Well, two things have happened today. Firstly I've realised what I thought I knew about this part of American history, I didn't, so I've been down a bit if a rabbit hole after you posted this, so - genuinely - thanks.
I wouldn't call it "tragic."Stom wrote: ↑Tue Dec 31, 2024 10:02 amThe thing is...you're putting system and societal failure on the same level as the individual action. Because put simply, all those murders are bad. They're all tragic. But they're all different because 1) highlights a societal failure that caused a tragic incident. 2) highlights a system failure that caused a tragic accident. 3) was a tragic murder TO HIGHLIGHT a system failure.cashead wrote: ↑Tue Dec 31, 2024 9:40 amThe shooting of Brian Thompson is the result of a predatory for-profit healthcare system, which Thompson himself not only benefited from greatly - at huge cost to other, less fortunate people, fucking with them at their most desperate. Thompson, as CEO of UnitedHealthcare can go get doubly fucked, when they were also industry leaders in claims denials.
It's an inevitable reaction to a cunt that made a career out of profiting from misery and misfortune. Ken Klippenstein put it nicely:
"No shit murder is bad. The [commentary and jokes] about the United CEO aren’t really about him; they’re about the rapacious healthcare system he personified and which Americans feel deep pain and humiliation about."
You're the one being a scold at the general reaction of Thompson being shot, and your performative pearl clutching completely misses the point.
Some trans kid getting stabbed to shit by their peers? That's tragic.
Some black lady getting shot by cops because "sleeping at home while black?" That's tragic, and ACAB 4LIFE.
But some CEO of a health insurer that leads the industry in claims denials? Fucking lol.
Why do you think one might be considered different from others.
You're free to continue to pretend to be appalled at the murder, clutch at every last pearl on the planet. Meanwhile, the rest of us are also free to look at the death of a CEO and respond with "lol, and might I add, lmao."
So, yes, they are all murders. But when you get past that, they're not the same thing at all. So our reaction to them is less to do with the murder itself and more to do with the injustice of the system/society that was highlighted by the deaths. And I think separating that out is important.
I think any murder is tragic, tbh.cashead wrote: ↑Tue Dec 31, 2024 7:58 pmI wouldn't call it "tragic."Stom wrote: ↑Tue Dec 31, 2024 10:02 amThe thing is...you're putting system and societal failure on the same level as the individual action. Because put simply, all those murders are bad. They're all tragic. But they're all different because 1) highlights a societal failure that caused a tragic incident. 2) highlights a system failure that caused a tragic accident. 3) was a tragic murder TO HIGHLIGHT a system failure.cashead wrote: ↑Tue Dec 31, 2024 9:40 am
The shooting of Brian Thompson is the result of a predatory for-profit healthcare system, which Thompson himself not only benefited from greatly - at huge cost to other, less fortunate people, fucking with them at their most desperate. Thompson, as CEO of UnitedHealthcare can go get doubly fucked, when they were also industry leaders in claims denials.
It's an inevitable reaction to a cunt that made a career out of profiting from misery and misfortune. Ken Klippenstein put it nicely:
"No shit murder is bad. The [commentary and jokes] about the United CEO aren’t really about him; they’re about the rapacious healthcare system he personified and which Americans feel deep pain and humiliation about."
You're the one being a scold at the general reaction of Thompson being shot, and your performative pearl clutching completely misses the point.
Some trans kid getting stabbed to shit by their peers? That's tragic.
Some black lady getting shot by cops because "sleeping at home while black?" That's tragic, and ACAB 4LIFE.
But some CEO of a health insurer that leads the industry in claims denials? Fucking lol.
Why do you think one might be considered different from others.
You're free to continue to pretend to be appalled at the murder, clutch at every last pearl on the planet. Meanwhile, the rest of us are also free to look at the death of a CEO and respond with "lol, and might I add, lmao."
So, yes, they are all murders. But when you get past that, they're not the same thing at all. So our reaction to them is less to do with the murder itself and more to do with the injustice of the system/society that was highlighted by the deaths. And I think separating that out is important.
Glad to've given you an edifying end to the year!Donny osmond wrote: ↑Tue Dec 31, 2024 6:01 pmWell, two things have happened today. Firstly I've realised what I thought I knew about this part of American history, I didn't, so I've been down a bit if a rabbit hole after you posted this, so - genuinely - thanks.
2ndly, more darkly, after reading just a couple of the sentencing remarks from the Rotherham rape gang trial, I've moved closer to the view that murder might be understandable in certain cases.
Fascist checklist:Sandydragon wrote: ↑Tue Jan 07, 2025 10:25 pm Awesome news. Not even taken office yet, and the orange idiot is threatening to declare war on a NATO member. Trump has decided that the US needs to control Greenland for national security. Oh, and the Panama Canal as well. It makes Musk's antics of asking X followers if the US should invade the UK to liberate us seem slightly minor by comparison.
I hope this is more hot air that isn't followed through. But you sense that the broader administration will be more compliant this time, so some of this craziness will be looked at seriously.
1. The cult of tradition. “One has only to look at the syllabus of every fascist movement to find the major traditionalist thinkers. The Nazi gnosis was nourished by traditionalist, syncretistic, occult elements.”Son of Mathonwy wrote: ↑Wed Jan 08, 2025 9:43 amFascist checklist:Sandydragon wrote: ↑Tue Jan 07, 2025 10:25 pm Awesome news. Not even taken office yet, and the orange idiot is threatening to declare war on a NATO member. Trump has decided that the US needs to control Greenland for national security. Oh, and the Panama Canal as well. It makes Musk's antics of asking X followers if the US should invade the UK to liberate us seem slightly minor by comparison.
I hope this is more hot air that isn't followed through. But you sense that the broader administration will be more compliant this time, so some of this craziness will be looked at seriously.
Promise the return to a mythical age of greatness,
Scapegoat minorities,
Expand territory,
etc......
Amazing. Does Trump (and the other neo-fascists) do this deliberately or is it pure instinct, arising from his narcissism and total contempt for ordinary people?cashead wrote: ↑Wed Jan 08, 2025 9:35 pm1. The cult of tradition. “One has only to look at the syllabus of every fascist movement to find the major traditionalist thinkers. The Nazi gnosis was nourished by traditionalist, syncretistic, occult elements.”Son of Mathonwy wrote: ↑Wed Jan 08, 2025 9:43 amFascist checklist:Sandydragon wrote: ↑Tue Jan 07, 2025 10:25 pm Awesome news. Not even taken office yet, and the orange idiot is threatening to declare war on a NATO member. Trump has decided that the US needs to control Greenland for national security. Oh, and the Panama Canal as well. It makes Musk's antics of asking X followers if the US should invade the UK to liberate us seem slightly minor by comparison.
I hope this is more hot air that isn't followed through. But you sense that the broader administration will be more compliant this time, so some of this craziness will be looked at seriously.
Promise the return to a mythical age of greatness,
Scapegoat minorities,
Expand territory,
etc......
2. The rejection of modernism. “The Enlightenment, the Age of Reason, is seen as the beginning of modern depravity. In this sense Ur-Fascism can be defined as irrationalism.”
3. The cult of action for action’s sake. “Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, any previous reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation.”
4. Disagreement is treason. “The critical spirit makes distinctions, and to distinguish is a sign of modernism. In modern culture the scientific community praises disagreement as a way to improve knowledge.”
5. Fear of difference. “The first appeal of a fascist or prematurely fascist movement is an appeal against the intruders. Thus Ur-Fascism is racist by definition.”
6. Appeal to social frustration. “One of the most typical features of the historical fascism was the appeal to a frustrated middle class, a class suffering from an economic crisis or feelings of political humiliation, and frightened by the pressure of lower social groups.”
7. The obsession with a plot. “Thus at the root of the Ur-Fascist psychology there is the obsession with a plot, possibly an international one. The followers must feel besieged.”
8. The enemy is both strong and weak. “By a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.”
9. Pacifism is trafficking with the enemy. “For Ur-Fascism there is no struggle for life but, rather, life is lived for struggle.”
10. Contempt for the weak. “Elitism is a typical aspect of any reactionary ideology.”
11. Everybody is educated to become a hero. “In Ur-Fascist ideology, heroism is the norm. This cult of heroism is strictly linked with the cult of death.”
12. Machismo and weaponry. “Machismo implies both disdain for women and intolerance and condemnation of nonstandard sexual habits, from chastity to homosexuality.”
13. Selective populism. “There is in our future a TV or Internet populism, in which the emotional response of a selected group of citizens can be presented and accepted as the Voice of the People.”
14. Ur-Fascism speaks Newspeak. “All the Nazi or Fascist schoolbooks made use of an impoverished vocabulary, and an elementary syntax, in order to limit the instruments for complex and critical reasoning.”
A combination of the stupidity of the electorate and the stupidity of the Democratics.
Fascist.
An oldy, but a goody.Son of Mathonwy wrote: ↑Thu Jan 09, 2025 3:20 pmA combination of the stupidity of the electorate and the stupidity of the Democratics.
Good point well made.
