford-Farrell started 3 of them, and had 20-30 minutes in the other 2

I think it's more the fact that Ford was abruptly dropped for the Australia quarter final before being restored for the semi and final. Obviously there was something that made Jones revert for that game, that wasn't there against NZ.

Puja

I think Eddie knew he could go for a more direct backline. Australia had Leilafano, Genia and Beale as the kicking options. Not likely to cause any problems in terms of tactical kicking game. England could dominate territory with Ford on the bench and then use extra weight in the midfield to stop the big midfield runners of Australia.

[Puja]

I thought this was based on a quote from Jones himself, but I guess that doesn’t really mean much either.

To be honest, I think I trust Charlie Morgan's assessment of Eddie Jones's thoughts more than I would anything that Eddie Jones publically says about what he was thinking.

Puja

[Banquo]

anyway, to avoid the dour label, I hope we stuff em in the morning!!

[Oakboy]

anyway, to avoid the dour label, I hope we stuff em in the morning!!

Agreed. Bloody funny KO time - 10:55 am. What's wrong with 11:00?

[Mikey Brown]

I’m sure I heard someone on a podcast recently saying the Aussies are routinely late for kickoffs, at every level. Trying to compensate?

[FKAS]

Not so worried about the kick off time just annoyed it's still on Sky. Their rugby coverage is cack and I've long since stopped paying for it. Was hoping Amazon would have the coverage by now.

[Raggs]

Not so worried about the kick off time just annoyed it's still on Sky. Their rugby coverage is cack and I've long since stopped paying for it. Was hoping Amazon would have the coverage by now.

Seeing as the options are likely Sky with English or Aussie commentary, I think I'm going to try the russian stream and hope they're commentating over the top. Won't have a clue what they're saying, but at least they won't be annoying me.

[FKAS]

Not so worried about the kick off time just annoyed it's still on Sky. Their rugby coverage is cack and I've long since stopped paying for it. Was hoping Amazon would have the coverage by now.

Seeing as the options are likely Sky with English or Aussie commentary, I think I'm going to try the russian stream and hope they're commentating over the top. Won't have a clue what they're saying, but at least they won't be annoying me.

Good call. I remember in the Barnes era of Prem commentary watching some games on mute. Only issue was missing out on the refs mic.

[Danno]

Not so worried about the kick off time just annoyed it's still on Sky. Their rugby coverage is cack and I've long since stopped paying for it. Was hoping Amazon would have the coverage by now.

Seeing as the options are likely Sky with English or Aussie commentary, I think I'm going to try the russian stream and hope they're commentating over the top. Won't have a clue what they're saying, but at least they won't be annoying me.

VK /rubyonsofa doesn't work for me anymore if that's what you're planning.

[Raggs]

Not so worried about the kick off time just annoyed it's still on Sky. Their rugby coverage is cack and I've long since stopped paying for it. Was hoping Amazon would have the coverage by now.

Seeing as the options are likely Sky with English or Aussie commentary, I think I'm going to try the russian stream and hope they're commentating over the top. Won't have a clue what they're saying, but at least they won't be annoying me.

VK /rubyonsofa doesn't work for me anymore if that's what you're planning.

Just got it loaded and streaming, but really low quality. May try through a different vpn location later to see if that's the issue.

[Epaminondas Pules]

Game day!! What’s your predictions?

England by 7.

No idea why. Could go either way and we’ve looked just a teeny bit gash if late. But fuck it. The pack looks built to get dominance up front which we desperately need.

[Beasties]

Can’t you pay for it through Now TV or some such?

[Mellsblue]

Can’t you pay for it through Now TV or some such?

Yep. Very easy to do and not that expensive.

[Epaminondas Pules]

Can’t you pay for it through Now TV or some such?

Yep. Very easy to do and not that expensive.

Echo this. They’ve made it proper simple.

[Banquo]

The commentary is pretty iffy- a tad one eyed-but fitzy and o Gara are always worth a listen.