Was it ever a thing? Some do swap hands, some don't, it doesn't seem much changedEugene Wrayburn wrote:This seems to be no longer considered a thing. The number of Test wings who get it wrong is staggering.Which Tyler wrote:From what I've seen (and IIRC) positioning issues, hesitancy as if he's second guessing himself, and occasionally being waved into the right position by Brown/Joseph.
I don't claim enough knowledge on wing play to know about (or look for) things like running lines, ball in which hand etc I would suspect it comes under right decision, minimally delayed.
ETA: oh, and checking to see if there's an airborne defender in the space he's running into
EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Moderator: Puja
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
as just demonstrated, reverted to centre mode and Taylor scoresWhich Tyler wrote:From what I've seen (and IIRC) positioning issues, hesitancy as if he's second guessing himself, and occasionally being waved into the right position by Brown/Joseph.
I don't claim enough knowledge on wing play to know about (or look for) things like running lines, ball in which hand etc I would suspect it comes under right decision, minimally delayed.
ETA: oh, and checking to see if there's an airborne defender in the space he's running into
- Which Tyler
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
briefly; he remembered that the wide-man was his to cover too late, and got caught in no-man's land.Banquo wrote:as just demonstrated, reverted to centre mode and Taylor scoresWhich Tyler wrote:From what I've seen (and IIRC) positioning issues, hesitancy as if he's second guessing himself, and occasionally being waved into the right position by Brown/Joseph.
I don't claim enough knowledge on wing play to know about (or look for) things like running lines, ball in which hand etc I would suspect it comes under right decision, minimally delayed.
ETA: oh, and checking to see if there's an airborne defender in the space he's running into
I was trying to be subtle though on the match thread; having pulled out of commenting here.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Which Tyler wrote:briefly; he remembered that the wide-man was his to cover too late, and got caught in no-man's land.Banquo wrote:as just demonstrated, reverted to centre mode and Taylor scoresWhich Tyler wrote:From what I've seen (and IIRC) positioning issues, hesitancy as if he's second guessing himself, and occasionally being waved into the right position by Brown/Joseph.
I don't claim enough knowledge on wing play to know about (or look for) things like running lines, ball in which hand etc I would suspect it comes under right decision, minimally delayed.
ETA: oh, and checking to see if there's an airborne defender in the space he's running into
I was trying to be subtle though on the match thread; having pulled out of commenting here.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Farrell has been comical, but the Sexton/Farrell combo is a fecking hoot.
T'eo must be fuming
T'eo must be fuming
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
No mention by Barnes on how shit Farrell has been
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Not a great day for our players to be honest ... Mako was OK but Kruis and Farrell were crap.
Watson was about the only one who showed up well. Sinckler was decent when he came on.
Watson was about the only one who showed up well. Sinckler was decent when he came on.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Thought T'eo was very good. Brilliant block on SBW for the try and solid hits in defence. Only player able to bash it up and then losses out so the undroppable can stay on the parkScrumhead wrote:Not a great day for our players to be honest ... Mako was OK but Kruis and Farrell were crap.
Watson was about the only one who showed up well. Sinckler was decent when he came on.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Yeah. That's fair. Te'o was decent. Pretty much nullified SBW.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Seems a bit hyperbolic on Farrell and Kruis there. Farrell had his moments to go with the occasional break down in skills, despite a lot of pressure. Kruis seems to be a bloke everyone builds teams around.
Mako and Sinkler were good I'd say. Daly and Watson looked dangerous on attack. Te'o also pretty effective, for my money.
Mako and Sinkler were good I'd say. Daly and Watson looked dangerous on attack. Te'o also pretty effective, for my money.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
That was a dreadful substitution. Like England just pick your 10 and then T'eo at 12.p/d wrote:Farrell has been comical, but the Sexton/Farrell combo is a fecking hoot.
T'eo must be fuming
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
I'd take issue with the idea that various of our players were 'crap' tbh. This AB team, frankly, is a considerable step up to anything our players have faced....probably ever. You can be decent, or even pretty good and still be made to look stupid by them. Elliot Daly a case in point, who I don't think I've ever seen outpaced on the outside on a rugby pitch before.
Anyway, I get the reservations about our players being on Lions tours, in terms of injury and fatigue, but this particular series I think it's brilliant that our players are out there. Up close and personal with the standards needed to match the best team in the world. If you don't come away a better player from this you're an idiot.
Anyway, I get the reservations about our players being on Lions tours, in terms of injury and fatigue, but this particular series I think it's brilliant that our players are out there. Up close and personal with the standards needed to match the best team in the world. If you don't come away a better player from this you're an idiot.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Indeed. Also thought the timing of replacing George was a tad silly.....but we see it many times with a similar outcomeskidger wrote:That was a dreadful substitution. Like England just pick your 10 and then T'eo at 12.p/d wrote:Farrell has been comical, but the Sexton/Farrell combo is a fecking hoot.
T'eo must be fuming
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
To be fair we were mauled from 1 - 10 by an incredible set of players. The AB's really are a joy to watchTimbo wrote:I'd take issue with the idea that various of our players were 'crap' tbh. This AB team, frankly, is a considerable step up to anything our players have faced....probably ever. You can be decent, or even pretty good and still be made to look stupid by them. Elliot Daly a case in point, who I don't think I've ever seen outpaced on the outside on a rugby pitch before.
Anyway, I get the reservations about our players being on Lions tours, in terms of injury and fatigue, but this particular series I think it's brilliant that our players are out there. Up close and personal with the standards needed to match the best team in the world. If you don't come away a better player from this you're an idiot.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Fair point. I should stress that I thought Kruis and Farrell were crap today specifically. I expect more from both of them and I guess I'm just disappointed that they didn't front-up in the way I expected them to.Timbo wrote:I'd take issue with the idea that various of our players were 'crap' tbh. This AB team, frankly, is a considerable step up to anything our players have faced....probably ever. You can be decent, or even pretty good and still be made to look stupid by them. Elliot Daly a case in point, who I don't think I've ever seen outpaced on the outside on a rugby pitch before.
Anyway, I get the reservations about our players being on Lions tours, in terms of injury and fatigue, but this particular series I think it's brilliant that our players are out there. Up close and personal with the standards needed to match the best team in the world. If you don't come away a better player from this you're an idiot.
I agree that a good chunk of our players being on this tour/in the 23 is a real benefit. The All Blacks just showed us the standard that we're aspiring to get to and the more exposure we have to that the better.
From a temperament point of view, I love it the Sinckler comes of the bench and always makes an impact. How long before he starts pushing Dan Cole for the 3 shirt?
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Farrell was Farrell today. For all the hype from idiots like SCW and the iceman nonsense he often has some very ordinary games and give me Ford over him at 10 any day. I count myself as a Kruis fan but it was not great from him today. These are the tough choices Gatland now has to make as whether you back a very good player like Kruis to show how good he is or bring in someone else. There will be one open spot with AWJ being dropped but i would really like to see Lawes starting for the 2nd test.Scrumhead wrote:Fair point. I should stress that I thought Kruis and Farrell were crap today specifically. I expect more from both of them and I guess I'm just disappointed that they didn't front-up in the way I expected them to.Timbo wrote:I'd take issue with the idea that various of our players were 'crap' tbh. This AB team, frankly, is a considerable step up to anything our players have faced....probably ever. You can be decent, or even pretty good and still be made to look stupid by them. Elliot Daly a case in point, who I don't think I've ever seen outpaced on the outside on a rugby pitch before.
Anyway, I get the reservations about our players being on Lions tours, in terms of injury and fatigue, but this particular series I think it's brilliant that our players are out there. Up close and personal with the standards needed to match the best team in the world. If you don't come away a better player from this you're an idiot.
I agree that a good chunk of our players being on this tour/in the 23 is a real benefit. The All Blacks just showed us the standard that we're aspiring to get to and the more exposure we have to that the better.
From a temperament point of view, I love it the Sinckler comes of the bench and always makes an impact. How long before he starts pushing Dan Cole for the 3 shirt?
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Teo does need to look outside him, but he went well.p/d wrote:Thought T'eo was very good. Brilliant block on SBW for the try and solid hits in defence. Only player able to bash it up and then losses out so the undroppable can stay on the parkScrumhead wrote:Not a great day for our players to be honest ... Mako was OK but Kruis and Farrell were crap.
Watson was about the only one who showed up well. Sinckler was decent when he came on.
Mako, George, Sinckler, Itoje went ok; Kruis had a poor day with the ball but ran the lineout brilliantly (then Owens came on ). Daly was a mixed bag- as which predicted, he wandered a bit in defence.....but his wing outside break (:)) was great for the try. I thought Watson looked good and dangerous, shame he tried a miracle pass. Farrell....was Farrell, its his normal game, just not a good look when you lose.
Not sure where the Lions can go- too much to fix at the breakdown imo; eliminate the soft turnovers, keep up the lineout and don't overdo the kicks (NZ had great possession stat simply because we kept on giving it back)....and maybe can hold them. And the ABs simply have more players of the highest class.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Banquo wrote:Teo does need to look outside him, but he went well.p/d wrote:Thought T'eo was very good. Brilliant block on SBW for the try and solid hits in defence. Only player able to bash it up and then losses out so the undroppable can stay on the parkScrumhead wrote:Not a great day for our players to be honest ... Mako was OK but Kruis and Farrell were crap.
Watson was about the only one who showed up well. Sinckler was decent when he came on.
Mako, George, Sinckler, Itoje went ok; Kruis had a poor day with the ball but ran the lineout brilliantly (then Owens came on ). Daly was a mixed bag- as which predicted, he wandered a bit in defence.....but his wing outside break (:)) was great for the try. I thought Watson looked good and dangerous, shame he tried a miracle pass. Farrell....was Farrell, its his normal game, just not a good look when you lose.
Not sure where the Lions can go- too much to fix at the breakdown imo; eliminate the soft turnovers, keep up the lineout and don't overdo the kicks (NZ had great possession stat simply because we kept on giving it back)....and maybe can hold them. And the ABs simply have more players of the highest class.
Fair comments all. Not Kruis's best day with the ball but tackle count will be high.
I actually thought Farrell dreadful today.. (The best Barnes could muster was suggesting a restart was good when in truth it was too long and gave the ABs an easy out). His defence was poor and some of his passes were schoolboy dire.
Backrow generally looked out of its depth (could have done with Billy carries), captain uninspiring and replacement even less so.
Strangely enough our centre pairing looks more than adequate and thought Williams showed he is a FB ......cannot wait to see Watson there for England.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
I don't know where the Lions can go given the twin aims of Gatball and the Farrell inspired rush defence. Maybe shunt SOB to 8 and bring in Warbs or Tips, or even both. They'd maybe consider Stander to try and win some collisions. And Lawes would add an edge to the defence plays they're likely to continue making.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Faletau was strangely anonymous, really rate him. Would have been interesting to see Billy out there.Digby wrote:I don't know where the Lions can go given the twin aims of Gatball and the Farrell inspired rush defence. Maybe shunt SOB to 8 and bring in Warbs or Tips, or even both. They'd maybe consider Stander to try and win some collisions. And Lawes would add an edge to the defence plays they're likely to continue making.
Breakdown is a big issue, and can't see that changing overly. Stopping the offload at the tackle line. Keeping up the pressure at the lineout and stop with the easy turnovers. Not much then
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
I think that game was BAU for Faz tbh.p/d wrote:Banquo wrote:Teo does need to look outside him, but he went well.p/d wrote: Thought T'eo was very good. Brilliant block on SBW for the try and solid hits in defence. Only player able to bash it up and then losses out so the undroppable can stay on the park
Mako, George, Sinckler, Itoje went ok; Kruis had a poor day with the ball but ran the lineout brilliantly (then Owens came on ). Daly was a mixed bag- as which predicted, he wandered a bit in defence.....but his wing outside break (:)) was great for the try. I thought Watson looked good and dangerous, shame he tried a miracle pass. Farrell....was Farrell, its his normal game, just not a good look when you lose.
Not sure where the Lions can go- too much to fix at the breakdown imo; eliminate the soft turnovers, keep up the lineout and don't overdo the kicks (NZ had great possession stat simply because we kept on giving it back)....and maybe can hold them. And the ABs simply have more players of the highest class.
Fair comments all. Not Kruis's best day with the ball but tackle count will be high.
I actually thought Farrell dreadful today.. (The best Barnes could muster was suggesting a restart was good when in truth it was too long and gave the ABs an easy out). His defence was poor and some of his passes were schoolboy dire.
Backrow generally looked out of its depth (could have done with Billy carries), captain uninspiring and replacement even less so.
Strangely enough our centre pairing looks more than adequate and thought Williams showed he is a FB ......cannot wait to see Watson there for England.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
I'm still inclined to think absent of Billy they might have picked Moriarty. It's just much harder to run looking for offloads when the carrier gets knocked back - actually AWJ is the one we might have looked to in that pack to win some collisions and he never really got stuck into them, so maybe Lawes comes in for Jones. And I agree they'll have to look at Faletau, even if like you I'm a big fan of hisBanquo wrote:Faletau was strangely anonymous, really rate him. Would have been interesting to see Billy out there.Digby wrote:I don't know where the Lions can go given the twin aims of Gatball and the Farrell inspired rush defence. Maybe shunt SOB to 8 and bring in Warbs or Tips, or even both. They'd maybe consider Stander to try and win some collisions. And Lawes would add an edge to the defence plays they're likely to continue making.
Breakdown is a big issue, and can't see that changing overly. Stopping the offload at the tackle line. Keeping up the pressure at the lineout and stop with the easy turnovers. Not much then
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
Overall Lions had their moments but the NZ attacking game asks so many questions that one never felt the Lions could hold them out. SOB's try was great, though. Odd to reflect that where we thought we would really be bettered - centre and back 3 - we looked OK, yet our much vaunted pack really didnt step up at all.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
The Lions comprehensively lost the breakdown battle, but Peyper let the AB's go straight off their feet in almost every ruck.Banquo wrote:Faletau was strangely anonymous, really rate him. Would have been interesting to see Billy out there.Digby wrote:I don't know where the Lions can go given the twin aims of Gatball and the Farrell inspired rush defence. Maybe shunt SOB to 8 and bring in Warbs or Tips, or even both. They'd maybe consider Stander to try and win some collisions. And Lawes would add an edge to the defence plays they're likely to continue making.
Breakdown is a big issue, and can't see that changing overly. Stopping the offload at the tackle line. Keeping up the pressure at the lineout and stop with the easy turnovers. Not much then
That said, I couldn't believe how poor we were at supporting the ball carrier. I lost count of the amount of times players went on their own and got turned-over or pinged for holding on. It was truly schoolboy stuff in that regard.
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Re: EPS Watch / Player Form Thread
I thought Faletau was decent though ...