That is genius
If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
- Sandydragon
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- Galfon
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
long queues (especially in the exit direction) have also ensued, reportedly.
Blue Monday ? @10, 10/10 ?? nah.
Blue Monday ? @10, 10/10 ?? nah.
- Puja
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Belarus now making noises about Ukranians blowing up border bridges, shooting guards, and making plans for an invasion of their country, even going as far with the sham as to summon the UKR ambassador to denounce said invasion plans. Looks like Lukachenko's decided he's willing to risk his dictatorship to try and bolster Putin's.
Seems a weird time for it. Yes, Putin needs the pressure of continual UKR victories removed asap, but with the mud and winter coming in, won't any Belarussian column towards Kyiv suffer the same fate as the Russian one in Feb?
Puja
Seems a weird time for it. Yes, Putin needs the pressure of continual UKR victories removed asap, but with the mud and winter coming in, won't any Belarussian column towards Kyiv suffer the same fate as the Russian one in Feb?
Puja
Backist Monk
- Zhivago
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
These attacks on Ukrainian citizens are coming from Belarus territory. Even so, I doubt Ukraine is planning an invasion, and I don't think they'd be blowing up their border bridges if they were going to invade. I wouldn't blame Ukraine for taking decisive pre-emptive action against Lukashenko's belligerence.Puja wrote: ↑Mon Oct 10, 2022 1:25 pm Belarus now making noises about Ukranians blowing up border bridges, shooting guards, and making plans for an invasion of their country, even going as far with the sham as to summon the UKR ambassador to denounce said invasion plans. Looks like Lukachenko's decided he's willing to risk his dictatorship to try and bolster Putin's.
Seems a weird time for it. Yes, Putin needs the pressure of continual UKR victories removed asap, but with the mud and winter coming in, won't any Belarussian column towards Kyiv suffer the same fate as the Russian one in Feb?
Puja
If Belarus invades Ukraine, it'll end up much worse for them than it did for the Russian Kyiv grouping. Ukraine is battle hardened now.
Все буде Україна!
Смерть ворогам!!
- Sandydragon
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Unless Russia has troops ready to go in Belarus then nothing is happening. It might be a way to tie up UKR troops in defending Kiev.
- Son of Mathonwy
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Putin's happy to see more troops thrown into the meat grinder at this stage, no matter the source.Sandydragon wrote: ↑Mon Oct 10, 2022 7:03 pm Unless Russia has troops ready to go in Belarus then nothing is happening. It might be a way to tie up UKR troops in defending Kiev.
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Sandy raises a good point though. While Lukashenko's an idiot, he's a devious and cunning idiot who's managed to stay atop a murder pile for a good long while. He's not going to chuck his own troops away for nothing.Son of Mathonwy wrote: ↑Mon Oct 10, 2022 9:44 pmPutin's happy to see more troops thrown into the meat grinder at this stage, no matter the source.Sandydragon wrote: ↑Mon Oct 10, 2022 7:03 pm Unless Russia has troops ready to go in Belarus then nothing is happening. It might be a way to tie up UKR troops in defending Kiev.
Puja
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
A salient pointPuja wrote: ↑Mon Oct 10, 2022 10:38 pmSandy raises a good point though. While Lukashenko's an idiot, he's a devious and cunning idiot who's managed to stay atop a murder pile for a good long while. He's not going to chuck his own troops away for nothing.Son of Mathonwy wrote: ↑Mon Oct 10, 2022 9:44 pmPutin's happy to see more troops thrown into the meat grinder at this stage, no matter the source.Sandydragon wrote: ↑Mon Oct 10, 2022 7:03 pm Unless Russia has troops ready to go in Belarus then nothing is happening. It might be a way to tie up UKR troops in defending Kiev.
Puja
I read this recently, which is relevant. Far from a certainty, but an interesting possibility:
In addition, one should not discount the cunning of Lukashenka, whose dictatorship is older than Putin's. As long as Putin presses, Lukashenko will try to "loop". In particular, he is now trying to enlist the support of China.
"The level of China's diplomatic relations with Belarus is a step higher than with Russia. Lukashenko has already been invited by Xi Jinping to the People's Republic of China after the 20th Congress of the Communist Party of China (held on October 16). Additional agreements may appear during the congress. And if Lukashenko receives certain guarantees from China regarding the protection of Belarusian sovereignty, then the official Minsk will talk to Moscow from different positions. Lukashenko will be able to behave with Putin in the same way as the President of Kazakhstan Tokayev behaves", - notes Ihar Tyshkevich.
So while Putin is trying to make Lukashenka even more toxic (like himself), Lukashenka is trying to bide his time at least until the situation with China becomes clearer.
Все буде Україна!
Смерть ворогам!!
- Zhivago
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Все буде Україна!
Смерть ворогам!!
- Son of Mathonwy
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- Zhivago
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Ukraine should never have given up nukes.Son of Mathonwy wrote: ↑Tue Oct 11, 2022 4:36 pmThat's the power of a nuclear defence (in the hands of a dictator) - the ability to bomb your enemy's cities and not get yours bombed in return. Pretty sickening.
Все буде Україна!
Смерть ворогам!!
- Sandydragon
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
The cunning idiot has been saying plenty today as more Russian troops arrive in Belarus along with heavy equipment. Hopefully western intelligence can get and idea of the numbers involved and whether it constitutes a real invasion force or just one designed to tie down defenders.Puja wrote: ↑Mon Oct 10, 2022 10:38 pmSandy raises a good point though. While Lukashenko's an idiot, he's a devious and cunning idiot who's managed to stay atop a murder pile for a good long while. He's not going to chuck his own troops away for nothing.Son of Mathonwy wrote: ↑Mon Oct 10, 2022 9:44 pmPutin's happy to see more troops thrown into the meat grinder at this stage, no matter the source.Sandydragon wrote: ↑Mon Oct 10, 2022 7:03 pm Unless Russia has troops ready to go in Belarus then nothing is happening. It might be a way to tie up UKR troops in defending Kiev.
Puja
- Son of Mathonwy
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Yep, so it turns out. Tragic for the world that a country's paying such a price for giving up its nukes. Doesn't exactly encourage disarmament.Zhivago wrote: ↑Tue Oct 11, 2022 5:24 pmUkraine should never have given up nukes.Son of Mathonwy wrote: ↑Tue Oct 11, 2022 4:36 pmThat's the power of a nuclear defence (in the hands of a dictator) - the ability to bomb your enemy's cities and not get yours bombed in return. Pretty sickening.
Having said that, being in NATO or the EU offers similar (if ultimately inferior) protection.
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Все буде Україна!
Смерть ворогам!!
- Sandydragon
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Can we expect more pearls of wisdom from Musk now he has (almost) control of Twitter? As if the world isn't suffering enough.
- Son of Mathonwy
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
He has a colossally overvalued car company therefore, by some logic I can't understand, the answer is yes.Sandydragon wrote: ↑Wed Oct 12, 2022 10:24 am Can we expect more pearls of wisdom from Musk now he has (almost) control of Twitter? As if the world isn't suffering enough.
- Which Tyler
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- Mellsblue
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Don’t believe the Germans promises until the equipment is in Ukraine. They’ve been promising missile defence systems for over four months but sadly they hadn’t arrived in time for the attacks in retaliation for the strike on Kerch Bridge. The govt even managed to fail to authorise an export permit when Ukraine placed an order direct with the supplier.
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
I absolutely stand to be wrong here, but wasn't Germany's issues to do with arms and armaments, but clothes, rations, medical kit etc were all going through fine?
- Mellsblue
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
No idea. I’m just angry that German (in)actions, past and present, are making a terrible situation even worse.
- Which Tyler
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
Absolutely fair.
I think it's also worth saying that, as ever with these supply things, it's not new stuff being given to Ukraine; it's old stuff, sometimes severely outdated stuff, bring given to Ukraine, whilst the donator gets brand new stuff (IIRC France and a few others are exceptions here).
So, for example, Canada, Spain and Germany have just given 200,000 winter clothing kits to Ukraine - they're not new kits, they're probably 10+ years old, and taken out of storage. Canada, Spain and Germany will then buy new stuff for themselves.
Poland, Lithuainia etc are giving (updated) Soviet era tanks, and planes and APCs; and getting new NATO kit.
USA aren't spending $5B (or whatever the current figure is) of "stuff" to Ukraine; they're buying $5B worth of "stuff" for themselves, and giving basically the oldest equivalents they have in storage, to Ukraine.
Same with UK, same with virtually everywhere (with some headline exceptions, like HIMARS).
I'd bet real money that 99% of the food and medical supplies being donated are basically at their use-by date (which is fine, they're being given to be used, not to be put into storage).
I think it's also worth saying that, as ever with these supply things, it's not new stuff being given to Ukraine; it's old stuff, sometimes severely outdated stuff, bring given to Ukraine, whilst the donator gets brand new stuff (IIRC France and a few others are exceptions here).
So, for example, Canada, Spain and Germany have just given 200,000 winter clothing kits to Ukraine - they're not new kits, they're probably 10+ years old, and taken out of storage. Canada, Spain and Germany will then buy new stuff for themselves.
Poland, Lithuainia etc are giving (updated) Soviet era tanks, and planes and APCs; and getting new NATO kit.
USA aren't spending $5B (or whatever the current figure is) of "stuff" to Ukraine; they're buying $5B worth of "stuff" for themselves, and giving basically the oldest equivalents they have in storage, to Ukraine.
Same with UK, same with virtually everywhere (with some headline exceptions, like HIMARS).
I'd bet real money that 99% of the food and medical supplies being donated are basically at their use-by date (which is fine, they're being given to be used, not to be put into storage).
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
WWII era dogfights - for modern warfare
- Zhivago
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
https://apnews.com/article/ukrainian-ch ... 7986d85ef6
... Russia’s open effort to adopt Ukrainian children and bring them up as Russian is already well underway, in one of the most explosive issues of the war, an Associated Press investigation shows. ...
Все буде Україна!
Смерть ворогам!!
- Which Tyler
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Re: If Russia invades Ukraine (more)...
We've known about it for 6 months+, they've "just" ramped things up in Kherson specifically.
Elsewhere, Elon has been talking to Vladimir - and, like Donald, whoever spoke to him last seems to hold the key to the next thing out of his mouth
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... et-ukraine
Elsewhere, Elon has been talking to Vladimir - and, like Donald, whoever spoke to him last seems to hold the key to the next thing out of his mouth
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... et-ukraine