Premiership financial issues

[Mellsblue]

I suppose the most important part of this news is whether the group have named themselves the Wasps Legends? IF so, is one of the tests in the fit and proper owners criteria based on levels of hubris?

I just assumed Dayglo was involved and had named the consortium.

The same thought had crossed my mind.

[Banquo]

I suppose the most important part of this news is whether the group have named themselves the Wasps Legends? IF so, is one of the tests in the fit and proper owners criteria based on levels of hubris?

I just assumed Dayglo was involved and had named the consortium.

The same thought had crossed my mind.

https://www.waspslegends.co.uk/

hope you feel mean now

[Mellsblue]

I just assumed Dayglo was involved and had named the consortium.

The same thought had crossed my mind.

https://www.waspslegends.co.uk/

hope you feel mean now

I’m a bad man.

[FKAS]

I just assumed Dayglo was involved and had named the consortium.

The same thought had crossed my mind.

https://www.waspslegends.co.uk/

hope you feel mean now

Lawrence is listed amongst the Legends...

Sounds like a good organisation, best of luck to them with running the rugby club (apart from games Vs Tigers).

[Peej]

I think it'll be several years before there's a game against Tigers to worry about.

[FKAS]

I think it'll be several years before there's a game against Tigers to worry about.

If they are back for next season in the Championship they might be alright. There's a lot of quality players still trying for contracts or on short term deals. A squad rebuild could be pretty quick and if there's a number of old Wasps players then should come together quite quickly.

Getting the right backroom staff and ensuring whichever stadium you go to has the prerequisite capacity will be key. I don't think the Championship should slow Wasps down to much.

[Mellsblue]

Depends on the new set-up. If the rumours of a ten team top flight are true then they aren’t getting promoted next season and once they have the chance to be promoted they’ll have two other ex-top flight clubs to battle with, one of which will have only just been relegated.

[Banquo]

Depends on the new set-up. If the rumours of a ten team top flight are true then they aren’t getting promoted next season and once they have the chance to be promoted they’ll have two other ex-top flight clubs to battle with, one of which will have only just been relegated.

...and the mighty Bedford.

[Mellsblue]

Didn’t think it needed saying…

[Banquo]

Didn’t think it needed saying…

I've got the Blues today.

[Mellsblue]

Didn’t think it needed saying…

I've got the Blues today.

It’s certainly an uphill battle, if only for one half.

[Banquo]

Didn’t think it needed saying…

I've got the Blues today.

It’s certainly an uphill battle, if only for one half.

Indeed, been there, done that , even if it was a guest appearance one Easter.

[Mellsblue]

I've got the Blues today.

It’s certainly an uphill battle, if only for one half.

Indeed, been there, done that , even if it was a guest appearance one Easter.

There’s a joke in there about Quins no8s but I can’t think of a funny one, which is very much (D)on brand(t).

[Banquo]

It’s certainly an uphill battle, if only for one half.

Indeed, been there, done that , even if it was a guest appearance one Easter.

There’s a joke in there about Quins no8s but I can’t think of a funny one, which is very much (D)on brand(t).

well quite. No-one will nick that.

[Margin_Walker]

This is good news. The RFU step in and take over the Worcester and Wasps DPP & U18s programmes. Employing former staff from those clubs.

https://www.englandrugby.com/news/artic ... emy-update

[fivepointer]

Bristol Rugby Club Limited made a pre-tax loss of £3.3m for the 2021/22 financial year. The results for the year ending May 31st, 2022, compared to a pre-tax loss of £3.5m for the 2020/21 financial year. Turnover for the year was a record £14.2m.

Thankfully Mr Lansdown has very deep pockets.

[Peej]

Exeter selling a 'non-rugby asset' to pay off their Covid loans. I imagine that's the hotel next to SP?

[Banquo]

Exeter selling a 'non-rugby asset' to pay off their Covid loans. I imagine that's the hotel next to SP?

or Jack Nowell.......'s hair

[jimKRFC]

Bristol Rugby Club Limited made a pre-tax loss of £3.3m for the 2021/22 financial year. The results for the year ending May 31st, 2022, compared to a pre-tax loss of £3.5m for the 2020/21 financial year. Turnover for the year was a record £14.2m.

Thankfully Mr Lansdown has very deep pockets.

There's around £12M of "intra-group" transfers from the rugby to other parts of the club, mainly as a "loan" to the part of the group that owns the training ground. So might not be as bad as it seems as losing money/not making profit is good for tax reasons.

But yes, thankfully Mr Lansdown has deep pockets and his kids seem to fully on board as well. The plans for the future look good as well with the sports quarter approved and I heard rumours they're slowing buying up the house behind the Dolman stand so they can rebuild that at some point.

[Timbo]

Bristol Rugby Club Limited made a pre-tax loss of £3.3m for the 2021/22 financial year. The results for the year ending May 31st, 2022, compared to a pre-tax loss of £3.5m for the 2020/21 financial year. Turnover for the year was a record £14.2m.

Thankfully Mr Lansdown has very deep pockets.

There's around £12M of "intra-group" transfers from the rugby to other parts of the club, mainly as a "loan" to the part of the group that owns the training ground. So might not be as bad as it seems as losing money/not making profit is good for tax reasons.

But yes, thankfully Mr Lansdown has deep pockets and his kids seem to fully on board as well. The plans for the future look good as well with the sports quarter approved and I heard rumours they're slowing buying up the house behind the Dolman stand so they can rebuild that at some point.

That’s promising, but at this rate Lansdown will have to buy a few other clubs so Bristol have someone to play.

[Mellsblue]

Sarries replacement fixtures:

[Peej]

An article in today's Times outlines how much of a shitshow it was at Wasps in the last days, but also some of the murkier and predatory dealings that go on.

Wasps rugby club might have been saved had a £60 million rescue package proposal not been rejected only three weeks before the club went into administration.

A “lifeboat” offer was voted on by the board which might have kept the club out of administration and prevented 167 jobs being lost. However, unanimity was required for the bid to proceed and though it was widely popular, there was one man who failed to vote in its favour. That was Derek Richardson, the club owner. Richardson abstained from voting, a decision which immediately killed the proposal.

Wasps were a 155-year-old rugby club and one of the most successful in England since rugby union went professional. They went into administration on October 17, they haven’t played a game since and a large number of the players and the staff remain unemployed. At present, the club have not one single employee and exist only in name.

The rescue bid which might have saved the club was tabled by Hottinger, an international wealth management company, which had a longstanding association with both Wasps and Richardson, a relationship which appears to have soured in the past year. Other board members were astonished that Richardson would nevertheless fail to support the Hottinger offer.

The Hottinger package involved match-funding from Coventry City Council which owns the freehold to the Coventry Arena, where Wasps played their home games. The local authority had not yet signed off on any deal but had been in positive negotiations with Hottinger and were awaiting the green light from the Wasps board before taking the funding proposal to the next stage.

Richardson saved the club when his own takeover rescued them from dire financial straits in 2013. It was Richardson who moved the club from High Wycombe to Coventry. He then raised funds with a £35 million bond scheme which seemed brilliant at the time but which became a lead weight this year when the bond needed to be repaid. It was his inability to repay the bond that ultimately triggered the club’s downfall.

In September, however, the lifeboat opportunity appeared from Hottinger. Richardson had already had a long association with the company. It had looked after his own personal finances for more than a decade. On behalf of other Hottinger clients, it had also invested about £3 million in the club. Before the start of last season, the relationship was still so strong that Hottinger became an official club partner with its name on the right sleeve of the club’s shirt.

Hottinger was also involved in the complicated financial structure in which Wasps sat. Wasps Holdings Limited, which was the club, existed within a holding company, Moonstone, which was based in Malta. Hottinger was engaged as an advisor to Moonstone. One of the directors of Hottinger sat on the Moonstone board.

Last summer, when time was running out on Wasps and the bond repayment, Richardson lost an element of control of Wasps Holdings Ltd when Moonstone changed two of the directors on the board of Wasps, both of whom were seen as allies of Richardson’s. Richardson is understood to have been extremely unhappy that this had been allowed to happen.

As Wasps financial problems became increasingly acute, Hottinger started conversations with Martin Reeves, the chief executive at Coventry City Council about mounting a joint rescue package. Both sides were aware that while they wanted to keep Wasps alive and to continue to have Premiershipship rugby being played at the Coventry Arena, there was a bigger picture here because an investment which involved the Arena could prove exceedingly fruitful as the land around the venue remains ripe for development. Hottinger had already, once, been involved in proposals for a hospital on the site.

By September, Wasps’ debt had grown to £112 million. The Hottinger lifeboat would not have made the club solvent, however, it would have paid off the most urgent debts and allowed the club to continue operating while finding other investors who might have been attracted to the development possibilities of the Arena site.

The Times has seen the executive summary of the bid, a three-page document which offers an “exclusive opportunity” and declares that “the refinance would satisfy outstanding debts to all government or quasi government agencies, refinance the existing public bond issuance and provide capital to begin development of the real estate opportunities”.

Reeves told The Times that Coventry City Council had engaged in “very bona fide conversations” with Hottinger about its proposal. “We were interested. If it had got through on approval at the Wasps board, we would have gone to the Council,” he said. “It would have had a fair chance. If they had said: ‘Yes, the board really likes it’, we would have moved on to the next stage.”

The discussion about the rescue package also included a sweetener for Richardson where he would receive £1 million a year over 20 years. This was perceived to be an offer of an elegant exit. The offer was never written down and Richardson claims that it was never made.

When it came to moving the proposal to the next stage, a unanimous vote in favour was required. At the end of September, when the board voted, every member voted in favour apart from Richardson who decided to abstain.

Richardson told The Times: “At that stage, we were getting inquiries from a lot of people wanting to do deals. It was obvious what was real and what wasn’t real. There were several other deals that were farther down the track and had gone to advanced discussion stages.

“All that we got from Hottinger was a three-page teaser. For a complex business like ours, it’s ridiculous to say there’s a rescue package from a three-page teaser. It would have taken half an hour to put the three-page teaser together. And it could well have distracted more realistic rescue propositions that were being discussed at the time.

“If the board had had a realistic proposition for saving the club and the business, I would have supported that.”

Three and a half weeks after the Hottinger offer hit the dust, Wasps went into administration and the entire staff lost their jobs. It is impossible to say for sure whether the club would have survived had it pursued the Hottinger offer. Nevertheless, it was a potential lifeline and the Wasps board was astonished that they were prevented from grabbing onto it.

Attempts are under way to bring Wasps back next season. If they do return, they would come back into the Championship. However, at present the club has neither a home ground nor any players nor any form of income with which to pay them.

[Mellsblue]

Could be the making of him as a player. Would be good to have a positive out of all this.

Major disappointment for me on confirmation he was being interviewed at Farleigh House and not at his new digs in Bath.

[Mr Mwenda]

An article in today's Times outlines how much of a shitshow it was at Wasps in the last days, but also some of the murkier and predatory dealings that go on.

Wasps rugby club might have been saved had a £60 million rescue package proposal not been rejected only three weeks before the club went into administration.

A “lifeboat” offer was voted on by the board which might have kept the club out of administration and prevented 167 jobs being lost. However, unanimity was required for the bid to proceed and though it was widely popular, there was one man who failed to vote in its favour. That was Derek Richardson, the club owner. Richardson abstained from voting, a decision which immediately killed the proposal.

Wasps were a 155-year-old rugby club and one of the most successful in England since rugby union went professional. They went into administration on October 17, they haven’t played a game since and a large number of the players and the staff remain unemployed. At present, the club have not one single employee and exist only in name.

The rescue bid which might have saved the club was tabled by Hottinger, an international wealth management company, which had a longstanding association with both Wasps and Richardson, a relationship which appears to have soured in the past year. Other board members were astonished that Richardson would nevertheless fail to support the Hottinger offer.

The Hottinger package involved match-funding from Coventry City Council which owns the freehold to the Coventry Arena, where Wasps played their home games. The local authority had not yet signed off on any deal but had been in positive negotiations with Hottinger and were awaiting the green light from the Wasps board before taking the funding proposal to the next stage.

Richardson saved the club when his own takeover rescued them from dire financial straits in 2013. It was Richardson who moved the club from High Wycombe to Coventry. He then raised funds with a £35 million bond scheme which seemed brilliant at the time but which became a lead weight this year when the bond needed to be repaid. It was his inability to repay the bond that ultimately triggered the club’s downfall.

In September, however, the lifeboat opportunity appeared from Hottinger. Richardson had already had a long association with the company. It had looked after his own personal finances for more than a decade. On behalf of other Hottinger clients, it had also invested about £3 million in the club. Before the start of last season, the relationship was still so strong that Hottinger became an official club partner with its name on the right sleeve of the club’s shirt.

Hottinger was also involved in the complicated financial structure in which Wasps sat. Wasps Holdings Limited, which was the club, existed within a holding company, Moonstone, which was based in Malta. Hottinger was engaged as an advisor to Moonstone. One of the directors of Hottinger sat on the Moonstone board.

Last summer, when time was running out on Wasps and the bond repayment, Richardson lost an element of control of Wasps Holdings Ltd when Moonstone changed two of the directors on the board of Wasps, both of whom were seen as allies of Richardson’s. Richardson is understood to have been extremely unhappy that this had been allowed to happen.

As Wasps financial problems became increasingly acute, Hottinger started conversations with Martin Reeves, the chief executive at Coventry City Council about mounting a joint rescue package. Both sides were aware that while they wanted to keep Wasps alive and to continue to have Premiershipship rugby being played at the Coventry Arena, there was a bigger picture here because an investment which involved the Arena could prove exceedingly fruitful as the land around the venue remains ripe for development. Hottinger had already, once, been involved in proposals for a hospital on the site.

By September, Wasps’ debt had grown to £112 million. The Hottinger lifeboat would not have made the club solvent, however, it would have paid off the most urgent debts and allowed the club to continue operating while finding other investors who might have been attracted to the development possibilities of the Arena site.

The Times has seen the executive summary of the bid, a three-page document which offers an “exclusive opportunity” and declares that “the refinance would satisfy outstanding debts to all government or quasi government agencies, refinance the existing public bond issuance and provide capital to begin development of the real estate opportunities”.

Reeves told The Times that Coventry City Council had engaged in “very bona fide conversations” with Hottinger about its proposal. “We were interested. If it had got through on approval at the Wasps board, we would have gone to the Council,” he said. “It would have had a fair chance. If they had said: ‘Yes, the board really likes it’, we would have moved on to the next stage.”

The discussion about the rescue package also included a sweetener for Richardson where he would receive £1 million a year over 20 years. This was perceived to be an offer of an elegant exit. The offer was never written down and Richardson claims that it was never made.

When it came to moving the proposal to the next stage, a unanimous vote in favour was required. At the end of September, when the board voted, every member voted in favour apart from Richardson who decided to abstain.

Richardson told The Times: “At that stage, we were getting inquiries from a lot of people wanting to do deals. It was obvious what was real and what wasn’t real. There were several other deals that were farther down the track and had gone to advanced discussion stages.

“All that we got from Hottinger was a three-page teaser. For a complex business like ours, it’s ridiculous to say there’s a rescue package from a three-page teaser. It would have taken half an hour to put the three-page teaser together. And it could well have distracted more realistic rescue propositions that were being discussed at the time.

“If the board had had a realistic proposition for saving the club and the business, I would have supported that.”

Three and a half weeks after the Hottinger offer hit the dust, Wasps went into administration and the entire staff lost their jobs. It is impossible to say for sure whether the club would have survived had it pursued the Hottinger offer. Nevertheless, it was a potential lifeline and the Wasps board was astonished that they were prevented from grabbing onto it.

Attempts are under way to bring Wasps back next season. If they do return, they would come back into the Championship. However, at present the club has neither a home ground nor any players nor any form of income with which to pay them.

Sugar daddies eh? Cones with the territory they can get the hump and stuff everyone.

[FKAS]

Could be the making of him as a player. Would be good to have a positive out of all this.

Major disappointment for me on confirmation he was being interviewed at Farleigh House and not at his new digs in Bath.

I think the Wuss players are being put up at Farleigh House in the short term until they can sort their housing situations out. I hope the Bath accountants have included that in their Benefit In Kind calculation for the salary cap. Must be a real bind staying at Farleigh for the players in the short term looking at the background for the interview.