It's not the gun laws, it's the Islamists!

[cashead]

Christ, you're so formulaic. It's like you're a bot posting based on a bunch of algorithms.

[morepork]

Pokemon enters the arena of media-induced fear.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36818384


This shit has to stop. It's ridiculous. The waters are being very dangerously muddied here.

[Curry Puff]

This guy was known by the Feds for years, had a documented history of mental illness and domestic abuse convictions[/b], yet he manages to buy a fully automatic assault rifle with no hassle.


If that''s not a systematic failure of infrastructure, I don't know what is.

And much the same regarding Dunblane. Although in this case very harsh new laws were passed to prevent such incidents. Of course they have not done so, but they did serve to distract attention from what was a remarkable bit of police incompetence.

[UGagain]

I don't recall anyone arguing international law doesn't exist, I suspect the point being referred to is one that I made being that most of international law doesn't exist which even with a tiny allowance for nuance isn't remotely the same thing.

I've no idea of what you are trying to say.

But it did make me laugh.

[UGagain]

Here it is. Assad war crimes excused.

http://www.pri.org/stories/2016-04-11/d ... war-crimes

Don't bother guys, apparently the laws on discrimination and proportionality don't apply if its your own people you are killing.

On another thread a few days ago you and your clique were arguing that there is no such thing as international law.

The Syrian Arab Army is defending Syria.

You can quote nonsense articles from Washington think tanks all you like. It will not make it a civil war and it will not make it a popular uprising.

Strange that I have been mentioning the laws of armed conflict more than a few times so your argument doesn't hold water.

If you think that only non-Syrians are fighting against Assad despite the wealth of evidence to the contrary then it's a bit pointless discussing this with you any further. You clearly aren't prepared to consider any evidence that doesn't suit your agenda and just want to dismiss it as CIA fronts regardless.

Ad hominem aka abuse. I don't have an agenda and I'm not allied to any of the protagonists.

I invite you to reason otherwise.

If you quote CIA fronts it is perfectly valid and reasonable to point it out. The CIA IS a principal actor in the Syrian conflict.

You recently belittled and rubbished the work of the very courageous Vanessa Beeley on the spurious charge of not being 'balanced' becaue she was reporting from government held areas but not travelling to the areas controlled by the taakfiris. And you cast aspersions on Rowan's sanity aka abuse.for posting it.

But now you expect the audience to accept 'reports' from organisations with CIA directors on their board at face value.

There's something quite wrong with all of this.

This is censorship pure and simple.

[rowan]

The CIA IS a principal actor in the Syrian conflict.

Surprise, surprise.



A Timeline of CIA Atrocities
http://www.globalresearch.ca/a-timeline ... es/5348804

Timeline of CIA Interventions in Syria
http://www.globalresearch.ca/timeline-o ... ia/5479875

John F Kennedy was purportedly attempting to break up the CIA at the time of his assassination . . .

[Which Tyler]

Pokemon enters the arena of media-induced fear.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36818384


This shit has to stop. It's ridiculous. The waters are being very dangerously muddied here.

WTF? It's like blaming rape on the woman for dressing provocatively.

[rowan]

Though few mainstream media outlets bothered to report on it, the American-led coalition killed a further 56 civilians in Syria yesterday, where it has not been invited by anyone to take part in anything.

BEIRUT (Reuters) - At least 56 civilians were killed on Tuesday in air strikes north of the besieged Islamic State-held city of Manbij in northern Syria, near the border with Turkey, a monitoring group said.

Residents believed the strikes were carried out by U.S.-led coalition planes, the British-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said. It said the dead included 11 children, and dozens more people were wounded.

On Monday 21 people were killed in raids also believed to be by U.S.-led coalition planes on Manbij's northern Hazawneh quarter.

http://www.metro.us/news/suspected-u-s- ... FUR_FDsnA/



Meanwhile, Syrians certainly seem to know who is behind this war, judging by their initial reaction to the Turkey coup:

Supporters of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad celebrated on Saturday after the Turkish army said it was seizing power from President Tayyip Erdogan, while Syrian rebels said the loss of a main regional backer would be a major blow to their struggle.

The government in Damascus has accused Erdogan, who said the coup would fail, of fuelling the Syrian conflict by supporting Islamist insurgents battling Damascus and allowing foreign jihadis to cross the border from Turkey into Syria.

Hundreds of cheering people took to the streets after midnight in Damascus and volleys of celebratory gunfire erupted in several districts of the Syrian capital.

Residents said convoys of cars were processing around the Mazzeh neighborhood, with people waving flags and shouting: "God, Syria and Bashar!". There were similar celebrations in other government-held cities.

A resident in the government-held part of the northern city of Aleppo said people believed that "Erdogan's fall is an announcement of the end of the crisis in Syria, given he is the one chiefly responsible for the crisis".

Another Aleppo resident said people were chanting for Erdogan to be held to account. A witness in the Jaramana district of Damascus said the celebratory gunfire was greater even than when Assad won re-election as president two years ago.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-turke ... ZV2PJ?il=0

[rowan]

& so it continues. Members of an American-backed rebel group in Syria beheaded a young child in a grisly execution video:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... e=facebook

What a horrible mess the US has made of the Middle East

[Which Tyler]

What a horrible mess the US has made of the Middle East

Whilst undoubtedly true; it would be a bit rich to throw stones we've done more than our bit to help them.
Although I'd have to query just how much sweetness and light, milk and honey there was in the middle east before we stuck our noses in.

[rowan]

America has done nothing but create war in the Middle East. Who are you trying to kid? It's like the British telling us how much they did for the Indians. & nobody invited either of them - that's the bottom line. As for being milk and honey, etc, it was certainly a lot better of in Ottoman times. How about somebody just comes and slaughters a few million people in America and then reminds you about all the problems beforehand...

Latest news out of the region:

At least 85 civilians, including almost a dozen children, have been killed after US air strikes targeted an area in northern Syria held by Islamic State (Isis/Daesh) fighters, a monitoring group has said.

Some eight families were reportedly wiped out in the IS-controlled village of Tokhar near Manbij on Tuesday (19 July), in what could be one of the deadliest bombings of civilians by coalition forces since the start of operations in the country.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/syria-least-85 ... ke-1571600

[Which Tyler]

Is that addressed at me? if so, the I don't think you bothered reading what I wrote.


ETA: OK, on re-reading, I wasn't as clear as I thought I'd been - "we've done more than our bit to help"... the Americans screw up the region.

[morepork]

It's not just America. Many foreign powers have had military jollies in the Middle East that have taken from the locals and set up new orders. A jolly old time was had by all in Iraq when it was carved up all those years ago, and invading Iran during WWII was just fantastic for relieving Allied monotony.

[Lizard]

America has done nothing but create war in the Middle East. Who are you trying to kid? It's like the British telling us how much they did for the Indians. & nobody invited either of them - that's the bottom line. As for being milk and honey, etc, it was certainly a lot better of in Ottoman times. How about somebody just comes and slaughters a few million people in America and then reminds you about all the problems beforehand...

Latest news out of the region:

At least 85 civilians, including almost a dozen children, have been killed after US air strikes targeted an area in northern Syria held by Islamic State (Isis/Daesh) fighters, a monitoring group has said.

Some eight families were reportedly wiped out in the IS-controlled village of Tokhar near Manbij on Tuesday (19 July), in what could be one of the deadliest bombings of civilians by coalition forces since the start of operations in the country.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/syria-least-85 ... ke-1571600

Ah, yes. The benign Ottoman's. Their treatment of the Armenians, Assyrians and Thracian Bulgarians, for example, was exemplary.

[Donny osmond]

America has done nothing but create war in the Middle East. Who are you trying to kid? It's like the British telling us how much they did for the Indians. & nobody invited either of them - that's the bottom line. As for being milk and honey, etc, it was certainly a lot better of in Ottoman times. How about somebody just comes and slaughters a few million people in America and then reminds you about all the problems beforehand...

Latest news out of the region:

At least 85 civilians, including almost a dozen children, have been killed after US air strikes targeted an area in northern Syria held by Islamic State (Isis/Daesh) fighters, a monitoring group has said.

Some eight families were reportedly wiped out in the IS-controlled village of Tokhar near Manbij on Tuesday (19 July), in what could be one of the deadliest bombings of civilians by coalition forces since the start of operations in the country.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/syria-least-85 ... ke-1571600

Ah, yes. The benign Ottoman's. Their treatment of the Armenians, Assyrians and Thracian Bulgarians, for example, was exemplary.

HOW VERY DARE YOU SIR!

You WOMD apologist.

Sent from my XT1052 using Tapatalk

[rowan]

Sure, I actually agree with all the above comments. It's just that I'm more concerned with what's going on in the 21st century, and happen to be living in the Middle East. The War of Terror has claimed several million Muslim lives, and the last thing in the world that anybody wanted or needed was American dropping bombs in Syria. They weren't invited, and they are causing a great deal of carnage. That's the only point I was making. The 85 civilians butchered by their errant bombing yesterday is a tragedy that doesn't seem to find much sympathy here, but when exactly the same number of people were killed by some maniac in Nice everyone's wailing in grief and tearing their hair out over it.

In fact, the death toll has since doubled, and could rise further https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/sc ... l#comments

[rowan]

Of Nice and Manbij: - jeez, was this in addition to the American attack? I guess so, since the report says Manbij itself was hit, whereas the US attack was on Tokhar, a town just out of Manbij. https://www.almasdarnews.com/article/fr ... -pictures/

[Sandydragon]

America has done nothing but create war in the Middle East. Who are you trying to kid? It's like the British telling us how much they did for the Indians. & nobody invited either of them - that's the bottom line. As for being milk and honey, etc, it was certainly a lot better of in Ottoman times. How about somebody just comes and slaughters a few million people in America and then reminds you about all the problems beforehand...

Latest news out of the region:

At least 85 civilians, including almost a dozen children, have been killed after US air strikes targeted an area in northern Syria held by Islamic State (Isis/Daesh) fighters, a monitoring group has said.

Some eight families were reportedly wiped out in the IS-controlled village of Tokhar near Manbij on Tuesday (19 July), in what could be one of the deadliest bombings of civilians by coalition forces since the start of operations in the country.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/syria-least-85 ... ke-1571600

Ah, yes. The benign Ottoman's. Their treatment of the Armenians, Assyrians and Thracian Bulgarians, for example, was exemplary.

Indeed. A small point as well is the involvement of the Syrian government in Lebanon for decades. Bit hard to cry foul when your using the same tactic.

[UGagain]

America has done nothing but create war in the Middle East. Who are you trying to kid? It's like the British telling us how much they did for the Indians. & nobody invited either of them - that's the bottom line. As for being milk and honey, etc, it was certainly a lot better of in Ottoman times. How about somebody just comes and slaughters a few million people in America and then reminds you about all the problems beforehand...

Latest news out of the region:

At least 85 civilians, including almost a dozen children, have been killed after US air strikes targeted an area in northern Syria held by Islamic State (Isis/Daesh) fighters, a monitoring group has said.

Some eight families were reportedly wiped out in the IS-controlled village of Tokhar near Manbij on Tuesday (19 July), in what could be one of the deadliest bombings of civilians by coalition forces since the start of operations in the country.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/syria-least-85 ... ke-1571600

Ah, yes. The benign Ottoman's. Their treatment of the Armenians, Assyrians and Thracian Bulgarians, for example, was exemplary.

Indeed. A small point as well is the involvement of the Syrian government in Lebanon for decades. Bit hard to cry foul when your using the same tactic.

Under US approval. And then they left.

But we won't talk about Israeli assaults on Lebanon will we?

You are such a hyporcrite.

[rowan]

Ah, yes. The benign Ottoman's. Their treatment of the Armenians, Assyrians and Thracian Bulgarians, for example, was exemplary.

Indeed. A small point as well is the involvement of the Syrian government in Lebanon for decades. Bit hard to cry foul when your using the same tactic.

Under US approval. And then they left.

But we won't talk about Israeli assaults on Lebanon will we?

You are such a hyporcrite.

Yes, there is a power struggle between Israel & Syria in Lebanon, with most of the conflicts, and certainly the most horrendous, having been instigated by the former.

Don't mention it was the French & British who deprived Syria of vital ports through the strategically advantageous creation of Lebanon either. They did the same to Iraq with the creation of Kuwait, of course...

[Sandydragon]

Indeed. A small point as well is the involvement of the Syrian government in Lebanon for decades. Bit hard to cry foul when your using the same tactic.

Under US approval. And then they left.

But we won't talk about Israeli assaults on Lebanon will we?

You are such a hyporcrite.

Yes, there is a power struggle between Israel & Syria in Lebanon, with most of the conflicts, and certainly the most horrendous, having been instigated by the former.

Don't mention it was the French & British who deprived Syria of vital ports through the strategically advantageous creation of Lebanon either. They did the same to Iraq with the creation of Kuwait, of course...

No denying that the Anglo Frenc agreement on borders in the ME caused a huge rift of problems, ignoring tribal maps. But then what went before was none too organized either.

[rowan]

Already pointed out it was relatively peaceful in Ottoman types, if we compare it to Europe. Even the Arabs lived alongside Christian and Jewish minorities with few problems. That's not to say there weren't conflicts. But the real problems began with European imperialism and attempts to destabilize the empire long before WWI. It was in this manner that the British instigated the rise of Wahhabism in Arabia, then betrayed their WWI allies the Hashemites and basically handed the peninsula to the Sauds. We are still paying the price for this today.

[Donny osmond]

Already pointed out it was relatively peaceful in Ottoman types, if we compare it to Europe. Even the Arabs lived alongside Christian and Jewish minorities with few problems. That's not to say there weren't conflicts. But the real problems began with European imperialism and attempts to destabilize the empire long before WWI. It was in this manner that the British instigated the rise of Wahhabism in Arabia, then betrayed their WWI allies the Hashemites and basically handed the peninsula to the Sauds. We are still paying the price for this today.

And, as already pointed out, that "relative" peace only lasted a couple of decades and applied to internal rather than external peace.

But OF COURSE it was white Europe's fault that the benevolent and kindly ottoman empire crumbled.

Sent from my XT1052 using Tapatalk

[Sandydragon]

Already pointed out it was relatively peaceful in Ottoman types, if we compare it to Europe. Even the Arabs lived alongside Christian and Jewish minorities with few problems. That's not to say there weren't conflicts. But the real problems began with European imperialism and attempts to destabilize the empire long before WWI. It was in this manner that the British instigated the rise of Wahhabism in Arabia, then betrayed their WWI allies the Hashemites and basically handed the peninsula to the Sauds. We are still paying the price for this today.

And, as already pointed out, that "relative" peace only lasted a couple of decades and applied to internal rather than external peace.

But OF COURSE it was white Europe's fault that the benevolent and kindly ottoman empire crumbled.

Sent from my XT1052 using Tapatalk

And it appears to be OK for Turks to colonize Arab land, but not Europeans?

[UGagain]

Already pointed out it was relatively peaceful in Ottoman types, if we compare it to Europe. Even the Arabs lived alongside Christian and Jewish minorities with few problems. That's not to say there weren't conflicts. But the real problems began with European imperialism and attempts to destabilize the empire long before WWI. It was in this manner that the British instigated the rise of Wahhabism in Arabia, then betrayed their WWI allies the Hashemites and basically handed the peninsula to the Sauds. We are still paying the price for this today.

And, as already pointed out, that "relative" peace only lasted a couple of decades and applied to internal rather than external peace.

But OF COURSE it was white Europe's fault that the benevolent and kindly ottoman empire crumbled.

Sent from my XT1052 using Tapatalk

And it appears to be OK for Turks to colonize Arab land, but not Europeans?

I've got to get a screenshot of that particular piece of r---t stupidity.

You don't even understand when you r-----m is r----m, do you?