England V NZ

[Banquo]

25 retained

Mako Vunipola,Genge
LCD, George
Sinckler, Stuart
Itoje, Ribbans, Hill, Coles
Willis, Simmonds, Curry, Billy Vunipola

JVP, Youngs
Smith
May, Freeman
Farrell, Slade, Manu, Porter
Nowell
Steward

[Tom Moore]

Cokanasiga evidently broke a mirror with a black cat at some stage, unfeasibly bad luck with injuries.

[Peej]

A rather miraculous recovery for Stuart. Which two drop out? My money's on Willis and Freeman

[Scrumhead]

I dunno …

I’d expect one of Coles or Ribbans to drop out. Porter or Freeman in the backs, but I think Freeman is the better bench option.

[francoisfou]

If Willis makes the bench, I hope he’ll get at least 30 minutes game time.

[fivepointer]

Bit of a risk with Stuart i'd say. Hasnt played for a number of weeks and he comes straight back into the 23. Big Joe very unlucky. Hope Freeman is retained but i fear he and Coles will miss out.

This and SA next week are the big ones. No disrespect to Argentina and Japan but the next 2 games will really tell us where we are.

[Timbo]

We all know Nowell will play, but would be quite excited if Freeman and May were the wings. Shame about big Joe, feel like this period for Bath and England is the best & fittest he’s looked since 2019. Hope it’s just a niggle.

[p/d]

If 'Big Joe' made half the impact that Van Der Merwe makes for Scotland then, yes, I would view him as unlucky. The thing is he doesn't.

Freeman must be retained Nowell/Porter and Coles to drop out.

[Spiffy]

If 'Big Joe' made half the impact that Van Der Merwe makes for Scotland then, yes, I would view him as unlucky. The thing is he doesn't.

Freeman must be retained Nowell/Porter and Coles to drop out.

Agree. Big Joe is overall a bit disappointing given his physical attributes. I suppose he is a good bet to score if he gets the ball at close range to the goal line, but he's not all that fast and maybe a bit short of footballing skills.

[Timbo]

I think Cokanasiga has had 2 good games personally. Defended well, strong in the air, no mistakes, carried hard, made a couple of breaks, scored a try, set up a try. I think NZ and most teams would find him a handful.

[p/d]

Really? Not doubting your view but I thought he was poor in the air nor did he make much impact through traffic (often felled by the first defender) as I would expect for someone with those attributes. As such I would take a quick’ un or better footballer for top tier match ups.

[p/d]

If 'Big Joe' made half the impact that Van Der Merwe makes for Scotland then, yes, I would view him as unlucky. The thing is he doesn't.

Freeman must be retained Nowell/Porter and Coles to drop out.

Agree. Big Joe is overall a bit disappointing given his physical attributes. I suppose he is a good bet to score if he gets the ball at close range to the goal line, but he's not all that fast and maybe a bit short of footballing skills.

I just don’t see him as better than other available options …… and yet, there is Jack in the Box

[p/d]

I dunno …

I’d expect one of Coles or Ribbans to drop out. Porter or Freeman in the backs, but I think Freeman is the better bench option.

We have to assume Manu will start, so surely Jones won’t put Porter on the bench

[FKAS]

I'm hoping for something like this from Eddie;

Genge, George, Sinckler
Hill, Itoje
Willis, Vunipola, Curry
JVP, Smith
Farrell, Manu
May, Steward, Freeman

LCD, Mako, Stuart, Coles, Simmonds, Youngs, Slade, Porter

That would of course require Eddie to acknowledge we don't need a lock sized blindside for every game. Coles offers good lines in attack, ditto Simmonds. I don't think this will be a game decided before the final quarter and having that impact will help and obviously Two Try Guy is there as well. Some pace on both wings with both good under the high ball is going to be key for this one as well.

[Mikey Brown]

Is Freeman good in the air? I know he plays fullback too but I just haven’t seen him tested much.

[FKAS]

Is Freeman good in the air? I know he plays fullback too but I just haven’t seen him tested much.

Very. He's a big lad as well.

[Mikey Brown]

Well yeah but I’ve seen Cokanasiga (huge, athletic, great handling) under a high ball. I’ve seen Tim Visser etc.

I’m not disputing he is, it just feels like as a skill it gets oddly attributed to being tall sometimes, when it seems to not have that much to do with it.

[Puja]

I'm hoping for something like this from Eddie;

Genge, George, Sinckler
Hill, Itoje
Willis, Vunipola, Curry
JVP, Smith
Farrell, Manu
May, Steward, Freeman

LCD, Mako, Stuart, Coles, Simmonds, Youngs, Slade, Porter

That would of course require Eddie to acknowledge we don't need a lock sized blindside for every game. Coles offers good lines in attack, ditto Simmonds. I don't think this will be a game decided before the final quarter and having that impact will help and obviously Two Try Guy is there as well. Some pace on both wings with both good under the high ball is going to be key for this one as well.

Guardian reckons Itoje will go back to lock, but only to make room for Simmonds and BillyV to play in the same back row. Not entirely sure how Eddie looks at JWillis and doesn't see him as one of the first names on the teamsheet.

Puja

[Beasties]

Eddie innit. I just feel so sorry for the lad given the last few years of injuries and then Wasps ending.

[Scrumhead]

Well yeah but I’ve seen Cokanasiga (huge, athletic, great handling) under a high ball. I’ve seen Tim Visser etc.

I’m not disputing he is, it just feels like as a skill it gets oddly attributed to being tall sometimes, when it seems to not have that much to do with it.

Freeman is primarily a fullback who Saints are playing on the wing to have Furbank as a second playmaker at 15.

He’s good under the high ball and is a better all round player than Cokanasiga IMO. Had he been fit sooner, I think he probably would have started vs. Argentina after a good summer down under.

[Scrumhead]

I'm hoping for something like this from Eddie;

Genge, George, Sinckler
Hill, Itoje
Willis, Vunipola, Curry
JVP, Smith
Farrell, Manu
May, Steward, Freeman

LCD, Mako, Stuart, Coles, Simmonds, Youngs, Slade, Porter

That would of course require Eddie to acknowledge we don't need a lock sized blindside for every game. Coles offers good lines in attack, ditto Simmonds. I don't think this will be a game decided before the final quarter and having that impact will help and obviously Two Try Guy is there as well. Some pace on both wings with both good under the high ball is going to be key for this one as well.

Guardian reckons Itoje will go back to lock, but only to make room for Simmonds and BillyV to play in the same back row. Not entirely sure how Eddie looks at JWillis and doesn't see him as one of the first names on the teamsheet.

Puja

Me neither. If Lawes was fit, I could understand him being in at 6 and captain. Since he’s not, the obvious option was to play Curry and Willis in tandem (doesn’t matter who wears 6 or 7).

With NZ struggling at the breakdown vs. Scotland, I’d like to think Willis is at least in contention to start. I doubt he will though.

It would be harsh to drop Simmonds after last weekend, but if we’re looking at ‘horses for courses’, I’m really not sure playing him as a flanker is the way to go.

[Banquo]

Well yeah but I’ve seen Cokanasiga (huge, athletic, great handling) under a high ball. I’ve seen Tim Visser etc.

I’m not disputing he is, it just feels like as a skill it gets oddly attributed to being tall sometimes, when it seems to not have that much to do with it.

Freeman is primarily a fullback who Saints are playing on the wing to have Furbank as a second playmaker at 15.

He’s good under the high ball and is a better all round player than Cokanasiga IMO. Had he been fit sooner, I think he probably would have started vs. Argentina after a good summer down under.

Yes, he's been good under the high ball at both 14 and 15 when he has played there for Saints. Not sure Furbank does much as a second playmaker though, he mostly is used orthodoxly in the wider channels on back play- he does step in to play 10 a fair bit when there are injuries; they use him at 14 and Furbank at 15 just so they can get their best backs out.

He's a very different player to Coka- and I'm not sire why coka is getting so much flak a- playing outside a much criticised midfield (10/12 and oft 13), b- big contribution v Argentina, 100+yards, good try, solid defence, and a decent game v Japan (good kick chase, mainly, as we did a lot of kicking). He's had a good AI series imo.

[Oakboy]

I'm hoping for something like this from Eddie;

Genge, George, Sinckler
Hill, Itoje
Willis, Vunipola, Curry
JVP, Smith
Farrell, Manu
May, Steward, Freeman

LCD, Mako, Stuart, Coles, Simmonds, Youngs, Slade, Porter

That would of course require Eddie to acknowledge we don't need a lock sized blindside for every game. Coles offers good lines in attack, ditto Simmonds. I don't think this will be a game decided before the final quarter and having that impact will help and obviously Two Try Guy is there as well. Some pace on both wings with both good under the high ball is going to be key for this one as well.

Guardian reckons Itoje will go back to lock, but only to make room for Simmonds and BillyV to play in the same back row. Not entirely sure how Eddie looks at JWillis and doesn't see him as one of the first names on the teamsheet.

Puja

Me neither. If Lawes was fit, I could understand him being in at 6 and captain. Since he’s not, the obvious option was to play Curry and Willis in tandem (doesn’t matter who wears 6 or 7).

With NZ struggling at the breakdown vs. Scotland, I’d like to think Willis is at least in contention to start. I doubt he will though.

It would be harsh to drop Simmonds after last weekend, but if we’re looking at ‘horses for courses’, I’m really not sure playing him as a flanker is the way to go.

I'd start Simmonds at 8. Billy V coughing up the ball to NZ could cost us dearly. I think Curry, Willis, Simmonds is the back row that NZ would least like to face. If they could choose it would be Itoje, Curry, Billy.

[FKAS]

Well yeah but I’ve seen Cokanasiga (huge, athletic, great handling) under a high ball. I’ve seen Tim Visser etc.

I’m not disputing he is, it just feels like as a skill it gets oddly attributed to being tall sometimes, when it seems to not have that much to do with it.

Freeman is primarily a fullback who Saints are playing on the wing to have Furbank as a second playmaker at 15.

He’s good under the high ball and is a better all round player than Cokanasiga IMO. Had he been fit sooner, I think he probably would have started vs. Argentina after a good summer down under.

Yes, he's been good under the high ball at both 14 and 15 when he has played there for Saints. Not sure Furbank does much as a second playmaker though, he mostly is used orthodoxly in the wider channels on back play- he does step in to play 10 a fair bit when there are injuries; they use him at 14 and Furbank at 15 just so they can get their best backs out.

He's a very different player to Coka- and I'm not sire why coka is getting so much flak a- playing outside a much criticised midfield (10/12 and oft 13), b- big contribution v Argentina, 100+yards, good try, solid defence, and a decent game v Japan (good kick chase, mainly, as we did a lot of kicking). He's had a good AI series imo.

14 tries in 21 appearances last season as well (all competitions). Knows his way to the try line.

[Banquo]

Freeman is primarily a fullback who Saints are playing on the wing to have Furbank as a second playmaker at 15.

He’s good under the high ball and is a better all round player than Cokanasiga IMO. Had he been fit sooner, I think he probably would have started vs. Argentina after a good summer down under.

Yes, he's been good under the high ball at both 14 and 15 when he has played there for Saints. Not sure Furbank does much as a second playmaker though, he mostly is used orthodoxly in the wider channels on back play- he does step in to play 10 a fair bit when there are injuries; they use him at 14 and Furbank at 15 just so they can get their best backs out.

He's a very different player to Coka- and I'm not sire why coka is getting so much flak a- playing outside a much criticised midfield (10/12 and oft 13), b- big contribution v Argentina, 100+yards, good try, solid defence, and a decent game v Japan (good kick chase, mainly, as we did a lot of kicking). He's had a good AI series imo.

14 tries in 21 appearances last season as well (all competitions). Knows his way to the try line.

Aye- unsure as to why he's getting stick- think he's made a decent enough comeback from a long stint away to be in the mix, and should be ahead of say no-chase Jack