England vs Argentina

[Banquo]

But we didn’t really try to attack … and that’s mostly because it would have been dumb to do so in the circumstances.

I’m not saying our attack is any good. More that we did exactly the right thing with 14.

And England did, and they did it well, but it was hardly backs to the wall stuff until the very last minute. Argentina offered so little that you almost wonder if they think the easier route to progress is to finish second in the group.

Of course, that’s the obvious answer;)

[Margin_Walker]

I’ve been a big sceptic but fair play Lawes had arguably his best game as a test back row in this match. Earl is a curates egg, mightily industrious but better on the flank than at No.8 at this level. Jack Willis will be needed in the mix more than ever now and I would be tempted to start Ludlam at 8 going forwards.

Ludlam was pretty poor when he came on, and he’s only started at 8 five times in his senior career. Earl- kicking aside- was more than ok.

He was busy tbf

[Banquo]

I’ve been a big sceptic but fair play Lawes had arguably his best game as a test back row in this match. Earl is a curates egg, mightily industrious but better on the flank than at No.8 at this level. Jack Willis will be needed in the mix more than ever now and I would be tempted to start Ludlam at 8 going forwards.

Ludlam was pretty poor when he came on, and he’s only started at 8 five times in his senior career. Earl- kicking aside- was more than ok.

He was busy tbf

Yep but he missed two straight off the bat, Busy doesn’t always equal good- he missed his very first allowing Argentina over the gainline and the only sustained pressure of the second half. I noticed it because I’ve been impressed by his improvement so it was annnoying. It was in this goal line stand where he made all those close in tackles or assisted tackles.

[pompey-zebra]

But we didn’t really try to attack … and that’s mostly because it would have been dumb to do so in the circumstances.

I’m not saying our attack is any good. More that we did exactly the right thing with 14.

And England did, and they did it well, but it was hardly backs to the wall stuff until the very last minute. Argentina offered so little that you almost wonder if they think the easier route to progress is to finish second in the group.

Of course, that’s the obvious answer;)

It's not, but it was still a bizarrely insipid performance by the pumas.

[Danno]

And England did, and they did it well, but it was hardly backs to the wall stuff until the very last minute. Argentina offered so little that you almost wonder if they think the easier route to progress is to finish second in the group.

Of course, that’s the obvious answer;)

It's not, but it was still a bizarrely insipid performance by the pumas.

Quite. When Lavanini leaves the field voluntarily you know something is up

[Beasties]

Classic bit of Dallaglio punditry - 'I can't remember a bigger game than this'. You literally played in a WC final mate.

Just came back on to the forum having watched the match and this made me lol. Fantastic player. But a proper numpty.

[16th man]

Ludlam was pretty poor when he came on, and he’s only started at 8 five times in his senior career. Earl- kicking aside- was more than ok.

He was busy tbf

Yep but he missed two straight off the bat, Busy doesn’t always equal good- he missed his very first allowing Argentina over the gainline and the only sustained pressure of the second half. I noticed it because I’ve been impressed by his improvement so it was annnoying. It was in this goal line stand where he made all those close in tackles or assisted tackles.

So coming cold off the bench, into an incredibly intense defensive performance, coping with being a man down, he made a couple of mistakes before picking up the pace of the game?

Shoot him.

[16th man]

I think I owe Earl a bit of an apology.

I've spent the last fortnight holding him up as the perfect Gym Monkey, who has been asked to come and play as he is staked and can run a bit.

He actually put in a fantastic shift as a makeshift 8, with some good pick and carries off the base of the scrum. Whilst doing that he also put in some big shots, and made some turnovers.

Yes his kicking was shit, bit that was obviously team orders.

[Danno]

I think I owe Earl a bit of an apology.

I've spent the last fortnight holding him up as the perfect Gym Monkey, who has been asked to come and play as he is staked and can run a bit.

He actually put in a fantastic shift as a makeshift 8, with some good pick and carries off the base of the scrum. Whilst doing that he also put in some big shots, and made some turnovers.

Yes his kicking was shit, bit that was obviously team orders.

He was shooting out of the defensive line hard and leaving massive gaps early on as well, which is a worry for the future. But yeah he was almost worth the shirt today.

[Beasties]

Lawes and Itoje have had great games.

Cometh the hour?

[Beasties]

I’m just in shock that the Eng players have worked out the WC has actually started and got their fingers out. Unrecognisable and with 14 men.

Arg made it look like it was one of those games where the opposition are just so good that there’s no way they are going to win. Not the case here though so they need to have a word with themselves. Long time since I’ve seen a ref give so many decisions to England. But mostly correct, which makes a nice change. Ford-Tuilagi-Marchant looked like a test combination awhile. I’m choosing to go to bed thinking SB is a fan of Ford. Tomorrow I can face reality. But I’ve got tonight….

[Danno]

Farrell is back next week.

There's an entire sitcom about this

[Danno]

But I'm not sure the enthusiasm ever surfaced

[fivepointer]

Thought that was a very professional performance from us. Kept our discipline and composure, played the percentages, worked our nuts off, hit hard in defence and made comparatively few errors. Several players shone - Itoje, Lawes, Earl up front, both centres and of course Ford.
We were helped by Argentina being inexplicably poor but no matter. The win was hard earned and was exactly what we needed.
Pressure should be off now and hopefully we'll see this team develop in the games ahead.

[FKAS]

I’m just in shock that the Eng players have worked out the WC has actually started and got their fingers out. Unrecognisable and with 14 men.

Arg made it look like it was one of those games where the opposition are just so good that there’s no way they are going to win. Not the case here though so they need to have a word with themselves. Long time since I’ve seen a ref give so many decisions to England. But mostly correct, which makes a nice change. Ford-Tuilagi-Marchant looked like a test combination awhile. I’m choosing to go to bed thinking SB is a fan of Ford. Tomorrow I can face reality. But I’ve got tonight….

Borthwick had Ford in for a training week during the 6N when he wasn't fit because he wanted him integrated with the squad. Borthwick is a fan and Ford was a constant figure for him at Tigers (when available). I'm just hoping he sees the light and that Cpt Farrell is a liability and Ford is the pragmatic game manager the side needs currently.

Knowing our luck with head coaches it'll no doubt be Ford at 10 and Farrell at 12. Farrell getting red carded in the knock out stages.

[Beasties]

Thought that was a very professional performance from us. Kept our discipline and composure, played the percentages, worked our nuts off, hit hard in defence and made comparatively few errors. Several players shone - Itoje, Lawes, Earl up front, both centres and of course Ford.
We were helped by Argentina being inexplicably poor but no matter. The win was hard earned and was exactly what we needed.
Pressure should be off now and hopefully we'll see this team develop in the games ahead.

As above, I thought Mitchell went well. Looking forward to the bizarre Sunday paper ratings.

[Oakboy]

Has there been any mention of a referee in camp? How many lessons will have to be learned before our players avoid head contact? Debating red/yellow matters not a jot. The fact is that camera coverage always catches the incidents. To have players continue to err after one red card is disappointing, but a 2nd and a 3rd? The coaches need to sort it out especially now that we've got this vital win.

Players excelled in diversity and points were made by several that I doubted. Provided that SB does not cock things up from here, our potential ceiling for the tournament just got raised.

[Oakboy]

Thought that was a very professional performance from us. Kept our discipline and composure, played the percentages, worked our nuts off, hit hard in defence and made comparatively few errors. Several players shone - Itoje, Lawes, Earl up front, both centres and of course Ford.
We were helped by Argentina being inexplicably poor but no matter. The win was hard earned and was exactly what we needed.
Pressure should be off now and hopefully we'll see this team develop in the games ahead.

As above, I thought Mitchell went well. Looking forward to the bizarre Sunday paper ratings.

It's funny you mention that. Itoje only got a 6 in the Telegraph. Whoever awarded that was watching a different game to the one I saw.

[16th man]

[float=]

. Long time since I’ve seen a ref give so many decisions to England. .

Watching in the pub we came to the conclusion that he'd realised that the bunker had screwed us on the Argie yellow and was making up for it.

[canta_brian]

I’m just in shock that the Eng players have worked out the WC has actually started and got their fingers out. Unrecognisable and with 14 men.

Arg made it look like it was one of those games where the opposition are just so good that there’s no way they are going to win. Not the case here though so they need to have a word with themselves. Long time since I’ve seen a ref give so many decisions to England. But mostly correct, which makes a nice change. Ford-Tuilagi-Marchant looked like a test combination awhile. I’m choosing to go to bed thinking SB is a fan of Ford. Tomorrow I can face reality. But I’ve got tonight….

Borthwick had Ford in for a training week during the 6N when he wasn't fit because he wanted him integrated with the squad. Borthwick is a fan and Ford was a constant figure for him at Tigers (when available). I'm just hoping he sees the light and that Cpt Farrell is a liability and Ford is the pragmatic game manager the side needs currently.

Knowing our luck with head coaches it'll no doubt be Ford at 10 and Farrell at 12. Farrell getting red carded in the knock out stages.

I’m thinking Farrell has a very different understanding of what the “knockout stages” means.

[FKAS]

[float=]

. Long time since I’ve seen a ref give so many decisions to England. .

Watching in the pub we came to the conclusion that he'd realised that the bunker had screwed us on the Argie yellow and was making up for it.

I got the impression he knew Curry was going to get red and thought it was unlucky so was a bit sympathetic to us. Argentina getting frustrated quite quickly only helped us as well.

[francoisfou]

After last night’s game, Shining Balls must know that Ford/Tuilagi /Marchant should be inked in for the big games coming up and pick Captain Farrell for the lesser opposition? It’d be a travesty if Ford were to make way for him come the knockout stages and we certainly don’t want to see him at 12.

[Banquo]

And England did, and they did it well, but it was hardly backs to the wall stuff until the very last minute. Argentina offered so little that you almost wonder if they think the easier route to progress is to finish second in the group.

Of course, that’s the obvious answer;)

It's not, but it was still a bizarrely insipid performance by the pumas.

Yes, but you have to give us a bit of credit for that- they maybe thought we’d be a soft touch.

[Banquo]

He was busy tbf

Yep but he missed two straight off the bat, Busy doesn’t always equal good- he missed his very first allowing Argentina over the gainline and the only sustained pressure of the second half. I noticed it because I’ve been impressed by his improvement so it was annnoying. It was in this goal line stand where he made all those close in tackles or assisted tackles.

So coming cold off the bench, into an incredibly intense defensive performance, coping with being a man down, he made a couple of mistakes before picking up the pace of the game?

Shoot him.

Hardly what I said- annoying was the word. My main point (which you maybe didn’t read) was that I didn’t see why he should come in at number 8 mainly because he’s hardly played there. Tbh as well, it’s intl rugby and the bench does have to be ready straight up. As I said, I like him as a player, but it was a ropy start from him.

[Adam_P]

Thought that was a very professional performance from us. Kept our discipline and composure, played the percentages, worked our nuts off, hit hard in defence and made comparatively few errors. Several players shone - Itoje, Lawes, Earl up front, both centres and of course Ford.
We were helped by Argentina being inexplicably poor but no matter. The win was hard earned and was exactly what we needed.
Pressure should be off now and hopefully we'll see this team develop in the games ahead.

As above, I thought Mitchell went well. Looking forward to the bizarre Sunday paper ratings.

I imagine Ford was grateful not having to pluck a ball from his laces or above his head for the drop goals, as he would if Youngs was playing