Squad for Wales

[stepsider]

Thoughts:

Firstly hats off to Wales for running us so close given the circumstances and Gatland’s idiosyncratic selection policy ( he really needed to bring on a fetcher! )

Imo in Ludlam, Willis and Dombrandt we’ve (finally!) found a balanced back row which looks like it can pick up where the Holy Trinity left off.

Time for Farrell to be used as a finisher rather than a starter. Lawes best reverting to lock cover rather than backrow cover - use Simmonds/Earl for that as a point of difference.

Also think we need more gas then Malins and Slade offer in their respective positions.

Time for Farrell to be finished

[francoisfou]

Farrell gets a 5 in the Guardian's player ratings. The lowest in the squad, but still a tad generous.

EDIT : Planet Rugby gives him a 4.

Planet Rugby’s rating is also generous. Has Borthers got the balls to do what’s clearly necessary? Sadly, I doubt it.

[Beasties]

Wtf is it with this endemic kadabbing? Dire enough up to now but this blew the roof off. Still got 5 mins to watch (yippy) there’s more? Even JVP did it with a glorious 3 on 2. I mean, wtf is the point if we’re not gonna even try to convert simple chances like this? Stanley Beauchamp surely isn’t coaching this nonsense to this degree? Wales did their best to help us out but we just kicked it away.

On the upside, there are areas which are finally starting to look like sanity is returning. Slowly.

There’s a lot on the other side of the seesaw though. Not to mention an anchor.

[Mr Mwenda]

Had to watch it on my phone whilst drinking myself to death in a bar. Always good to get a win in the 'diff but that was a second division match.

[stepsider]

Contrast with Eng U20 attacking approach is huge.

Bring back Brian Ashton.

[Insouciant]

Had to watch it on my phone whilst drinking myself to death in a bar. Always good to get a win in the 'diff but that was a second division match.

Only managed to catch the last 25 minutes or so - on my phone in a bus station trying to get home.

I can only comment on 55 minutes onwards beyond the try replays I've seen. As for those 3 tries - glad we got 3 but:
was there a forward pass in the first?
Are we sure he got the ball down for the second?
Are we sure he got the ball down for the third?
BTW - I'm not saying we didn't, it's just weird that at least the third wasn't checked (can't speak for the others).

A win is a win and a win away from home with 60/70K Welshfolk baying for your blood is probably a bit better. Neither team looked like a world beater but I'll say we're only 3 games into a new regime so I'll cut some slack.

Slade's Kadab of the 3 on 2 on about 70 minutes was particularly poor. Farrell's tee kicking too. Farrell wasn't great and Borthwick did the right thing and subbed him, trusting Smith to manage the game for almost 30 seconds.. amazing (!) Would be nice to see a different 10 and 13 but I don't see that happening sadly. Forwards were alright, maybe went a bit downhill after subs.

[p/d]

Borthwick OUT

We were shite but this is way ott. We’re three games into a full rebuild. At least you could see the skeleton of plan which is a step up on the last two years. What did you want him to achieve in 5 weeks?

Bob on Mells. If we can find a good 8 and replace our 10 by the time we face Ireland then I would deem SB’s start a success

[Danno]

Thoughts:

Firstly hats off to Wales for running us so close given the circumstances and Gatland’s idiosyncratic selection policy ( he really needed to bring on a fetcher! )

Imo in Ludlam, Willis and Dombrandt we’ve (finally!) found a balanced back row which looks like it can pick up where the Holy Trinity left off.

Time for Farrell to be used as a finisher rather than a starter. Lawes best reverting to lock cover rather than backrow cover - use Simmonds/Earl for that as a point of difference.

Also think we need more gas then Malins and Slade offer in their respective positions.

Finishing what? He can't *start* anything much less finish it. Just look at his 44% kicking for the finishing aspect. I'm not sure he'd recognise either end.

If it's because he has to be involved because England Rugby and everyone else decided to anoint him Sir Jonny of Wilkinson's successor in 2011 then fair enough but I'd send him back to Sarries in a heartbeat. It's fucking weird that he looks good getting the armchair ride there, yet when the England pack is marmalising the oppo his vision, skill and ability might as well be used in unblocking my neighbours' toilet

Lawes isn't a lock any more. Simmonds/Earl flatter to deceive at this level at best. The Slades of backrow replacements.

Agree on the backs.

France and Ireland are going to be extremely painful games. And the frustrating thing is that we have a lot of players playing very well but they're utterly stymied by that one in the middle.

Also his suit is hilarious

[Danno]

that was a second division match.

Generous

[Danno]

Borthwick OUT

We were shite but this is way ott. We’re three games into a full rebuild. At least you could see the skeleton of plan which is a step up on the last two years. What did you want him to achieve in 5 weeks?

Bob on Mells. If we can find a good 8 and replace our 10 by the time we face Ireland then I would deem SB’s start a success

Dombrandt was decent today, certainly wasn't the issue and held onto the ball.

[Mikey Brown]

I’m so back and forth on whether Slade is any good at the top level. Today he looked like the player in his first few caps who just made wrong decisions repeatedly, but who knows what instruction role he/they are getting.

Still feel for Marchant that he didn’t get a go outside Lawrence (or anyone who can get over the gainline) and feel he could have supplied some cutting edge today, but seems that ship has sailed maybe.

[FKAS]

Farrell gets a 5 in the Guardian's player ratings. The lowest in the squad, but still a tad generous.

EDIT : Planet Rugby gives him a 4.

Planet Rugby’s rating is also generous. Has Borthers got the balls to do what’s clearly necessary? Sadly, I doubt it.

It probably depends how Ford goes this afternoon.

[p/d]

We were shite but this is way ott. We’re three games into a full rebuild. At least you could see the skeleton of plan which is a step up on the last two years. What did you want him to achieve in 5 weeks?

Bob on Mells. If we can find a good 8 and replace our 10 by the time we face Ireland then I would deem SB’s start a success

Dombrandt was decent today, certainly wasn't the issue and held onto the ball.

Decent, maybe. But ‘our 8’ yesterday should have been ripping up trees against that game plan.

As for Slade, him and Mailns together isn’t right. Got to change one out.

[Oakboy]

Bob on Mells. If we can find a good 8 and replace our 10 by the time we face Ireland then I would deem SB’s start a success

Dombrandt was decent today, certainly wasn't the issue and held onto the ball.

Decent, maybe. But ‘our 8’ yesterday should have been ripping up trees against that game plan.

As for Slade, him and Mailns together isn’t right. Got to change one out.

Agree with that about Slade/Malins. Slade is a good international OC, IMO, BUT, the reason you pick him is because he has such good hands and, with the ball, he is much quicker than many appreciate. If the tactics are not to use that handling attribute there is no point in starting him. Before dumping him, SB should check his contribution with a decent, passing FH and a better winger than Malins.

I wonder if the temporary nature of Evans's involvement is all on his side of the negotiations. Maybe, he is waiting to see if he can stand working with SB's strategy. If the current amount of kicking is maintained, I doubt he will extend his stay.

[Mellsblue]

I wonder if the temporary nature of Evans's involvement is all on his side of the negotiations. Maybe, he is waiting to see if he can stand working with SB's strategy. If the current amount of kicking is maintained, I doubt he will extend his stay.

Stuart Barnes seems to think it’s definitely a temp arrangement with the Wiggler being the permanent appointment I’m hoping he has it wrong.

[Beasties]

Happy with Lawrence’s contributions so far. Starting to look at home in international rugby.

[Scrumhead]

Bob on Mells. If we can find a good 8 and replace our 10 by the time we face Ireland then I would deem SB’s start a success

Dombrandt was decent today, certainly wasn't the issue and held onto the ball.

Decent, maybe. But ‘our 8’ yesterday should have been ripping up trees against that game plan.

On what basis? I just can’t understand how you watch that game and make that statement unless it’s to continue a lazy and unfair narrative against Dombrandt?

[fivepointer]

Lawrence gets a tick. So too Ludlam. Chessum's settling in nicely and Dombrandt is finding his feet. JVP is going OK and Willis has made a big impact.
Not so sure about Malins, Slade needs to find an extra gear, George could do with doing more than accurate throwing at the line out and our 10 is rank.

[p/d]

Stuart Barnes seems to think it’s definitely a temp arrangement with the Wiggler being the permanent appointment I’m hoping he has it wrong.

Can we just assume that Barnes has been attacking the wine rack until it is officially confirmed. An extended honeymoon period if you will

[Mellsblue]

Stuart Barnes seems to think it’s definitely a temp arrangement with the Wiggler being the permanent appointment I’m hoping he has it wrong.

Can we just assume that Barnes has been attacking the wine rack until it is officially confirmed. An extended honeymoon period if you will

More than happy with that. I’ll even delete my post.

[jngf]

I’m so back and forth on whether Slade is any good at the top level. Today he looked like the player in his first few caps who just made wrong decisions repeatedly, but who knows what instruction role he/they are getting.

Still feel for Marchant that he didn’t get a go outside Lawrence (or anyone who can get over the gainline) and feel he could have supplied some cutting edge today, but seems that ship has sailed maybe.

Slade for me is a bit dull in playing style and not quite enough gas for a top level for 13. He’s more exciting as a 12 or 15 though. Think he may be one of those players who shines more at club level than test level and this may be because of this positioning factor.

[jngf]

Dombrandt was decent today, certainly wasn't the issue and held onto the ball.

Decent, maybe. But ‘our 8’ yesterday should have been ripping up trees against that game plan.

On what basis? I just can’t understand how you watch that game and make that statement unless it’s to continue a lazy and unfair narrative against Dombrandt?

Agree with Scrumhead - Imo Dombrandt had an outstanding game including several turners and some sublime linking play leading to one of our tries.

[p/d]

Dombrandt was decent today, certainly wasn't the issue and held onto the ball.

Decent, maybe. But ‘our 8’ yesterday should have been ripping up trees against that game plan.

On what basis? I just can’t understand how you watch that game and make that statement unless it’s to continue a lazy and unfair narrative against Dombrandt?

Oh I forgot. Any slight against Big Dom is assumed to be ‘lazy narrative’. For the record, from the out I said he should be starting the first 3 games whatever. Do I want Billy back, no, do I wish Cannone had an English mum, yes.

I also didn’t say he had a bad game nor should be dropped for French game. That said I do think he should have had more impact yesterday, shouldn’t have been outplayed by his opposite number and will be owned by the French physicality. And I like the player,

[Mikey Brown]

We only work in stark absolutes here I’m afraid.

[FKAS]

Lawrence gets a tick. So too Ludlam. Chessum's settling in nicely and Dombrandt is finding his feet. JVP is going OK and Willis has made a big impact.
Not so sure about Malins, Slade needs to find an extra gear, George could do with doing more than accurate throwing at the line out and our 10 is rank.

Agree with much of that. Starting props are starting to hit their straps. Second row works as does the backrow. JVP and Mitchell works as a combination of 9s just need to introduce Mitchell a little earlier before JVP is totally gassed. Then midfield combination is also good thought Slade did fine if a little dull, his break did help set up a try. The back three again works but lacks some fireworks.

10 remains the big problem position though whether we can find another gear at hooker and wing instead of Malins are questions to answer. T Curry, LCD and Will Stuart all to come back in when match fit as well.

Things are certainly moving in the right direction, the discipline is night and day better than under Eddie which is nice. Defence improving slowly. Attack not so good but had Farrell kicked the points he should have done the points difference would have been more reflective of our dominance.