RugbyRebels

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:07 pm**

It's back to the old FFS days where Farrell is the only 10 who's ever allowed to play with an actual 12.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:09 pm**

Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:06 pm Interesting it wasn't Slade at 12 after all.

Was it ever going to be?

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:11 pm**

FKAS wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:07 pm Decent side. There was some good stuff last weekend but the midfield was a serious issue. Jack Willis finally getting another start (just his second?) looking forward to seeing what he can do.

Isiekwe is a lucky boy to still be making the bench, as is Mako.

I understand Mako has been retained solely for coming on and man marking the Italian 15

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:22 pm**

Big chance for Lawrence but he does have to move inside one. I may be wrong but i dont think he's ever started at 12? Fascinating to see how he goes.
Willis starting is fine by me. Isiekwe ahead of Ribbans is simply unfathomable. Mako fortunate.
Credit to SB for addressing the key selection issues at 10-12-13. Whether this combination has legs we'll have to see.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:28 pm**

ad_tigger wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:07 pm It's back to the old FFS days where Farrell is the only 10 who's ever allowed to play with an actual 12.

Wait - who's the "actual 12"?

fivepointer wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:22 pm Big chance for Lawrence but he does have to move inside one. I may be wrong but i dont think he's ever started at 12? Fascinating to see how he goes.
Willis starting is fine by me. Isiekwe ahead of Ribbans is simply unfathomable. Mako fortunate.
Credit to SB for addressing the key selection issues at 10-12-13. Whether this combination has legs we'll have to see.

This'll be his 7th start at IC - IIRC he's played there more for England than at club level.

I suspect we'll see a lot of swapping between 12 & 13, and even 10 & 13 on occasion.

Mako and Isiekwe seem rather lucky to still be there.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:29 pm**

fivepointer wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:22 pm Big chance for Lawrence but he does have to move inside one. I may be wrong but i dont think he's ever started at 12? Fascinating to see how he goes.
Willis starting is fine by me. Isiekwe ahead of Ribbans is simply unfathomable. Mako fortunate.
Credit to SB for addressing the key selection issues at 10-12-13. Whether this combination has legs we'll have to see.

The only downside will be how early in the game replacements see Farrell shift back out one

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:45 pm**

Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:06 pm I hope we're in a position to give Walker, Isiekwe and Mitchell enough time that we can really judge them, and that centre pairing as many minutes as possible. Interesting it wasn't Slade at 12 after all.

I feel comfortable judging Isiekwe after watching him in excruciating detail recently. I judged him a lot.

Puja

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:50 pm**

Jack Willis!! So happy for the lad. Finally.

I’m actually starting to look forward to Eng team selections again.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:53 pm**

p/d wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:29 pm
fivepointer wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:22 pm Big chance for Lawrence but he does have to move inside one. I may be wrong but i dont think he's ever started at 12? Fascinating to see how he goes.
Willis starting is fine by me. Isiekwe ahead of Ribbans is simply unfathomable. Mako fortunate.
Credit to SB for addressing the key selection issues at 10-12-13. Whether this combination has legs we'll have to see.
The only downside will be how early in the game replacements see Farrell shift back out one

Have this coaching crew got the collective bottle to NOT do that if Slade and Lawrence are both playing well? Why not let them do the 80 and make a decision to let Farrell stay on OR take him off for Smith? SB & Co are starting from scratch so there is nothing to stop them making decisions on what they see. In fact, the more I think about it the more I believe that the best interest of the team would be served by NOT having Smith on the bench. It would make a statement if Marchant was there instead. In the unlikely event that Farrell could not do the 80 Malins or Slade could do the FH job.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:03 pm**

Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:53 pm
p/d wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:29 pm
fivepointer wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:22 pm Big chance for Lawrence but he does have to move inside one. I may be wrong but i dont think he's ever started at 12? Fascinating to see how he goes.
Willis starting is fine by me. Isiekwe ahead of Ribbans is simply unfathomable. Mako fortunate.
Credit to SB for addressing the key selection issues at 10-12-13. Whether this combination has legs we'll have to see.
The only downside will be how early in the game replacements see Farrell shift back out one
Have this coaching crew got the collective bottle to NOT do that if Slade and Lawrence are both playing well? Why not let them do the 80 and make a decision to let Farrell stay on OR take him off for Smith? SB & Co are starting from scratch so there is nothing to stop them making decisions on what they see. In fact, the more I think about it the more I believe that the best interest of the team would be served by NOT having Smith on the bench. It would make a statement if Marchant was there instead. In the unlikely event that Farrell could not do the 80 Malins or Slade could do the FH job.

I would be exceedingly nervous about either Slade or Malins playing 10 if Farrell went down injured or got red carded in the first minute.

You are right though that Smith should be coming on as a direct sub for Farrell. Whether it'll happen? Eh.

Puja

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:03 pm**

Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:53 pm I believe that the best interest of the team would be served by NOT having Smith on the bench.

Which team, Italy or England?

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:07 pm**

Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:03 pm
Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:53 pm I believe that the best interest of the team would be served by NOT having Smith on the bench.
Which team, Italy or England?

You think we will benefit from Farrell moving to 12 in the 60th minute?

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:11 pm**

Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:07 pm
Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:03 pm
Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:53 pm I believe that the best interest of the team would be served by NOT having Smith on the bench.
Which team, Italy or England?
You think we will benefit from Farrell moving to 12 in the 60th minute?

Probably not but Lawrence has suddenly become a very good player even when playing out of position. Farrell not moving to 12 can be avoided whilst having a flyhalf on the bench.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:13 pm**

Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:11 pm
Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:07 pm
Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:03 pm

Which team, Italy or England?
You think we will benefit from Farrell moving to 12 in the 60th minute?
Probably not but Lawrence has suddenly become a very good player even when playing out of position.

Tsch! He's no Dan Kelly. Barely even brushes 6ft9.

Puja

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:15 pm**

Puja wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 1:27 pm
stepsider wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 12:59 pm just confirmed by DT, Smith on bench.
I will note that the team announcement isn't until 3pm, so while it's very likely to be the case considering the amount of leaks, "confirmed" is a pretty strong word.

Puja

"Marcus Smith will be dropped for England's Six Nations clash with Italy on Sunday with captain Owen Farrell to be handed the fly-half position", said the DT's Gavin Mairs at 12.03 today.

Sounds pretty strong to me. But maybe more important - why is the England management's security so leaky, or is it deliberate policy to tip off journalists these days? (Rather like politicians who announce policy changes by leaking to MSM beforehand).

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:21 pm**

Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:11 pm
Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:07 pm
Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:03 pm

Which team, Italy or England?
You think we will benefit from Farrell moving to 12 in the 60th minute?
Probably not but Lawrence has suddenly become a very good player even when playing out of position. Farrell not moving to 12 can be avoided whilst having a flyhalf on the bench.

I hope you are right but I'd guess P/D will be. IF Farrell is always going to play 80 leave him at 10 and cover the centres from the bench is all I'm suggesting.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:28 pm**

Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:21 pm
Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:11 pm
Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:07 pm

You think we will benefit from Farrell moving to 12 in the 60th minute?
Probably not but Lawrence has suddenly become a very good player even when playing out of position. Farrell not moving to 12 can be avoided whilst having a flyhalf on the bench.
I hope you are right but I'd guess P/D will be. IF Farrell is always going to play 80 leave him at 10 and cover the centres from the bench is all I'm suggesting.

The sensible thing is to not have Farrell (or anyone) as above being replaced. You’re treating the symptom and not the cause. Given it’s a new regime, we have no evidence that he is now above being replaced.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:32 pm**

Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:28 pm
Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:21 pm
Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:11 pm
Probably not but Lawrence has suddenly become a very good player even when playing out of position. Farrell not moving to 12 can be avoided whilst having a flyhalf on the bench.
I hope you are right but I'd guess P/D will be. IF Farrell is always going to play 80 leave him at 10 and cover the centres from the bench is all I'm suggesting.
The sensible thing is to not have Farrell (or anyone) as above being replaced. You’re treating the symptom and not the cause. Given it’s a new regime, we have no evidence that he is now above being replaced.

Quite. That's what I said in the first place but will it happen?

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:37 pm**

Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:32 pm
Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:28 pm
Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:21 pm

I hope you are right but I'd guess P/D will be. IF Farrell is always going to play 80 leave him at 10 and cover the centres from the bench is all I'm suggesting.
The sensible thing is to not have Farrell (or anyone) as above being replaced. You’re treating the symptom and not the cause. Given it’s a new regime, we have no evidence that he is now above being replaced.
Quite. That's what I said in the first place but will it happen?

Must have misunderstood. I read it that you thought the best thing for the team was to not select Smith on the bench rather than replacing Farrell when the game demanded it.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:41 pm**

Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:21 pm
Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:11 pm
Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:07 pm

You think we will benefit from Farrell moving to 12 in the 60th minute?
Probably not but Lawrence has suddenly become a very good player even when playing out of position. Farrell not moving to 12 can be avoided whilst having a flyhalf on the bench.
I hope you are right but I'd guess P/D will be.

how do ya like them apples Mells. ..........

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:43 pm**

Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:37 pm
Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:32 pm
Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:28 pm
The sensible thing is to not have Farrell (or anyone) as above being replaced. You’re treating the symptom and not the cause. Given it’s a new regime, we have no evidence that he is now above being replaced.
Quite. That's what I said in the first place but will it happen?
Must have misunderstood. I read it that you thought the best thing for the team was to not select Smith on the bench rather than replacing Farrell when the game demanded it.

You read it right Mells, don't let him off the hook. He never did like Smith.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:45 pm**

Which Tyler wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:28 pm
ad_tigger wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:07 pm It's back to the old FFS days where Farrell is the only 10 who's ever allowed to play with an actual 12.
Wait - who's the "actual 12"?

Sorry, I got ahead of myself, I meant 'actual centre'

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:47 pm**

If Farrell has another 'off' day with place kicking, or is prevented from kicking by injury or yellow/red cards, who takes over?

Presumably Slade?

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:58 pm**

Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:28 pm
Oakboy wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:21 pm
Mellsblue wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:11 pm
Probably not but Lawrence has suddenly become a very good player even when playing out of position. Farrell not moving to 12 can be avoided whilst having a flyhalf on the bench.
I hope you are right but I'd guess P/D will be. IF Farrell is always going to play 80 leave him at 10 and cover the centres from the bench is all I'm suggesting.
The sensible thing is to not have Farrell (or anyone) as above being replaced. You’re treating the symptom and not the cause. Given it’s a new regime, we have no evidence that he is now above being replaced.

This has been a long running issue. Farrell as captain makes it less likely he'll come off even if he's not playing well.
Would be interesting to see just how many times he's been subbed during his England career. I bet it can't be more than half a dozen.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2023 5:42 pm**

Which Tyler wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:28 pm
ad_tigger wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:07 pm It's back to the old FFS days where Farrell is the only 10 who's ever allowed to play with an actual 12.
Wait - who's the "actual 12"?
fivepointer wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 3:22 pm Big chance for Lawrence but he does have to move inside one. I may be wrong but i dont think he's ever started at 12? Fascinating to see how he goes.
Willis starting is fine by me. Isiekwe ahead of Ribbans is simply unfathomable. Mako fortunate.
Credit to SB for addressing the key selection issues at 10-12-13. Whether this combination has legs we'll have to see.
This'll be his 7th start at IC - IIRC he's played there more for England than at club level.

I suspect we'll see a lot of swapping between 12 & 13, and even 10 & 13 on occasion.

Mako and Isiekwe seem rather lucky to still be there.

Yep- in fairness, Slade does a lot of switching at Exeter, but defensive positioning will be interesting.

Interesting that the big change is in midfield...yet the culpable and pants one retains his place.

Pleased for willis. Isiekwe selection is comedy tbh.

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