AWJ & Tipuric retire

[Son of Mathonwy]

It makes sense for AWJ, who with Rowlands and Hill returning was always going to be at risk of being dropped. But Tipuric was one of our best 6N performers so despite the competition at 7 had a really good chance of being in the XV and surely was very likely to be in the squad (unless Gatland has had a complete change of mind in the last couple of months). And he's not far short of his 100th cap too. Just really strange.

Anyway, 170 caps for AWJ. Legend isn't a strong enough word.

[Sandydragon]

There could be something in that, Sandy. Many thought the last world cup would be a swansong for many of our old guard, so this one would surely be the last hurrah. If they dont play in that, then is it worth them flogging themselves for a shot at just maybe one more 6n? They've achieved so much over the past decade or so, and there'll be a point when the body and mind will say enough's enough.

It’s a very long pre RWC camp as well, I heard 4 months mentioned which when you’ve already been there and done it is a long time. And I’d bet many players have just had enough of welsh rugby this season.

[Sandydragon]

It makes sense for AWJ, who with Rowlands and Hill returning was always going to be at risk of being dropped. But Tipuric was one of our best 6N performers so despite the competition at 7 had a really good chance of being in the XV and surely was very likely to be in the squad (unless Gatland has had a complete change of mind in the last couple of months). And he's not far short of his 100th cap too. Just really strange.

Anyway, 170 caps for AWJ. Legend isn't a strong enough word.

I think Tips is struggling for fitness after his foot injury.

[Son of Mathonwy]

It makes sense for AWJ, who with Rowlands and Hill returning was always going to be at risk of being dropped. But Tipuric was one of our best 6N performers so despite the competition at 7 had a really good chance of being in the XV and surely was very likely to be in the squad (unless Gatland has had a complete change of mind in the last couple of months). And he's not far short of his 100th cap too. Just really strange.

Anyway, 170 caps for AWJ. Legend isn't a strong enough word.

I think Tips is struggling for fitness after his foot injury.

Agreed but if he's still recovering then Gatland should give him time. I hope Gatland hasn't played hardball and pushed Tips into this decision.

[Numbers]

It's a shame but I wouldn't have had either in my starting line up at the World Cup anyway, both great servants to Welsh rugby, Tipuric suffered for a long time as Warburton's understudy when he would have walked into most other International teams, AWJ could well be in line for a punditry role, tho he may want to pursue his legal career.

[Ross. S]

Rhys Webb has also gone now https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union ... gn=KARANGA

[Sandydragon]

It does make you wonder who else might quit?

[Ross. S]

I suspect Leigh Halfpenny, Liam Williams and Ken Owens will go at the end of the RWC if not before. Bradley Davies called it a day this week too but he's been slightly less relevant for a while.

[Sourdust]

I'd expect most if not all of ½p, Sanjay, Biggar, Sheriff, Patchell, Anscombe, Toby, North! and G. Davies to be in the November tranche.

[Numbers]

I'd expect most if not all of ½p, Sanjay, Biggar, Sheriff, Patchell, Anscombe, Toby, North! and G. Davies to be in the November tranche.

Patchell is 30, North is 31 so some legs left in those two you'd think, Patchell needs to find a club mind you.

[Ross. S]

I'd expect most if not all of ½p, Sanjay, Biggar, Sheriff, Patchell, Anscombe, Toby, North! and G. Davies to be in the November tranche.

Patchell is 30, North is 31 so some legs left in those two you'd think, Patchell needs to find a club mind you.

Faletau and Anscombe are only 32 so they may have a few left too

[Sandydragon]

North, Faletau and Anscombe are only just in their 30s so by no means past and might want to push for the next Lions tour. Tempting as a whole scale clear out might be, we need some continuity in the team, and Faletau is still one of the worlds best No8s. North and Anscombe are by no means nailed on starters or squad members.

I’d expect Owens, Liam, Halfpenny to definitely retire, I’m not sure about Biggar. He’s still a key player and might fancy another season or two. Whether Wales will give him that is another matter. Or his post RWC future might be as a finisher to allow another fly half, (Costello maybe) to develop?

[Son of Mathonwy]

With all these guys removing themselves from the international scene pre-world cup it means we wasted a lot of time in the 6N when we could have developed other players. Whether that's Gatland's fault or the players' fault, who knows (probably differs from case to case).

[Sourdust]

North, Faletau and Anscombe are only just in their 30s so by no means past and might want to push for the next Lions tour. Tempting as a whole scale clear out might be, we need some continuity in the team, and Faletau is still one of the worlds best No8s. North and Anscombe are by no means nailed on starters or squad members.

I’d expect Owens, Liam, Halfpenny to definitely retire, I’m not sure about Biggar. He’s still a key player and might fancy another season or two. Whether Wales will give him that is another matter. Or his post RWC future might be as a finisher to allow another fly half, (Costello maybe) to develop?

I guess the Lions may be a carrot for a few to stay on. But it does seem to me that players - like most other interested parties - tend to think in terms of RWC cycles, and none of the names I mentioned stand any realistic chance of playing in 2027. I'm not advocating a clear-out, just theorizing as to who may be in the departure lounge before Christmas. I hope I'm wrong in at least some cases, I'm not sure we can afford to lose them all!

[Sandydragon]

With all these guys removing themselves from the international scene pre-world cup it means we wasted a lot of time in the 6N when we could have developed other players. Whether that's Gatland's fault or the players' fault, who knows (probably differs from case to case).

Include Hawkins and that’s four spots that could have been better used. It does feel like communication between players and management hasn’t been great.

[pompey-zebra]

I thought after the last world cup that many of the old guard wouldn't be playing in the 2023 tournament, I just didn't expect them to retire just 3 months before! Similarly who thought a year ago even after the defeat against italy, Gatland would be leading Wales into the world cup?

There's probably a number of reasons why its come to this, but I think it's just another consequence of the drift in the game in Wales in last few years just as the stand off in this year's 6n was. It doesn't seem its going to get much better anytime soon either.

Anyway, happy friday!

[Son of Mathonwy]

With all these guys removing themselves from the international scene pre-world cup it means we wasted a lot of time in the 6N when we could have developed other players. Whether that's Gatland's fault or the players' fault, who knows (probably differs from case to case).

Include Hawkins and that’s four spots that could have been better used. It does feel like communication between players and management hasn’t been great.

Yeah, agreed definitely Hawkins is one. Tips is the most mind-boggling, AWJ the most understandable but all a waste of valuable game time.

[Son of Mathonwy]

North, Faletau and Anscombe are only just in their 30s so by no means past and might want to push for the next Lions tour. Tempting as a whole scale clear out might be, we need some continuity in the team, and Faletau is still one of the worlds best No8s. North and Anscombe are by no means nailed on starters or squad members.

I’d expect Owens, Liam, Halfpenny to definitely retire, I’m not sure about Biggar. He’s still a key player and might fancy another season or two. Whether Wales will give him that is another matter. Or his post RWC future might be as a finisher to allow another fly half, (Costello maybe) to develop?

I guess the Lions may be a carrot for a few to stay on. But it does seem to me that players - like most other interested parties - tend to think in terms of RWC cycles, and none of the names I mentioned stand any realistic chance of playing in 2027. I'm not advocating a clear-out, just theorizing as to who may be in the departure lounge before Christmas. I hope I'm wrong in at least some cases, I'm not sure we can afford to lose them all!

Hopefully North, Faletau and Anscombe will stick around. Faletau has a reasonable chance of making the next WC IMO. Grady may cut North's time short. For Anscombe you never know when an injury will hit. I'm no fan of Biggar so would not mind him hanging up his Wales boots and giving someone else a chance at last. And will Gatland stick around post WC? I guess we'll need to get out of our group for that.

[Eugene Wrayburn]

I was listening to an Irish rugby podcast - OTB daily I think- who were saying that someone had been booted for missing the physical benchmarks set at the 6N. Might that be the case for AWJ and Tips? I find it hard to think that having picked them at the 6N he didn't tell them then that they weren't needed

[Banquo]

I was listening to an Irish rugby podcast - OTB daily I think- who were saying that someone had been booted for missing the physical benchmarks set at the 6N. Might that be the case for AWJ and Tips? I find it hard to think that having picked them at the 6N he didn't tell them then that they weren't needed

Carre has just been booted out of the RWC for the same.

[Sandydragon]

I was listening to an Irish rugby podcast - OTB daily I think- who were saying that someone had been booted for missing the physical benchmarks set at the 6N. Might that be the case for AWJ and Tips? I find it hard to think that having picked them at the 6N he didn't tell them then that they weren't needed

Rhys Carre was booted for not being fit enough.

For AWJ, there is increased competition now for the lock position with a couple of test level locks now available who weren’t in the six nations. Add in Beard and suddenly it’s getting a bit tight for AWJ to be a certainty.

Tips would, fitness permitting, still be in nearly everyone’s wider squad. But he has been injured and may have just decided that his body can’t take it any more.

[Son of Mathonwy]

I was listening to an Irish rugby podcast - OTB daily I think- who were saying that someone had been booted for missing the physical benchmarks set at the 6N. Might that be the case for AWJ and Tips? I find it hard to think that having picked them at the 6N he didn't tell them then that they weren't needed

Rhys Carre was booted for not being fit enough.

For AWJ, there is increased competition now for the lock position with a couple of test level locks now available who weren’t in the six nations. Add in Beard and suddenly it’s getting a bit tight for AWJ to be a certainty.

Tips would, fitness permitting, still be in nearly everyone’s wider squad. But he has been injured and may have just decided that his body can’t take it any more.

Just before a world cup? I can't believe it.

[Sandydragon]

Do we know if he was going to be fit enough to participate? I understand he had picked up another foot injury.

[newgalesurf]

At this rate, the question should be Are Wales going to have enough to participate

[ALunpg]

At this rate, the question should be Are Wales going to have enough to participate

There with be enough players to participate, whether they will be up to scratch is another question. Tipuric is the only one that is probably injury related, Webb and Hill are probably new contract related and AWJ is a man saying enough,
The only thing i can see that is the potential for further players withdrawals is the contract issue.
I am hoping that a discussion will have taken place behind closed doors to address this with those involved, However with the fallout for our regions after the WRU budget outcome , who knows.