Toxic Masculinity in Sport

[Which Tyler]

This is probably worth a thread of its own, but I have nothing of any real value to add - as a middle-aged non-breeder
BBC
How sports coaches are helping tackle toxic masculinity

[Puja]

I saw that article too and was encouraged by it.

As someone with two daughters, the deepening and fermenting of toxic masculinity over the past decade or so is utterly terrifying. I mean, it would be anyway, but thinking about it too long gives me anxiety palpitations about the people they'll have to deal with as they get older. Teenage boys were stupid enough back when I was one, let alone now that the "manosphere" exists.

Puja

[Son of Mathonwy]

I've got one of each. My son gives me no reason to worry - he's very tolerant, hangs out with a decent bunch who have no time for that toxic shit. There may be arseholes out there but from what I see (a sample of one!) today's youth are better than in my day (there was definitely a current of mild racism and homophobia in the 70s & 80s).

[Sandydragon]

I've got one of each. My son gives me no reason to worry - he's very tolerant, hangs out with a decent bunch who have no time for that toxic shit. There may be arseholes out there but from what I see (a sample of one!) today's youth are better than in my day (there was definitely a current of mild racism and homophobia in the 70s & 80s).

I’d agree with that. The internet is a cesspool but overall there were just as many bad influences when I was growing up.

But I completely applaud any initiative to cancel out the toxic BS that is too frequently found on the web

[Donny osmond]

Having been a father for 18 years ( 2 girls), teacher for 15 years and a guidance/pastoral care teacher for 2 years, my experience tells me that the kids are, mostly, alright. Sure there's aresholes, as in every group of people, but almost all of them can see the online BS for what it is and a lot of them are willing to call it out. I spoke to my S3 class (14yo) about Adolescence and the ones who had seen it laughed and reckoned 2 things that made me smile:
1 it's a program about crap parenting not online influences
2 either way, the adults are the problem not the kids

I kinda had to agree.

[Banquo]

1 it's a program about crap parenting not online influences
2 either way, the adults are the problem not the kids

Si!

[Stom]

It's a societal problem, this is simply a symptom, much like all prejudice against people different from you, Donny.

Kids don't need to be taught to not be prejudiced. But if their influences are prejudiced, in any way shape or form, that can influence them. And being a prejudiced cwnt, against any group of people, can rub off.

So, for the good of society, we should treat everyone with respect, but we should not tolerate prejudice, whoever it is against.

[cashead]

It's a societal problem, this is simply a symptom, much like all prejudice against people different from you, Donny.

Kids don't need to be taught to not be prejudiced. But if their influences are prejudiced, in any way shape or form, that can influence them. And being a prejudiced cwnt, against any group of people, can rub off.

So, for the good of society, we should treat everyone with respect, but we should not tolerate prejudice, whoever it is against.

Yeah, this basically.

teacher for 15 years and a guidance/pastoral care teacher for 2 years

So you really should know better. Have you reflected on why you are permanently banned from participating in specific threads where a particular topic comes up?

[Son of Mathonwy]

Clearly kids need good role models, especially if they don't have one at home (as in Adolescence). Austerity has obviously made this problem worse, with drastically reduced local funding for youth centres and sports facilities. More funding for education would obviously help too. How about investing in the young, making them feel they are valued?

[Donny osmond]

slightly unnecessary there, Stom, isn't this thread about tolerance and respect?

Happily for everyone, the kids I teach have me for Guidance and are hence able to apply critical thinking skills to everyday issues, rather than angrily parroting Internet derived sound bites.

My classes and I have often talked of the need for open and honest discussion as a far more preferable method of resolving disputes than censorship and bullying. I think they have appreciated the messages - certainly the end of year feedback was very positive.

SoM is right, there is a need for good role models and personalities like Southgate do a power of good, and while I agree to an extent about funding, it's really a problem that begins in the home. All the funding in the world for education/local facilities (more please!) will struggle to get over the top of a teenage boy whose mum and/or dad either doesn't care or is actively teaching/demonstrating a lack of tolerance. As a society, we need to talk more about parenting when we talk about issues like toxic masculinity.

[Stom]

Because you cannot pick and choose in society.

If you decide that an at risk minority group is unfit for your care, no matter which group that is, you are contributing to the destruction of that society.

Our role in society is not only to contribute to society, but to stand up for everyone who is less well off than us in that society. By failing to stand up for one group, you might as well be rejecting all minority groups.

And then society fails.

And that is all that is happening.

By dehumanizing groups of people, society will eat itself. More and more groups will be dehumanized. More and more groups will be sidelined. Until we end up with what we see today:

A rise in fascism. A rise in toxic masculinity and toxic femininity. A rise in homelessness, in hate crime, in genocide. A rise in inequality.

And that does not come from Andrew Tate.

That comes from you or I failing to stand up for the people in our society who need our help and protection.

That comes from you or I failing our role in society. Simply because we put ourselves on a pedestal. Above someone else. And then judge them for that.

Then society falls apart and Andrew Tate appears. Peterson appears, Trump appears. Netenyahu, Modi, Putin, Duterte, Orban, Simion...

People who want to commit atrocities against minorities.

Because you and I let them. Because we did not protect minorities.

Yes, I am saying that your treatment of one group of people as less than human caused this crisis. Not directly, no. But without treating minorities as less than us, we would not have let this situation happen. We would not have contributed to the destruction of the society that allowed us to have a peaceful childhood. No matter the IRA. No matter the fall of Communism, no matter the first gulf war...our childhood was peaceful as heck compared to the kids of today.

And that is our fault.

Because we did not stand up for minority rights.

[Son of Mathonwy]

slightly unnecessary there, Stom, isn't this thread about tolerance and respect?

Happily for everyone, the kids I teach have me for Guidance and are hence able to apply critical thinking skills to everyday issues, rather than angrily parroting Internet derived sound bites.

My classes and I have often talked of the need for open and honest discussion as a far more preferable method of resolving disputes than censorship and bullying. I think they have appreciated the messages - certainly the end of year feedback was very positive.

SoM is right, there is a need for good role models and personalities like Southgate do a power of good, and while I agree to an extent about funding, it's really a problem that begins in the home. All the funding in the world for education/local facilities (more please!) will struggle to get over the top of a teenage boy whose mum and/or dad either doesn't care or is actively teaching/demonstrating a lack of tolerance. As a society, we need to talk more about parenting when we talk about issues like toxic masculinity.

Agreed that the problem begins at home but there's very little that can be done about bad but not actually abusive parents. What can be done is to fund education and other facilities for the young so that they can save some kids (possibly many of them, if things are designed well) from bad upbringings.

There's not much that can be done about the parents themselves but setting an example from government of kindness - imagine the Prime Minister talking about that - rather than the sort of harsh intolerance we see more and more, would help.

[Donny osmond]

Again, I agree about more funding, but the answer can't only be education. Kids have been being taught about kindness and tolerance for decades and the message just founders on the rocks of irresponsible parenting. Schools would be a great hub for parenting groups or lessons, maybe including kids in delivering messages to parents about the example they set, and that would come back to your points about role models amd funding etc. But it needs to be a societal message, schools can't do it alone.