England vs France - minute-by-minute - COMPLETED
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Minute 56: France opt for goal and Ramos slots the 3 points. 7-13 to the bad guys.
Minute 57: FSmith puts up a contestible kick again, but this time gets just a touch more height on it and clears the lifting pod. Freeman does a belting job of catching the ball, despite being unsighted by the failed lifting pod, and offloads out of contact to Mitchell bursting through. He makes it into the 22, we clear out quickly, and Freeman is there to play the ball away.
Baxter makes a metre with a strong carry and Freeman is once again 9 to play the ball out to MSmith at first receiver. He sends TCurry on the charge who does a good job and now we have Mitchell back in position. A different Smith sends a difference Curry in on a hard line - this one doesn't work as well due to less space and a lesser Curry, but it's still quickish ball, which Mitchell has a dart from. The space closes up and we're left with MSmith playing in at 9.
Minute 58: We're looking very earnest and carrying with intent, but we haven't really stretched the French defence and aren't making metres anymore, so FSmith drops back into the pocket and Mitchell sends it back to him. France don't seem that worried about the drop-goal, so it doesn't draw in any defenders, but it does give him room to spot that Bielle-Biarrey is isolated down a very big blindside and is having to stay very flat because he's worried about Lawrence and Freeman. He puts up a pin-point kick over LBB's shoulder - the winger gets back and underneath it, but unfortunately for him Freeman has two things that he doesn't - momentum and 6" of height. Freeman takes a running leap so he can jump through LBB, takes the ball Aussie rules style with hands above his head, and lands beyond the Frenchman. To make it even better, as soon as he hits the ground, Freeman puts in glorious sidestep. Dupont, who of course has read the play and of course is charging across to save the day, is left utterly helpless to do anything but flail desperately as he sails past and Freeman can escape two more last ditch French tackles to ground the ball. Great finish.
Minute 59: The conversion will give us the lead and it's a simple bread-and-butter job for MSmith who hasn't missed a kick from the tee in about 4 months... oh, he's fucked it. And badly too - it's a poor contact that's clubbed across the face of the posts. Takes a bit of wind out of our sails - turning the game around to lead by 1 point has a very different feeling to closing the gap to 1 point.
Points left on the table: England 7 : 3 France
Joe Heyes is on for Will Stuart, who has had another good game - very strong in the scrums and his workrate around the pitch has been immense. Haven't mentioned his name very much, except for the pass that should not've been where I did mention it a few times, but he's been glue today, doing all the little tackles and ruck clearings that are needed for others to shine.
His first involvement is to be a bit lucky not to get called for shepherding the catcher off the kickoff - Penaud charges into his back to take them both to ground and splays his arms out in appeal to the touch judge before he even hits the floor. Would've been a bit of a harsh call to ping Heyes, but I have seen those given, especially when somebody gives the full histrionics like Penaud did.
The ref isn't interested and Earl carries the ball up past the 22. We run one more phase through Baxter, who gets us another couple of metres with a good carry, and then set up a caterpillar and box. It's a great kick and Sleightholme goes flying through the air with very little concern for his own safety, but can't quite get enough of a hand on the ball to get it back to our side. It bounces loose, France regather slow ball just inside our half, and Amashukeli has his hand out for knock-on advantage.
Minute 60: France send Alldritt up on a carry down the middle and, once again, there is Baxter with a textbook low tackle taking his ankles. They're not dominant hits to knock him back, but they're an effective nullifaction tactic - don't let him stand up in the tackle to offload or, worse, bump you off and keep running, just take both ankles away and see how fast he hits the floor.
Dupont picks and snipes towards the right and his reputation comes before him - our defence screams, "Dupont! Dupont!" and both Itoje and Heyes plant their feet at guard and second-guard - they're not charging up and risking a mistake, but instead offering an impermeable wall that Dupont can't go through. Unfortunately Dupont is, like Idris Elba, aware of the effect that he has on women defenders and has no intention of running once he's heard his name yelled - he holds onto the ball just long enough to attract attention and then pulls back deep to Jalibert. BCurry struggles to track across and Sleightholme doesn't trust him to, so Jalibert ends up arcing around both of them to set up a 2-on-1 with Penaud versus Mitchell on the wing. Sleightholme makes it across to tackle the 10, but Mitchell has had to back off and now Penaud can take the offload going forwards. He steps inside, leaving Mitchell with no chance - BCurry has done excellently to make it across to cover, but unfortunately France have numbers and Penaud can make an inside pass to LBB. There is a gap there, but Heyes has done heroic work to get across and close it, but his momentum to get there means he's entirely committed to Bielle-Biarrey and there is nothing he can do when there's another inside pass.
Jegou goes through the gap and attempts to ride roughshod over FSmith, only to get mildly surprised by the 10 putting his shoulder in and stopping him fairly solidly and conclusively. For a moment, it looks as though the fire has been put out - Earl goes for the ball and is unlucky not to get it, but is cleared out. He tries to ignore Amashukeli long enough to slow things down while releasing in time to avoid a penalty, but gets the worst of all possible worlds - pen advantage and Dupont still has the ball. With hindsight, maybe would've been better just to kill it properly, but I can't blame him - he'd've got away with it with a worse referee.
France go wide early and our defence still isn't perfectly aligned - they make ground through some nice slick handling and offloads out of contact and get into the 22 and then up to the edge of the 5m line. However, LCD slows the ball and our defence can now start coming forwards - the next two phases are French forwards running into double tackles and being stopped behind the gainline.
Minute 57: FSmith puts up a contestible kick again, but this time gets just a touch more height on it and clears the lifting pod. Freeman does a belting job of catching the ball, despite being unsighted by the failed lifting pod, and offloads out of contact to Mitchell bursting through. He makes it into the 22, we clear out quickly, and Freeman is there to play the ball away.
Baxter makes a metre with a strong carry and Freeman is once again 9 to play the ball out to MSmith at first receiver. He sends TCurry on the charge who does a good job and now we have Mitchell back in position. A different Smith sends a difference Curry in on a hard line - this one doesn't work as well due to less space and a lesser Curry, but it's still quickish ball, which Mitchell has a dart from. The space closes up and we're left with MSmith playing in at 9.
Minute 58: We're looking very earnest and carrying with intent, but we haven't really stretched the French defence and aren't making metres anymore, so FSmith drops back into the pocket and Mitchell sends it back to him. France don't seem that worried about the drop-goal, so it doesn't draw in any defenders, but it does give him room to spot that Bielle-Biarrey is isolated down a very big blindside and is having to stay very flat because he's worried about Lawrence and Freeman. He puts up a pin-point kick over LBB's shoulder - the winger gets back and underneath it, but unfortunately for him Freeman has two things that he doesn't - momentum and 6" of height. Freeman takes a running leap so he can jump through LBB, takes the ball Aussie rules style with hands above his head, and lands beyond the Frenchman. To make it even better, as soon as he hits the ground, Freeman puts in glorious sidestep. Dupont, who of course has read the play and of course is charging across to save the day, is left utterly helpless to do anything but flail desperately as he sails past and Freeman can escape two more last ditch French tackles to ground the ball. Great finish.
Minute 59: The conversion will give us the lead and it's a simple bread-and-butter job for MSmith who hasn't missed a kick from the tee in about 4 months... oh, he's fucked it. And badly too - it's a poor contact that's clubbed across the face of the posts. Takes a bit of wind out of our sails - turning the game around to lead by 1 point has a very different feeling to closing the gap to 1 point.
Points left on the table: England 7 : 3 France
Joe Heyes is on for Will Stuart, who has had another good game - very strong in the scrums and his workrate around the pitch has been immense. Haven't mentioned his name very much, except for the pass that should not've been where I did mention it a few times, but he's been glue today, doing all the little tackles and ruck clearings that are needed for others to shine.
His first involvement is to be a bit lucky not to get called for shepherding the catcher off the kickoff - Penaud charges into his back to take them both to ground and splays his arms out in appeal to the touch judge before he even hits the floor. Would've been a bit of a harsh call to ping Heyes, but I have seen those given, especially when somebody gives the full histrionics like Penaud did.
The ref isn't interested and Earl carries the ball up past the 22. We run one more phase through Baxter, who gets us another couple of metres with a good carry, and then set up a caterpillar and box. It's a great kick and Sleightholme goes flying through the air with very little concern for his own safety, but can't quite get enough of a hand on the ball to get it back to our side. It bounces loose, France regather slow ball just inside our half, and Amashukeli has his hand out for knock-on advantage.
Minute 60: France send Alldritt up on a carry down the middle and, once again, there is Baxter with a textbook low tackle taking his ankles. They're not dominant hits to knock him back, but they're an effective nullifaction tactic - don't let him stand up in the tackle to offload or, worse, bump you off and keep running, just take both ankles away and see how fast he hits the floor.
Dupont picks and snipes towards the right and his reputation comes before him - our defence screams, "Dupont! Dupont!" and both Itoje and Heyes plant their feet at guard and second-guard - they're not charging up and risking a mistake, but instead offering an impermeable wall that Dupont can't go through. Unfortunately Dupont is, like Idris Elba, aware of the effect that he has on women defenders and has no intention of running once he's heard his name yelled - he holds onto the ball just long enough to attract attention and then pulls back deep to Jalibert. BCurry struggles to track across and Sleightholme doesn't trust him to, so Jalibert ends up arcing around both of them to set up a 2-on-1 with Penaud versus Mitchell on the wing. Sleightholme makes it across to tackle the 10, but Mitchell has had to back off and now Penaud can take the offload going forwards. He steps inside, leaving Mitchell with no chance - BCurry has done excellently to make it across to cover, but unfortunately France have numbers and Penaud can make an inside pass to LBB. There is a gap there, but Heyes has done heroic work to get across and close it, but his momentum to get there means he's entirely committed to Bielle-Biarrey and there is nothing he can do when there's another inside pass.
Jegou goes through the gap and attempts to ride roughshod over FSmith, only to get mildly surprised by the 10 putting his shoulder in and stopping him fairly solidly and conclusively. For a moment, it looks as though the fire has been put out - Earl goes for the ball and is unlucky not to get it, but is cleared out. He tries to ignore Amashukeli long enough to slow things down while releasing in time to avoid a penalty, but gets the worst of all possible worlds - pen advantage and Dupont still has the ball. With hindsight, maybe would've been better just to kill it properly, but I can't blame him - he'd've got away with it with a worse referee.
France go wide early and our defence still isn't perfectly aligned - they make ground through some nice slick handling and offloads out of contact and get into the 22 and then up to the edge of the 5m line. However, LCD slows the ball and our defence can now start coming forwards - the next two phases are French forwards running into double tackles and being stopped behind the gainline.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Minute 61: The same applied for the first phase of this minute until that man Dupont wields his reputation as a club again. Itoje is at guard and BCurry folds around the ruck to join him. In normal circumstances, BCurry then moves into guard and Itoje pushes out one, but Maro has his eyes locked on Dupont. The 9 picks and looks like he's throwing a massive dummy and Itoje is not buying it at all, remaining obdurately on him no matter what, only for the dummy to finish with a little pop pass to Meafou coming around the corner. Itoje reacts and brings the lock down, but it's gained France a metre of go-forward again. Worse, Itoje's focus on Dupont means that both Lawrence and Slade have felt they have to step in to stop a rampaging Meafou, meaning the defensive line have all stepped in two places and are now backtracking. It's quick ball once again and Dupont throws a gorgeous miss-pass - the obvious play is using the pod of forwards to pull back to Moefana behind, but Dupont instead throws a flat 15m pass, right across their face, to find Bielle-Biarrey. Mitchell has started blitzing, with the idea that he's going to tackle Moefana man-and-ball, so he has to change direction and chase across, which is just too much space to leave LBB in. The French have effectively a 2-on-1 with LBB and Penaud vs Sleightholme in 15 metres of width and it's only going to finish one way.
Bielle-Biarrey runs at Sleightholme's inside shoulder and, while Mitchell does do an incredible job to get across and make the tackle, Sleightholme has had to stay with the ball-carrier long enough that he stands no chance of getting across to Penaud when the pass is made. Try in the corner.
Minute 62: The conversion is just about as far away from the posts as it's possible to get, but Ramos does come very close - his conversion skims the outside of the posts to leave the scores 12-18.
We call for the cavalry off the bench - George on for LCD and Chessum on for Martin.
FSmith goes back to sending the kick-off long, which is odd after the success we've had with the last two, but presumably there is some method to the madness. Alldritt carries over the 22 and France form a caterpillar for Dupont to box-kick away. MSmith is there to gather it and flings it inside for Earl to carry up. He looks a touch indecisive, changing direction a couple of times, but then straightens and we make some ground with George clearing out well.
Minute 63: We have numbers out wide and spread it down the line, but France blitz and Slade goes for a chip-kick over the top - I was furious on first watch and still a bit narked here, but you can't argue with results - the ball bounces just in the field of play and sits up, leaving Ramos with no option but to leather it out of play before Sleightholme gets a boot to it.
Our lineout, just inside the French half and we get clean, uncontested ball that is thrown to the top of Chessum's hands. There's a cheer from the crowd; I'm unsure how much of it is ironic and how much is actual genuine relief.
We go straight off the top and into a training ground move - FSmith to Earl running a hard line, who looks like his trickiness is going to be a tip-on to Baxter on his shoulder, but is actually a disguised pull-back to Slade. Slade feeds MSmith running in the 13 channel - he's got Lawrence running hard on his shoulder and attracting a lot of French eyes, but MSmith does a little stutter step to look like he's going himself, then pops to Lawrence who has trodden water to stay behind and time his move. LBB has been enthralled by the idea of Crash Ball Full Tilt Lawrence coming down his channel and isn't prepared for a Lawrence who does a sidestep and goes for an outside break. He adapts though and does superbly to pull him down before he goes too far.
Quick England ball though and Mitchell goes back the other way - BCurry pulls it back to FSmith, who runs hard and attracts enough of the French defence that he can offload to George running at speed through the gap, which is not something we've seen for a good few years. George shows he hasn't lost it, drawing the full-back (who is of course Antoine Godsdamned Dupont; how many of him are there on this pitch?!) and offloads to TCurry on his shoulder. Sadly the French defence gets back to haul Curry back on the edge of the 5m line, but Heyes has been following play and clears the ball for Mitchell to move it immediately.
Sadly, Mitchell gets his hands wrong at the base and it slows him for a half second. MSmith is running at Jalibert at pace, but the delay means it's overrun - what Marcus should've done is keep running and what Mitchell should've done is ignored him entirely and passed behind him, but unfortunately they both try and make this work. MSmith attempts to stop his run and Mitchell attempts to make the pass, but it's not on and ends up with MSmith having to reach backwards for the pass and instead blootering it forwards.
One could definitely argue that that's another one for the counter, as MSmith running that line about with about half second delay almost certainly bursts through Jalibert to score, or a Mitchell pass to Slade would almost certainly see Sleightholme in at the corner. However, I have been harsh with some of the French ones, so I'll go harsh here - it's a probable try, but not a definite one.
Minute 64: French scrum under their own posts. Baxter decides that playing defence didn't work last time, so this time he's attacking. Atonio bores again, so Baxter gets under his ribcage and drives up and through him... actually, I've got a visual aid:
. . . . .
Some action from my game last Saturday. To be clear, we are not the team in the red and white.
Atonio doesn't achieve quite the same "Wendy, I can fly!" levels as the poor young sod that my loosehead and I punished for hubris at the previous scrum, mostly because it would require an industrial forklift to lift Atonio like that, but he does learn a valuable lesson about exposing his ribs to Baxter. France get the ball away quickly though and kick long. MSmith takes it on the first bounce and has time to consider his options - Twickenham wants him to run, but the French kick chase is good and so he puts a !SPIRAL BOMB! up in the air for Freeman to chase.
Minute 65: It's a horrible kick to be underneath and Ramos has to chase it for about 20 metres across the edge of the 22 to get underneath the swirling, but he does a very good job to get it right and call the mark. A picky person would say that a better kick would've landed just outside the 22 to allow Freeman to smash him, but it was a hell of a nasty kick to put up and I can't complain about it drifting over the 22 if that means the receiver doesn't really know where it's dropping either. Good skill by MSmith.
Ramos takes his time with getting his team behind him for the mark, but then fails to find touch with his kick. FSmith takes this one and attempts to put up his own !SPIRAL BOMB!, but his needs a touch more work as it inspires nowhere near the same levels of panic. Ramos takes and steps Earl on the blitz part of the kick-chase, but that buys time for the rest of the kick-chase to come up. BCurry tackles, Itoje is over and jackalling - Ben Kay in commentary is certain there are French shenanigans to stop the turnover, but I cannot see them from this angle.
Dupont attempts to catch England unaware with a snap box-kick, but it's not great quality and just lands straight in MSmith's hands. He has space to run and this time he does, giving a little hitch kick, just for the fans, before picking his line and accelerating through the gap between Alldritt and Moefana - the former reacts and brings him down, but England are now well inside the French half and with quick ball again. We spread it into midfield and Chessum runs hard at the French defence, bumping the first tackler before swivelling and stealing an extra couple of metres.
Quick ball again and Mitchell goes the same way. FSmith is attacking the blind, with the ball in two hands...
Bielle-Biarrey runs at Sleightholme's inside shoulder and, while Mitchell does do an incredible job to get across and make the tackle, Sleightholme has had to stay with the ball-carrier long enough that he stands no chance of getting across to Penaud when the pass is made. Try in the corner.
Minute 62: The conversion is just about as far away from the posts as it's possible to get, but Ramos does come very close - his conversion skims the outside of the posts to leave the scores 12-18.
We call for the cavalry off the bench - George on for LCD and Chessum on for Martin.
FSmith goes back to sending the kick-off long, which is odd after the success we've had with the last two, but presumably there is some method to the madness. Alldritt carries over the 22 and France form a caterpillar for Dupont to box-kick away. MSmith is there to gather it and flings it inside for Earl to carry up. He looks a touch indecisive, changing direction a couple of times, but then straightens and we make some ground with George clearing out well.
Minute 63: We have numbers out wide and spread it down the line, but France blitz and Slade goes for a chip-kick over the top - I was furious on first watch and still a bit narked here, but you can't argue with results - the ball bounces just in the field of play and sits up, leaving Ramos with no option but to leather it out of play before Sleightholme gets a boot to it.
Our lineout, just inside the French half and we get clean, uncontested ball that is thrown to the top of Chessum's hands. There's a cheer from the crowd; I'm unsure how much of it is ironic and how much is actual genuine relief.
We go straight off the top and into a training ground move - FSmith to Earl running a hard line, who looks like his trickiness is going to be a tip-on to Baxter on his shoulder, but is actually a disguised pull-back to Slade. Slade feeds MSmith running in the 13 channel - he's got Lawrence running hard on his shoulder and attracting a lot of French eyes, but MSmith does a little stutter step to look like he's going himself, then pops to Lawrence who has trodden water to stay behind and time his move. LBB has been enthralled by the idea of Crash Ball Full Tilt Lawrence coming down his channel and isn't prepared for a Lawrence who does a sidestep and goes for an outside break. He adapts though and does superbly to pull him down before he goes too far.
Quick England ball though and Mitchell goes back the other way - BCurry pulls it back to FSmith, who runs hard and attracts enough of the French defence that he can offload to George running at speed through the gap, which is not something we've seen for a good few years. George shows he hasn't lost it, drawing the full-back (who is of course Antoine Godsdamned Dupont; how many of him are there on this pitch?!) and offloads to TCurry on his shoulder. Sadly the French defence gets back to haul Curry back on the edge of the 5m line, but Heyes has been following play and clears the ball for Mitchell to move it immediately.
Sadly, Mitchell gets his hands wrong at the base and it slows him for a half second. MSmith is running at Jalibert at pace, but the delay means it's overrun - what Marcus should've done is keep running and what Mitchell should've done is ignored him entirely and passed behind him, but unfortunately they both try and make this work. MSmith attempts to stop his run and Mitchell attempts to make the pass, but it's not on and ends up with MSmith having to reach backwards for the pass and instead blootering it forwards.
One could definitely argue that that's another one for the counter, as MSmith running that line about with about half second delay almost certainly bursts through Jalibert to score, or a Mitchell pass to Slade would almost certainly see Sleightholme in at the corner. However, I have been harsh with some of the French ones, so I'll go harsh here - it's a probable try, but not a definite one.
Minute 64: French scrum under their own posts. Baxter decides that playing defence didn't work last time, so this time he's attacking. Atonio bores again, so Baxter gets under his ribcage and drives up and through him... actually, I've got a visual aid:


Some action from my game last Saturday. To be clear, we are not the team in the red and white.
Atonio doesn't achieve quite the same "Wendy, I can fly!" levels as the poor young sod that my loosehead and I punished for hubris at the previous scrum, mostly because it would require an industrial forklift to lift Atonio like that, but he does learn a valuable lesson about exposing his ribs to Baxter. France get the ball away quickly though and kick long. MSmith takes it on the first bounce and has time to consider his options - Twickenham wants him to run, but the French kick chase is good and so he puts a !SPIRAL BOMB! up in the air for Freeman to chase.
Minute 65: It's a horrible kick to be underneath and Ramos has to chase it for about 20 metres across the edge of the 22 to get underneath the swirling, but he does a very good job to get it right and call the mark. A picky person would say that a better kick would've landed just outside the 22 to allow Freeman to smash him, but it was a hell of a nasty kick to put up and I can't complain about it drifting over the 22 if that means the receiver doesn't really know where it's dropping either. Good skill by MSmith.
Ramos takes his time with getting his team behind him for the mark, but then fails to find touch with his kick. FSmith takes this one and attempts to put up his own !SPIRAL BOMB!, but his needs a touch more work as it inspires nowhere near the same levels of panic. Ramos takes and steps Earl on the blitz part of the kick-chase, but that buys time for the rest of the kick-chase to come up. BCurry tackles, Itoje is over and jackalling - Ben Kay in commentary is certain there are French shenanigans to stop the turnover, but I cannot see them from this angle.
Dupont attempts to catch England unaware with a snap box-kick, but it's not great quality and just lands straight in MSmith's hands. He has space to run and this time he does, giving a little hitch kick, just for the fans, before picking his line and accelerating through the gap between Alldritt and Moefana - the former reacts and brings him down, but England are now well inside the French half and with quick ball again. We spread it into midfield and Chessum runs hard at the French defence, bumping the first tackler before swivelling and stealing an extra couple of metres.
Quick ball again and Mitchell goes the same way. FSmith is attacking the blind, with the ball in two hands...
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Last 15 minutes is a tomorrow job, I suspect. See you all then.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Good stuff as always. Enjoying the explanations of the scrum stuff. It felt like Baxter was having a great impact even before his try.
How easy do you think these calls can be for a touch judge that might be 20 metres away? I don’t recall who was where for that first pen, but I feel like I need to see a scrum about 5 times before I have any sense of what went on.
Genge seems to be at an odd point in his career. He seems a vital member of the squad and always contributes in the loose, but never seems to be quite as dominant in the carry or the scrum as we’d hoped.
These moments of thinking he is either Jonah Lomu or Jason Robinson seem to be quite frequent too, but don’t often come to much. Not that I want to knock him too much for being ambitious and throwing everything he’s got at it.
As an aside, have you used voice to text for these? Just occurred to me that might be a less labour intensive way of doing it, but equally might just be a pain in the arse/impractical.
How easy do you think these calls can be for a touch judge that might be 20 metres away? I don’t recall who was where for that first pen, but I feel like I need to see a scrum about 5 times before I have any sense of what went on.
Genge seems to be at an odd point in his career. He seems a vital member of the squad and always contributes in the loose, but never seems to be quite as dominant in the carry or the scrum as we’d hoped.
These moments of thinking he is either Jonah Lomu or Jason Robinson seem to be quite frequent too, but don’t often come to much. Not that I want to knock him too much for being ambitious and throwing everything he’s got at it.
As an aside, have you used voice to text for these? Just occurred to me that might be a less labour intensive way of doing it, but equally might just be a pain in the arse/impractical.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Reminds me of that time my team thought it would be a good idea to put a SH in at hooker, because it was that or cancel the match (I don't remember uncontested scrums being offered as an option - mid 90s)
The opposition agreed that they'd only try in the scrum if it really mattered - they lied.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Yeah, I should preface all of my whinging with the caveat that I would be a **terrible** referee myself and am very aware of how hard a job it is. Sometimes I go through replays a dozen times to work out what's happened and even then I probably get it wrong! Hopefully my complaining strikes the balance in bemoaning our bad luck in not getting a decision, without accusing the official of dereliction of duty simply because they've made a mistake. No ref, no game, etc.Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2025 9:32 amHow easy do you think these calls can be for a touch judge that might be 20 metres away? I don’t recall who was where for that first pen, but I feel like I need to see a scrum about 5 times before I have any sense of what went on.
Mind, that was a poor decision and he was less than 10m away from it!

Genge is intensely frustrating, because he'd probably be closer to the player he thinks he is, if he didn't already think he was that player. He brings so much that's good and he does have a lot of skills that looseheads don't have, and if he just had slightly less belief in himself, he'd be great. It's not just ball in hand either - the match-winning penalty in the 2023 semi-final came because he couldn't resist attacking South Africa to try and win the penalty, rather than just holding firm and defending.Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2025 9:32 amGenge seems to be at an odd point in his career. He seems a vital member of the squad and always contributes in the loose, but never seems to be quite as dominant in the carry or the scrum as we’d hoped.
These moments of thinking he is either Jonah Lomu or Jason Robinson seem to be quite frequent too, but don’t often come to much. Not that I want to knock him too much for being ambitious and throwing everything he’s got at it.
As an aside, have you used voice to text for these? Just occurred to me that might be a less labour intensive way of doing it, but equally might just be a pain in the arse/impractical.
Good idea on the voice to text, but it doesn't work as well for me. I think through typing, so I wouldn't be able to get my words in order. I'm going at an okay speed atm anyway - am on target to get this one done today, even with having had a very busy last couple of weekends, so it could be worse. I'm not as busy this coming weekend, so I should hopefully be able to do a decent chunk of the Scotland match on Sunday, rather than having to fit it in during the week.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Thanks as ever for the splendid m-b-ms, it's really enjoyable to get that sort of feedback on the game. I'd never watch it again in that detail, and if I did, I suspect I'd miss an awful lot of what you pick up!
Couldn't agree more about Baxter. He had Atonio on toast and should have been given the first penalty to go with the two (?) he was given. He had a really good game.
Couldn't agree more about Baxter. He had Atonio on toast and should have been given the first penalty to go with the two (?) he was given. He had a really good game.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Minute 66: FSmith picks out Earl, who steps inside a tackle and makes a few more metres, taking us within sight of the 22. We run a couple more phases off 10, neither going forwards nor backwards, but then FSmith sends Sleightholme through a half-gap with a lovely bit of play - he dummies and then focusses his eyes on the gap he is aiming at, meaning the French move to cover where he is going, only for him to pop a no-look pass for OllieS to barrel onto. The tackle is good, but England move forwards again. George does a belting job to clear out and we go back the other way again.
Itoje does a nice pull-back to put Lawrence into space - he's got Baxter off his shoulder running a good line, Chessum's got room out wide, or Lawrence can continue to run himself, but instead he remembers that someone somewhere once told him that a good centre should have a kicking game and decides to try that option. It's not a good kick by any stretch of the imagination - it's half-blocked and it'd be no better than a 50/50 even if it did go where he wanted it to - and it gets worse because the bounce of a rugby ball looks like it might be on his side, threatening to sit up for him to regather and run through, only to kick on with the next bounce and go straight to Ramos. The bounce of a rugby ball always hates you, but on this occasion it's actively taunting him as well.
Ramos steps Lawrence and attempts to start a counter, but Freeman reads the next pass and makes a strong tackle, knocking the ball free. Lawrence seizes on the loose ball and we have possession - even better, we have an advantage because the outside defence is ahead of the lost ball. We attempt to make something of it, but we're disorganised and frenetic - France have a defensive line set, but we are offloading and flipping passes on like we've just made a turnover and are trying to find the space in a broken defence. We need to set a ruck, get ourselves organised and see if we've got one of those training ground moves to hand (or another high ball on LBB?), but instead Slade decides to put in a kick behind - it's not a terrible kick, but Bielle-Biarrey always has it covered and it would've required a freak bounce for anyone else to be grounding that. Back for the penalty.
Minute 67: The mark is about 17 metres from touch and 12 metres out. Not even Henry Slade could fail to secure a 5m lineout from here, but Itoje has a conflab with his lieutenants before pointing to the posts. Understandable - if France disrupted our lineout it would sap the momentum from us and reducing the deficit to 3 points is not to be sniffed at. It should be a gimme for a kicker like MSmith, especially since it'd be in an almost identical position to the conversion he missed, so he's had a sighter and can't possibly miss this time.
Minute 68: It's a simple bread-and-butter job for MSmith who hasn't missed a kick from the tee in about 4 months... oh, he's fucked it. And badly too - it's a poor contact that's clubbed across the face of the posts.
If that bit of writing seems familiar, it's because I copied and pasted from minute 59 - if Marcus is going to deliver an identical kick, I don't see why I should be writing anything different! The ball comes off his boot with an unappealing "clmp" and it's like watching a video replay of the conversion.
Points left on the table: England 10 : 3 France
France kick the 22 long and Mitchell takes it inside our half. He feeds Earl who goes on a bit of a dance - looks like he's got Ellis Genge syndrome, as he'd surely have been better just running hard instead of trying to be clever. Still, we're up over halfway and FSmith celebrates by running hard at the defence and popping a neat grubber through when they commit to him. It's not perfect - a bit more weight on it could've seen Sleightholme through, but it is good enough that Ramos is under pressure and he spills the ball as he tries to slide and collect. Sleightholme gathers and goes for a very optimistic grubber and chase, considering he's being tackled as he kicks, and we're coming back for the scrum.
Minute 69: The new French tighthead has not talked to the old French tighthead when he came on - Colombe attempts to bore in on George, only for Baxter to fold him in half, put him in an envelope, and deliver him to his own backrow. Absolutely destroyed.
Mitchell has a really good think about tapping and going, but the thought occurs to him that he would probably prefer not to be murdered by his tight five and so he hands the ball over to FSmith to put into the corner.
Minute 70: FSmith does the business and it's a 5m lineout. We call to Chessum near the back. France have read it and get a jumper there, but the sheer quality of the drill from England - throw, lift, jump, take - means that they're nowhere near disrupting it.
We look like we're forming a useful maul, but it's a ruse from the training ground - Earl takes the ball from Chessum, Heyes binds onto him and drives him sideways, looking like we're changing the point of attack of the rolling maul, only for Earl to flip a pass out to an onrushing TCurry as he spins round. It's a bit of a shame that we're being clever, as France have messed up their maul defence and, if we were actually mauling and committed to it, I think we'd be walking over. As it is, TCurry's charge is halted on the 5m line, but our clearing players are in position and the ball is back quickly. Mitchell's eyes light up with the idea of glory and lunges for the line - he nearly makes it, but is lucky that he's not held up over the line. We wrestle the ball back and Baxter spots that Penaud is standing at second guard for some reason. He picks and targets the winger - if a forward is standing there, then he'd be in three-point stance and low enough to possibly stop him, but Penaud's upright tackle stands no chance and Baxter grounds the ball for an excellent finish.
Itoje does a nice pull-back to put Lawrence into space - he's got Baxter off his shoulder running a good line, Chessum's got room out wide, or Lawrence can continue to run himself, but instead he remembers that someone somewhere once told him that a good centre should have a kicking game and decides to try that option. It's not a good kick by any stretch of the imagination - it's half-blocked and it'd be no better than a 50/50 even if it did go where he wanted it to - and it gets worse because the bounce of a rugby ball looks like it might be on his side, threatening to sit up for him to regather and run through, only to kick on with the next bounce and go straight to Ramos. The bounce of a rugby ball always hates you, but on this occasion it's actively taunting him as well.
Ramos steps Lawrence and attempts to start a counter, but Freeman reads the next pass and makes a strong tackle, knocking the ball free. Lawrence seizes on the loose ball and we have possession - even better, we have an advantage because the outside defence is ahead of the lost ball. We attempt to make something of it, but we're disorganised and frenetic - France have a defensive line set, but we are offloading and flipping passes on like we've just made a turnover and are trying to find the space in a broken defence. We need to set a ruck, get ourselves organised and see if we've got one of those training ground moves to hand (or another high ball on LBB?), but instead Slade decides to put in a kick behind - it's not a terrible kick, but Bielle-Biarrey always has it covered and it would've required a freak bounce for anyone else to be grounding that. Back for the penalty.
Minute 67: The mark is about 17 metres from touch and 12 metres out. Not even Henry Slade could fail to secure a 5m lineout from here, but Itoje has a conflab with his lieutenants before pointing to the posts. Understandable - if France disrupted our lineout it would sap the momentum from us and reducing the deficit to 3 points is not to be sniffed at. It should be a gimme for a kicker like MSmith, especially since it'd be in an almost identical position to the conversion he missed, so he's had a sighter and can't possibly miss this time.
Minute 68: It's a simple bread-and-butter job for MSmith who hasn't missed a kick from the tee in about 4 months... oh, he's fucked it. And badly too - it's a poor contact that's clubbed across the face of the posts.
If that bit of writing seems familiar, it's because I copied and pasted from minute 59 - if Marcus is going to deliver an identical kick, I don't see why I should be writing anything different! The ball comes off his boot with an unappealing "clmp" and it's like watching a video replay of the conversion.
Points left on the table: England 10 : 3 France
France kick the 22 long and Mitchell takes it inside our half. He feeds Earl who goes on a bit of a dance - looks like he's got Ellis Genge syndrome, as he'd surely have been better just running hard instead of trying to be clever. Still, we're up over halfway and FSmith celebrates by running hard at the defence and popping a neat grubber through when they commit to him. It's not perfect - a bit more weight on it could've seen Sleightholme through, but it is good enough that Ramos is under pressure and he spills the ball as he tries to slide and collect. Sleightholme gathers and goes for a very optimistic grubber and chase, considering he's being tackled as he kicks, and we're coming back for the scrum.
Minute 69: The new French tighthead has not talked to the old French tighthead when he came on - Colombe attempts to bore in on George, only for Baxter to fold him in half, put him in an envelope, and deliver him to his own backrow. Absolutely destroyed.
Mitchell has a really good think about tapping and going, but the thought occurs to him that he would probably prefer not to be murdered by his tight five and so he hands the ball over to FSmith to put into the corner.
Minute 70: FSmith does the business and it's a 5m lineout. We call to Chessum near the back. France have read it and get a jumper there, but the sheer quality of the drill from England - throw, lift, jump, take - means that they're nowhere near disrupting it.
We look like we're forming a useful maul, but it's a ruse from the training ground - Earl takes the ball from Chessum, Heyes binds onto him and drives him sideways, looking like we're changing the point of attack of the rolling maul, only for Earl to flip a pass out to an onrushing TCurry as he spins round. It's a bit of a shame that we're being clever, as France have messed up their maul defence and, if we were actually mauling and committed to it, I think we'd be walking over. As it is, TCurry's charge is halted on the 5m line, but our clearing players are in position and the ball is back quickly. Mitchell's eyes light up with the idea of glory and lunges for the line - he nearly makes it, but is lucky that he's not held up over the line. We wrestle the ball back and Baxter spots that Penaud is standing at second guard for some reason. He picks and targets the winger - if a forward is standing there, then he'd be in three-point stance and low enough to possibly stop him, but Penaud's upright tackle stands no chance and Baxter grounds the ball for an excellent finish.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Minute 71: Replays of the glorious Baxter dash to the line. Extra points have to be given to TCurry for a full double-knee slide, complete with classic roar and pumping fists. Literally looks like a celebration animation from EA Rugby 05, especially since it's done at an angle to everyone else and is disconnected from any of his teammates.
We've changed a letter on the goalkicker, as FSmith steps up. Very similar position to the ones that MSmith missed, but on the other side, and Fin makes no mistake to put us into the lead. 19-18 to the good guys.
I mentioned this in the other thread, but I want to take a second to appreciate the minerals on Marcus. He's an exceptional goalkicker, but he's missed two easy ones in a row with exactly the same miskick, so something has definitely happened in his head or in his kicking technique. Most players in that situation would've demanded another shot, especially with the next one being on the easier side, and sought to rehabilitate their reputation rather than do what's best for the team. If Marcus had made the last two kicks rather than Fin, then there's no way he'd've been getting 4/10 ratings in the papers, and that must've been in his head, yet he still did what was right for the team. Great composure from him and I'm hoping he's spent a week hammering out whatever happened in his technique and knocks over 9 out of 9 conversions when we play the Scots.
Minute 72: France are behind for the first time, but they don't appear to be reacting. They take their time getting to the halfway line, kick it long, Earl catches and carries up to the 22, we reset and Mitchell box-kicks away, exactly the same as the other kick-offs.
This box-kick is excellent and made better by the chase - Ramos jumps, catches, and gets one toe on the floor before getting brutalised by a full-speed Sleightholme. TCurry joins in and they march him back well over the halfway line before he manages to get to ground. France do secure the ball, but the pass out to a forward is an invitation to our blitz - Chessum is up hard to tackle and France have lost 15 metres across the span of two tackles.
Minute 73: Le Garrec box-kicks long and FSmith takes it about 8 metres in from the left touchline. For some reason, he decides to run sideways and attempt to kick for the far touchline - I don't know if this is meant to be an incredibly ambitious touchfinder or something for Freeman to compete for or an attempt to find grass, but whatever he's trying, it doesn't work. The ball floats across, giving Bielle-Biarrey ample time to get under it. He's got acres of space to attack in and only Freeman facing him, but thankfully he doesn't fancy it for some reason and passes back to Ramos to kick long. Marcus is there and calls the mark on the edge of the 22.
Very lucky to get away with that kick - drop that on Sevu Reece or Kolbe and they'd destroy us. Tbh, I'd usually add Bielle-Biarrey onto that list, but I think France are a bit shell-shocked.
Marcus tests the ref's patience by faffing about wasting time, but eventually kicks long and finds a great touch. Unfortunately, it doesn't find enough touch and France can take the quick lineout.
Minute 74: France pump the ball high for the first time, but MSmith catches without any real competition. We recycle and set up the box-kick - this is the kind of time-wasting that Spencer was excellent at when we were losing games last season, but it's actually the right thing to do now!
The kick is another belter and it's Bielle-Biarrey's turn to get demolished as soon as he sets foot on the ground, this time by the other England winger and the other Curry. Sadly, Le Garrec does a superb job to realise his teammate's imminent demise and gets himself in position behind to strip the ball as LBB goes backwards at speed. He takes it away and kicks long - MSmith catches and thinks a counter is on, but Le Garrec has chased hard and Marcus decides he's probably better playing it safe. Shame, cause I think the break was on and the hesitation from MSmith has now caused problems - he passes to FSmith to clear, but Le Garrec has not been committed in the slightest and slides off one Smith to the other, which puts pressure on the kick.
It's still a good kick from Fin - finds grass and even draws a mistake from Dupont, who gets a hand to it but only knocks it back into his 22, Caden Murley style. He's behind everyone else on his team, England are coming up with a couple of blitz defenders and a solid kick-chase line forming behind that - for any other player, that's the cue for England to press hard and harry to try and catch him as far back as they can - one rushing defender might be beaten with a step, but it'll slow the ball carrier down and lead them into the maw of the rest of the defensive line.
However, Dupont is special and, for this occasion, what I mean by that is that we're terrified of him. Instead of treating him like a normal player and rushing him, FSmith and Slade hold back and drift. Dupont then slows and treads water, like he's playing 7s, and Slade still backs off him. He then makes a little feint to go inside and England act like he's got lit dynamite in his hands. There is now a four-man line of England defenders - Lawrence, Slade, FSmith, TCurry - covering a total area of no more than 5 metres across, faced with one player who is only just out of arm's length, and not a single one of them feels confident enough to step forward and tackle him, just in case it's a trick.
Dupont then steps back to the right and runs sideways, and his own personal defensive line follows him, staying 3ft from him at all times like it's mid-2020 and they're respecting his bubble. As it turns out, it was a trick - while England were staring intently at Dupont to work out what his clever backing and forthing was leading up to, Damien Penaud has managed to backtrack enough that he's in position to take a pass. Yup, England's fear of Dupont doing something meant that they didn't intervene while he was deliberately doing absolutely nothing - the whole dance was just wasting time until his backup arrived. It's a 7s tactic that should not work in XVs and I'm kinda pissed off that it did here.
Dupont throws a (dubiously lateral) pass over the top to Penaud and England suddenly realise that France have other players as well, and the one that now has the ball is pretty good himself. Earl does a great job to get to the wing, but Penaud grubbers inside for Barassi to chase - it's a horrible bloody kick to defend, as Sleightholme was anticipating and defending a chip down the line and has to come from very far away to get to a centrally placed kick. He does get there first, but it bounces awkwardly and Barassi lunges for it - I can't tell if he gets a hand to it or just puts Sleightholme off, but either way, the ball bounces loose and pops up beautifully into Penaud's hands as he continues his run without him needing to break stride.
Minute 75: MSmith tackles Penaud, but there's too many French runners coming forward and too few white shirts in any position to help, so he's got a choice of passes. He picks Alldritt, who gets a pass over the despairing Mitchell to feed Ramos, and then onto Penaud again. Slade has somehow got back to drag him down and we have some vague semblance of a defensive line, but it's quick ball and Le Garrec can move it quickly. There's a brief moment of hope as it's a terrible pass from the 9, but France have so many players available that they can afford to be clumsy - the ball gets swept along the ground to Moefana who picks up, draws the last man, and then passes for LBB to saunter under the posts.
Piss.
We've changed a letter on the goalkicker, as FSmith steps up. Very similar position to the ones that MSmith missed, but on the other side, and Fin makes no mistake to put us into the lead. 19-18 to the good guys.
I mentioned this in the other thread, but I want to take a second to appreciate the minerals on Marcus. He's an exceptional goalkicker, but he's missed two easy ones in a row with exactly the same miskick, so something has definitely happened in his head or in his kicking technique. Most players in that situation would've demanded another shot, especially with the next one being on the easier side, and sought to rehabilitate their reputation rather than do what's best for the team. If Marcus had made the last two kicks rather than Fin, then there's no way he'd've been getting 4/10 ratings in the papers, and that must've been in his head, yet he still did what was right for the team. Great composure from him and I'm hoping he's spent a week hammering out whatever happened in his technique and knocks over 9 out of 9 conversions when we play the Scots.
Minute 72: France are behind for the first time, but they don't appear to be reacting. They take their time getting to the halfway line, kick it long, Earl catches and carries up to the 22, we reset and Mitchell box-kicks away, exactly the same as the other kick-offs.
This box-kick is excellent and made better by the chase - Ramos jumps, catches, and gets one toe on the floor before getting brutalised by a full-speed Sleightholme. TCurry joins in and they march him back well over the halfway line before he manages to get to ground. France do secure the ball, but the pass out to a forward is an invitation to our blitz - Chessum is up hard to tackle and France have lost 15 metres across the span of two tackles.
Minute 73: Le Garrec box-kicks long and FSmith takes it about 8 metres in from the left touchline. For some reason, he decides to run sideways and attempt to kick for the far touchline - I don't know if this is meant to be an incredibly ambitious touchfinder or something for Freeman to compete for or an attempt to find grass, but whatever he's trying, it doesn't work. The ball floats across, giving Bielle-Biarrey ample time to get under it. He's got acres of space to attack in and only Freeman facing him, but thankfully he doesn't fancy it for some reason and passes back to Ramos to kick long. Marcus is there and calls the mark on the edge of the 22.
Very lucky to get away with that kick - drop that on Sevu Reece or Kolbe and they'd destroy us. Tbh, I'd usually add Bielle-Biarrey onto that list, but I think France are a bit shell-shocked.
Marcus tests the ref's patience by faffing about wasting time, but eventually kicks long and finds a great touch. Unfortunately, it doesn't find enough touch and France can take the quick lineout.
Minute 74: France pump the ball high for the first time, but MSmith catches without any real competition. We recycle and set up the box-kick - this is the kind of time-wasting that Spencer was excellent at when we were losing games last season, but it's actually the right thing to do now!
The kick is another belter and it's Bielle-Biarrey's turn to get demolished as soon as he sets foot on the ground, this time by the other England winger and the other Curry. Sadly, Le Garrec does a superb job to realise his teammate's imminent demise and gets himself in position behind to strip the ball as LBB goes backwards at speed. He takes it away and kicks long - MSmith catches and thinks a counter is on, but Le Garrec has chased hard and Marcus decides he's probably better playing it safe. Shame, cause I think the break was on and the hesitation from MSmith has now caused problems - he passes to FSmith to clear, but Le Garrec has not been committed in the slightest and slides off one Smith to the other, which puts pressure on the kick.
It's still a good kick from Fin - finds grass and even draws a mistake from Dupont, who gets a hand to it but only knocks it back into his 22, Caden Murley style. He's behind everyone else on his team, England are coming up with a couple of blitz defenders and a solid kick-chase line forming behind that - for any other player, that's the cue for England to press hard and harry to try and catch him as far back as they can - one rushing defender might be beaten with a step, but it'll slow the ball carrier down and lead them into the maw of the rest of the defensive line.
However, Dupont is special and, for this occasion, what I mean by that is that we're terrified of him. Instead of treating him like a normal player and rushing him, FSmith and Slade hold back and drift. Dupont then slows and treads water, like he's playing 7s, and Slade still backs off him. He then makes a little feint to go inside and England act like he's got lit dynamite in his hands. There is now a four-man line of England defenders - Lawrence, Slade, FSmith, TCurry - covering a total area of no more than 5 metres across, faced with one player who is only just out of arm's length, and not a single one of them feels confident enough to step forward and tackle him, just in case it's a trick.
Dupont then steps back to the right and runs sideways, and his own personal defensive line follows him, staying 3ft from him at all times like it's mid-2020 and they're respecting his bubble. As it turns out, it was a trick - while England were staring intently at Dupont to work out what his clever backing and forthing was leading up to, Damien Penaud has managed to backtrack enough that he's in position to take a pass. Yup, England's fear of Dupont doing something meant that they didn't intervene while he was deliberately doing absolutely nothing - the whole dance was just wasting time until his backup arrived. It's a 7s tactic that should not work in XVs and I'm kinda pissed off that it did here.
Dupont throws a (dubiously lateral) pass over the top to Penaud and England suddenly realise that France have other players as well, and the one that now has the ball is pretty good himself. Earl does a great job to get to the wing, but Penaud grubbers inside for Barassi to chase - it's a horrible bloody kick to defend, as Sleightholme was anticipating and defending a chip down the line and has to come from very far away to get to a centrally placed kick. He does get there first, but it bounces awkwardly and Barassi lunges for it - I can't tell if he gets a hand to it or just puts Sleightholme off, but either way, the ball bounces loose and pops up beautifully into Penaud's hands as he continues his run without him needing to break stride.
Minute 75: MSmith tackles Penaud, but there's too many French runners coming forward and too few white shirts in any position to help, so he's got a choice of passes. He picks Alldritt, who gets a pass over the despairing Mitchell to feed Ramos, and then onto Penaud again. Slade has somehow got back to drag him down and we have some vague semblance of a defensive line, but it's quick ball and Le Garrec can move it quickly. There's a brief moment of hope as it's a terrible pass from the 9, but France have so many players available that they can afford to be clumsy - the ball gets swept along the ground to Moefana who picks up, draws the last man, and then passes for LBB to saunter under the posts.
Piss.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Was that how you first developed an interest in chiropracty?Which Tyler wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2025 12:26 pm Reminds me of that time my team thought it would be a good idea to put a SH in at hooker, because it was that or cancel the match (I don't remember uncontested scrums being offered as an option - mid 90s)
The opposition agreed that they'd only try in the scrum if it really mattered - they lied.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
I played on a team that was quite mobile for the lower drinking leagues we were playing in but not the biggest, there were occasions we didn't have much weight in the front row and would be off playing teams in former mining towns or with strong farm connections and the poor sods who volunteered to be the back up props often ended up in similar positions to this. Thankfully our 9 and hooker were very good at getting the ball back fast and the 8 was our best player.Puja wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2025 7:56 pmWas that how you first developed an interest in chiropracty?Which Tyler wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2025 12:26 pm Reminds me of that time my team thought it would be a good idea to put a SH in at hooker, because it was that or cancel the match (I don't remember uncontested scrums being offered as an option - mid 90s)
The opposition agreed that they'd only try in the scrum if it really mattered - they lied.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
1st year student.Puja wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2025 7:56 pmWas that how you first developed an interest in chiropracty?Which Tyler wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2025 12:26 pm Reminds me of that time my team thought it would be a good idea to put a SH in at hooker, because it was that or cancel the match (I don't remember uncontested scrums being offered as an option - mid 90s)
The opposition agreed that they'd only try in the scrum if it really mattered - they lied.
Puja
I'd played a game or two at hooker aged 8 or so (when everyone plays every position to see what suits) - that was considered god enough.
Amazingly, it wasn't
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
To be fair, that almost exactly mirrors how I ended up at hooker when I moved to Bath - mentioned that I'd played hooker in 7s once and was whisked into the 2nd XV 2 shirt (to save the winger who'd been shanghaied in there before me). The only difference is that I discovered I liked it there!Which Tyler wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2025 11:00 pm1st year student.Puja wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2025 7:56 pmWas that how you first developed an interest in chiropracty?Which Tyler wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2025 12:26 pm Reminds me of that time my team thought it would be a good idea to put a SH in at hooker, because it was that or cancel the match (I don't remember uncontested scrums being offered as an option - mid 90s)
The opposition agreed that they'd only try in the scrum if it really mattered - they lied.
Puja
I'd played a game or two at hooker aged 8 or so (when everyone plays every position to see what suits) - that was considered god enough.
Amazingly, it wasn't
Puja
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Minute 76: Ramos dobs over the conversion and it's 19-25. At this point watching live, I did think to myself, "Welp, all we need to do at this point is score a converted try, then we get the win and the bonus point too!" But I didn't believe it.
Elliot Daly comes on for Henry Slade, pushing Freeman into midfield. I believe my thoughts watching live were, "I wish we had someone a bit better to bring on than Elliot Daly."
FSmith puts a high kick-off up - the lifting pod take it this time, but Freeman has got around to France's side in position to take the offload and it startles the catcher so much that he ends up bouncing the ball off Freeman's head. A Curry of some description reacts fastest to snatch the ball and England drive over to set up an attacking ruck.
George runs hard at the line and pulls it back very late to find MSmith. Marcus has the other Curry and Earl on his shoulder, running hard lines that interest a lot of the French defence, but he leaves it late to pass behind them to FSmith in midfield. There's now a bunch of room on the outside and Sleightholme is going hoarse begging for it, but Daly takes the pass and cuts back inside - I was on Sleightholme's side when watching live, as it looks like he's got a clear path to the line, but on review, Daly's made the right call as there's legions of French cover charging across and making the pass will just end up with Sleightholme going into touch 10m out. His step back inside takes us up to the 22, where we pile over the ruck to secure more quick ball.
Minute 77: Baxter crashes up for no change, but we recycle well and get into the 22 as BCurry tips on to Itoje. We come back the other way and Earl gets another touch of the Genges by stopping his hard line to try and to step someone who isn't there to be stepped, but TCurry rescues the situation by tackling both Earl and his tackler and driving them on half a metre before finding the deck.
Next phase, the ball goes through the hands to Ollie Lawrence who really must be told NOT TO KICK THE BALL IN THE 22 before the next game, because he drops it onto his toe. It's not a *bad* idea necessarily, as Sleightholme is ready to chase and he stands a decent chance of beating Penaud to the right kick through, but it is a bad execution - wrong angle and wrong power sees the ball drilled into touch 5m out and us lose possession.
It's infuriating - if I recall correctly, he made one attacking kick in the 22 one time that led to a try, everyone went, "Well gosh, who knew Ollie Lawrence had a kicking game, he's like a new Ma'a Nonu, congratulations to such a well-rounded player," and ever since then, he's been trying to make it happen again, despite the fact that he does not have the skill for it at this level.
France throw right over the top, but BCurry is paying attention and tackles Alldritt well. They keep the ball though and Le Garrec clears to touch. Daly has a long think about taking it quickly, but decides we'll settle for the lineout about 39m out.
Minute 78: England send Chessum to the front of the lineout to look like they're going to accept the front, then throw to the middle where Itoje is. Unfortunately France read it and send someone up in front of Itoje - thankfully the throw is good enough that he can only get fingertips on it and knock it on, but it's enough to ruin our possession. George gathers it in, but he's taken back to the halfway line.
We get the ball back and Mitchell makes a little dab over the top. Not sure what I think of that choice to be honest - on the one hand, we're on the back foot, he does find grass, and the ball could bounce anywhere, but on the other hand, it's kicking the ball away when we're losing and there's less than 3 minutes left. As it turns out, the ball does bounce up nicely for Ramos, but his attempt at stepping away from pressure sees him chopped down by FSmith, and then Earl locks in over the ball. Mitchell, Itoje, and Chessum all stand behind the ruck and do their best aeroplane arms and the referee gives them what they want.
FSmith kicks to the corner... and shanks it a bit. In his defence, the penalty is close to the touchline so it's not a great angle, but he only makes about 7-8 metres, leaving us 16m away from the tryline.
Minute 79: We set the lineout and actually put some movement in this time before sending Chessum up at the front - France do challenge, but it's another great throw by George and the movement has bought Chessum enough room to catch it cleanly. He brings it down and we set a maul. It rumbles forwards bit by bit, but rolls to the left without detaching from the right, leaving France players on England's side and the ball dangerously lodged near the middle. Mitchell demonstrates what an upgrade he is over Spencer in the autumn by actually paying attention to this and making sure he has hands on the ball. It's lumbering slowly forwards, but the referee's not happy and shouts that we need to play, so Mitchell grabs the ball and scoots around to the openside. Quick word for anyone who was asking what the point of the law variations protection the 9 are - that wouldn't've been possible before this tournament as all the French players who had swung round to the wrong side would've been allowed to grab him from the side of the maul as he took the ball.
This move has been analysed very thoroughly in a dozen articles, so I shan't be too florid. Mitchell passes wide to Lawrence, who holds Moefana and Dupont's interest with his own run while keeping the ball in two hands to attract the eyes to the hard line that Freeman is running off his shoulder, which draws in Barassi. Lawrence instead pulls a nicely disguised pass out the back to FSmith, who looks to be arcing around into the gap between Barassi and LBB. Barassi realises that he's been conned into following Freeman, sees FSmith running and thinks that's his man. Outside him, Bielle-Biarrey has to trust that Barassi has FSmith covered because MSmith is running a lovely line to attack his outside shoulder and FSmith looks like he's winding up to pass, so the only hope he has of defending is to start drifting outward now.
All that's left is for FSmith to pull the trigger. He straightens his line and steps inside, further convincing Barassi that he's running and must be tackled, and then Fin lays off a perfectly timed pass to Elliot Daly, who was running sideways behind the line only to straighten late and waltz through the gaping hole that's been created between the French 13 and 14.
Dupont has read it, of course he has, but Daly had picked a good enough line to keep him away, and shows pace and power to drive through the despairing cover tackle and make it over the line. Twickenham erupts.
Minute 80: Much was made on the TV commentary about FSmith not running out the clock with the conversion, but the television graphics were wrong - Daly grounds the ball at 78.58, which means that, with the shot clock for conversions now being only 60 seconds, FSmith has to kick before the clock ticks past full-time or risk the humiliation of being timed out of the match-winning kick! He leaves it pretty close, taking up 56 seconds of his minute, but Amashukeli confirms that we will have a restart and every English fan is praying.
Elliot Daly comes on for Henry Slade, pushing Freeman into midfield. I believe my thoughts watching live were, "I wish we had someone a bit better to bring on than Elliot Daly."
FSmith puts a high kick-off up - the lifting pod take it this time, but Freeman has got around to France's side in position to take the offload and it startles the catcher so much that he ends up bouncing the ball off Freeman's head. A Curry of some description reacts fastest to snatch the ball and England drive over to set up an attacking ruck.
George runs hard at the line and pulls it back very late to find MSmith. Marcus has the other Curry and Earl on his shoulder, running hard lines that interest a lot of the French defence, but he leaves it late to pass behind them to FSmith in midfield. There's now a bunch of room on the outside and Sleightholme is going hoarse begging for it, but Daly takes the pass and cuts back inside - I was on Sleightholme's side when watching live, as it looks like he's got a clear path to the line, but on review, Daly's made the right call as there's legions of French cover charging across and making the pass will just end up with Sleightholme going into touch 10m out. His step back inside takes us up to the 22, where we pile over the ruck to secure more quick ball.
Minute 77: Baxter crashes up for no change, but we recycle well and get into the 22 as BCurry tips on to Itoje. We come back the other way and Earl gets another touch of the Genges by stopping his hard line to try and to step someone who isn't there to be stepped, but TCurry rescues the situation by tackling both Earl and his tackler and driving them on half a metre before finding the deck.
Next phase, the ball goes through the hands to Ollie Lawrence who really must be told NOT TO KICK THE BALL IN THE 22 before the next game, because he drops it onto his toe. It's not a *bad* idea necessarily, as Sleightholme is ready to chase and he stands a decent chance of beating Penaud to the right kick through, but it is a bad execution - wrong angle and wrong power sees the ball drilled into touch 5m out and us lose possession.
It's infuriating - if I recall correctly, he made one attacking kick in the 22 one time that led to a try, everyone went, "Well gosh, who knew Ollie Lawrence had a kicking game, he's like a new Ma'a Nonu, congratulations to such a well-rounded player," and ever since then, he's been trying to make it happen again, despite the fact that he does not have the skill for it at this level.
France throw right over the top, but BCurry is paying attention and tackles Alldritt well. They keep the ball though and Le Garrec clears to touch. Daly has a long think about taking it quickly, but decides we'll settle for the lineout about 39m out.
Minute 78: England send Chessum to the front of the lineout to look like they're going to accept the front, then throw to the middle where Itoje is. Unfortunately France read it and send someone up in front of Itoje - thankfully the throw is good enough that he can only get fingertips on it and knock it on, but it's enough to ruin our possession. George gathers it in, but he's taken back to the halfway line.
We get the ball back and Mitchell makes a little dab over the top. Not sure what I think of that choice to be honest - on the one hand, we're on the back foot, he does find grass, and the ball could bounce anywhere, but on the other hand, it's kicking the ball away when we're losing and there's less than 3 minutes left. As it turns out, the ball does bounce up nicely for Ramos, but his attempt at stepping away from pressure sees him chopped down by FSmith, and then Earl locks in over the ball. Mitchell, Itoje, and Chessum all stand behind the ruck and do their best aeroplane arms and the referee gives them what they want.
FSmith kicks to the corner... and shanks it a bit. In his defence, the penalty is close to the touchline so it's not a great angle, but he only makes about 7-8 metres, leaving us 16m away from the tryline.
Minute 79: We set the lineout and actually put some movement in this time before sending Chessum up at the front - France do challenge, but it's another great throw by George and the movement has bought Chessum enough room to catch it cleanly. He brings it down and we set a maul. It rumbles forwards bit by bit, but rolls to the left without detaching from the right, leaving France players on England's side and the ball dangerously lodged near the middle. Mitchell demonstrates what an upgrade he is over Spencer in the autumn by actually paying attention to this and making sure he has hands on the ball. It's lumbering slowly forwards, but the referee's not happy and shouts that we need to play, so Mitchell grabs the ball and scoots around to the openside. Quick word for anyone who was asking what the point of the law variations protection the 9 are - that wouldn't've been possible before this tournament as all the French players who had swung round to the wrong side would've been allowed to grab him from the side of the maul as he took the ball.
This move has been analysed very thoroughly in a dozen articles, so I shan't be too florid. Mitchell passes wide to Lawrence, who holds Moefana and Dupont's interest with his own run while keeping the ball in two hands to attract the eyes to the hard line that Freeman is running off his shoulder, which draws in Barassi. Lawrence instead pulls a nicely disguised pass out the back to FSmith, who looks to be arcing around into the gap between Barassi and LBB. Barassi realises that he's been conned into following Freeman, sees FSmith running and thinks that's his man. Outside him, Bielle-Biarrey has to trust that Barassi has FSmith covered because MSmith is running a lovely line to attack his outside shoulder and FSmith looks like he's winding up to pass, so the only hope he has of defending is to start drifting outward now.
All that's left is for FSmith to pull the trigger. He straightens his line and steps inside, further convincing Barassi that he's running and must be tackled, and then Fin lays off a perfectly timed pass to Elliot Daly, who was running sideways behind the line only to straighten late and waltz through the gaping hole that's been created between the French 13 and 14.
Dupont has read it, of course he has, but Daly had picked a good enough line to keep him away, and shows pace and power to drive through the despairing cover tackle and make it over the line. Twickenham erupts.
Minute 80: Much was made on the TV commentary about FSmith not running out the clock with the conversion, but the television graphics were wrong - Daly grounds the ball at 78.58, which means that, with the shot clock for conversions now being only 60 seconds, FSmith has to kick before the clock ticks past full-time or risk the humiliation of being timed out of the match-winning kick! He leaves it pretty close, taking up 56 seconds of his minute, but Amashukeli confirms that we will have a restart and every English fan is praying.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Minute 81: France take a leaf out of England's Week 1 book with the short central restart, but Penaud is no Freddie Steward and can only get enough of a hand there to knock it on. It's enough of a melee that the ref doesn't give a decision, but Marcus Smith reacts incredibly quickly to an awful bouncing ball and dives on it. Le Garrec is first there and could possibly jackal, but he's too fast and loses his feet, whereupon Chessum and Heyes get low and blast every hint of French presence away from our possession. Itoje goes in at the back to camp over the ball, Lawrence goes into the side of the ruck because it looks interesting and he wants to be useful, but most importantly, Mitchell digs the ball out and fires it backwards for FSmith to leather the ball into touch.
26-25 to the good guys and all is right with the world.
26-25 to the good guys and all is right with the world.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Thoughts after doing the analysis.Puja wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2025 12:12 pm Initial impressions:
England looked a little bit nervous first 20 minutes and had practically none of the ball, however they mostly had France contained and the "dozens of points thrown away" by France were actually mostly down to English defensive pressure. England also did an absolute number on Dupont and shut him down with numbers and pressure (although I think the last French try came from giving him too much respect and fear and stepping back rather than trying to pressure like they would've anyone else). Thought this was another examination of El-Abd's system where he came out massively in credit.
I thought Martin was poor in everything but defence, LCD was anonymous to bad, and I actually don't have an opinion on Slade - I think he was on the pitch?
Other people thought Genge was bad and that MSmith at 15 was bad. Not sure I agree, but I'll be keeping an eye out.
FSmith started poorly but grew into it. All of our penalty kicks for touch, from both Smiths and Slade, were terrible though.
Amashukeli showed once again that he's the best referee in the world
And we are starting a counter - this week it is Points left on the table: England 0 : 0 France
Let's see how many of those hold up.
I was right about the English defensive pressure being more important than French mistakes. Kayser is talking on the commentary about "France will be rueing those 8, 9, or 10 try scoring opportunities that they didn't take" and it's become a truism in the reporting, but France had only one try-scoring opportunity that they screwed up rather than defending, and that was the Dupont one. I am going to add that one onto the counter in the end (despite the three clear penalty offences that should've annulled it), as I do feel a little biased and I am willing to be gracious in victory. I'll even give Ramos his conversion despite it likely being from the touchline, cause he was kicking everything after he screwed up the easy first one.
Points left on the table: England 10 : 10 France
England did do a number on Dupont defensively, but he also did a number on them, several times. All the South African fans on PlanetRugby shouting, "Who's your GOAT now, huh?" the answer is still Dupont. When a team are actively targetting you to the extent that they have a defensive call around shouting your name, and you still dominate the game and create three tries, you're pretty damned good.
Martin and LCD were both solid, but not at their best. Slade was a real mixed bag and managed to be average overall through being good and bad, but never reaching the levels of great/terrible.
I was wrong on Genge - he did have a bad game. Scrummaging was good, but if he plays like that against Scotland, I will genuinely start a counter. Unsure if it will be Times Genge's confidence in his own talents was sadly misplaced or Times Genge decided to do a back's skill instead of giving it to a nearby back and it didn't go as well as he saw it in his head. Suggestions welcome. He needs to be careful, considering how well Baxter played off the bench.
MSmith at 15 playing badly is an incredibly basic opinion, which you could probably have guessed by it being shared by Stephen Jones - he had a terrific game and his presence entering the line in the 13 channel made a significant difference to our attack. Two missed kicks does not a 4/10 performance make. The real test will come against Scotland who likely won't be as cocky as the French were and have likely spent the last fortnight practicing high balls. Hopefully Marcus will have been doing the same.
FSmith is not yet the messiah, although he did show some very positive signs, especially given it was his first test in a very febrile atmosphere. Giving him MotM was risible given TCurry's performance though. I was not wrong that every penalty kick for touch needed to be better - hopefully that is also being practiced this week.
And finally, Amashukeli is the best referee in the world. Some mistakes, because he's human, but far fewer than most, and his control and management of the game was utterly impeccable. Not a coincidence that that game featured the fewest scrum offences and resets that I've seen while doing these - he set his expectations early and, by and large, there was exceedingly little fuckery going on in the front row.
All things told, buzzing for Saturday. Let's hope they don't let me down and crush my spirits again!
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute - COMPLETED
Great stuff, Puja. You write in a clear and entertaining way yet still manage go beyond the basic analysis we get from most journos.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Genge reminds us he's not a back?Puja wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2025 12:19 amI was wrong on Genge - he did have a bad game. Scrummaging was good, but if he plays like that against Scotland, I will genuinely start a counter. Unsure if it will be Times Genge's confidence in his own talents was sadly misplaced or Times Genge decided to do a back's skill instead of giving it to a nearby back and it didn't go as well as he saw it in his head. Suggestions welcome. He needs to be careful, considering how well Baxter played off the bench.
MotM hasn't been about selecting the best player for a decade or so - it's "who do we want to interview" often due to "what narrative do we want to drive?"Puja wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2025 12:19 amFSmith is not yet the messiah, although he did show some very positive signs, especially given it was his first test in a very febrile atmosphere. Giving him MotM was risible given TCurry's performance though. I was not wrong that every penalty kick for touch needed to be better - hopefully that is also being practiced this week.
TY as ever, for doing this. Always interesting
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute - COMPLETED
Puja, did you reach any conclusions about 'points left on table' from England's pov? Was it simple innacuracy as the team develops, for example? I think it is fair to blame the backs more or less exclusively, is it not?
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
I was more worried about him being stripped in contact and the shanked kick to Penaud, both of which gave try scoring opportunities then I was a couple of sliced kicks at goal. Most goal kickers have an off day at some point. The Ice Man certainly did but was still heralded as one of the great points kickers in the game.Puja wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2025 12:19 am
MSmith at 15 playing badly is an incredibly basic opinion, which you could probably have guessed by it being shared by Stephen Jones - he had a terrific game and his presence entering the line in the 13 channel made a significant difference to our attack. Two missed kicks does not a 4/10 performance make. The real test will come against Scotland who likely won't be as cocky as the French were and have likely spent the last fortnight practicing high balls. Hopefully Marcus will have been doing the same.
Hopefully see plenty of Marcus ball in hand, launching counters from the back at the weekend. I do like the tactic of sitting Earl back there with him.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute
Nah, nowhere near maundering enough for me. I've got a brand to maintain!Which Tyler wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2025 6:56 amGenge reminds us he's not a back?Puja wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2025 12:19 amI was wrong on Genge - he did have a bad game. Scrummaging was good, but if he plays like that against Scotland, I will genuinely start a counter. Unsure if it will be Times Genge's confidence in his own talents was sadly misplaced or Times Genge decided to do a back's skill instead of giving it to a nearby back and it didn't go as well as he saw it in his head. Suggestions welcome. He needs to be careful, considering how well Baxter played off the bench.
The only try opportunity that made the counter was the one spurned by Genge's failure to pass, but if we're counting other opportunities, then I'd still say it's mostly the forwards. The only examples of backs killing good attacking position were Lawrence's two KADABs and MSmith overrunning/Mitchell passing it to him anyway (there were a couple of occasions where I'd've preferred FSmith/Slade not have kicked, but they were solid attacking options). Everything else was a lineout error or a mistake by a forward.
We were actually pretty efficient from limited attacking positions to my mind.
I'd say both of those were mistakes he makes at fly-half as well - the sliced kick was him standing at first receiver, and the stripped ball came from him sitting in the backfield on kick tennis which is usual for him at 10 as well.FKAS wrote: ↑Wed Feb 19, 2025 9:13 amI was more worried about him being stripped in contact and the shanked kick to Penaud, both of which gave try scoring opportunities then I was a couple of sliced kicks at goal. Most goal kickers have an off day at some point. The Ice Man certainly did but was still heralded as one of the great points kickers in the game.
Hopefully see plenty of Marcus ball in hand, launching counters from the back at the weekend. I do like the tactic of sitting Earl back there with him.
I'm unsure if the Earl thing will be permanent or was a tactic just for France - they are known for kicking long and having a forward there to run it back hard was an plan that Betterideas used in a previous match with Genge (which backfired with him being shagged out for the scrums). Might be that Earl is found to be more useful staying in a more traditional position if Scotland aren't kicking for distance? Idk.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute - COMPLETED
MOTM went to the wrong Fin.
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute - COMPLETED
Been saving this until it's finished. Thanks as always Puja 
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute - COMPLETED
Thank you Puja. As ever, a fascinating read. Do you have a link where I could buy you a coffee?
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Re: England vs France - minute-by-minute - COMPLETED
Or, if not coffee, then at least let us contribute to the "hookers and blow" account.
For now, I'll put something towards Hammy on your behalf
For now, I'll put something towards Hammy on your behalf
Last edited by Which Tyler on Wed Feb 19, 2025 12:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.