PGP

[Banquo]

https://www.englandrugby.com/follow/new ... -published

[Which Tyler]

TY.
I'll have a read when I have a little time

[Mellsblue]

Depressing read as the fan of a Championship clu… sorry, Championship/Tier 2 club.
Anyone got any ideas as to why ‘there is currently a major gap in competitiveness and playing budgets between the Gallagher Premiership and Championship clubs and the financial requirements needed to compete in the Premiership’?

[Puja]

Depressing read as the fan of a Championship clu… sorry, Championship/Tier 2 club.
Anyone got any ideas as to why ‘there is currently a major gap in competitiveness and playing budgets between the Gallagher Premiership and Championship clubs and the financial requirements needed to compete in the Premiership’?

Frankly, I think it's because you haven't been trying hard enough.

Puja

[Mellsblue]

Depressing read as the fan of a Championship clu… sorry, Championship/Tier 2 club.
Anyone got any ideas as to why ‘there is currently a major gap in competitiveness and playing budgets between the Gallagher Premiership and Championship clubs and the financial requirements needed to compete in the Premiership’?

Frankly, I think it's because you haven't been trying hard enough.

Puja

It does seem the only logical answer.

[fivepointer]

Some positive things.

trying to get the Pro game aligned is welcome, financial oversight is well overdue, the pathways look sensible, expanding the u20s and committing to more A games, and England having control over their key players seems pretty sound.

[Mellsblue]

Some positive things.

trying to get the Pro game aligned is welcome, financial oversight is well overdue, the pathways look sensible, expanding the u20s and committing to more A games, and England having control over their key players seems pretty sound.

Seems being the key word. Devil being in the detail and implementation, eg rumours the RFU can’t actually afford to award all of the central contracts.

[Puja]

Telegraph doing a good bit of analysis on the changes to the academy structures and catchment areas: https://archive.ph/tynN5



It looks a lot fairer and saner split than previously, even if there's having to be some interesting gerrymandering to give Bristol enough space, and there's still some anomalies like Colchester parents having to drive their children 5.5 hours round trip to Northampton training, rather than the 3 hours to Saracens.

Puja

[Banquo]

Telegraph doing a good bit of analysis on the changes to the academy structures and catchment areas: https://archive.ph/tynN5



It looks a lot fairer and saner split than previously, even if there's having to be some interesting gerrymandering to give Bristol enough space, and there's still some anomalies like Colchester parents having to drive their children 5.5 hours round trip to Northampton training, rather than the 3 hours to Saracens.

Puja

Be interesting to overlay catchment sizes and actual rugby schools as well.....

[Banquo]

Some positive things.

trying to get the Pro game aligned is welcome, financial oversight is well overdue, the pathways look sensible, expanding the u20s and committing to more A games, and England having control over their key players seems pretty sound.

agreed, not sure they know what they are looking at, yes, yes, maybe and yes.

[Puja]

Telegraph doing a good bit of analysis on the changes to the academy structures and catchment areas: https://archive.ph/tynN5

It looks a lot fairer and saner split than previously, even if there's having to be some interesting gerrymandering to give Bristol enough space, and there's still some anomalies like Colchester parents having to drive their children 5.5 hours round trip to Northampton training, rather than the 3 hours to Saracens.

Puja

Be interesting to overlay catchment sizes and actual rugby schools as well.....

The RFU trying to claim that clubs that put more effort into their catchment areas reap greater rewards is a bit comedic when you look at the great transfer of talent from state to private scholarship at 6th form level.

Spotting a few more difficulties for parents based on that map - a parent in Slough could get to Harlequins in 35 minutes, but now has to take their 15 year old over 2 hours to get to Bath. I don't know what the answer is though.

Gods help us should the nightmare scenario happen and some Championship club dare to get promoted.

Puja

[FKAS]

Telegraph doing a good bit of analysis on the changes to the academy structures and catchment areas: https://archive.ph/tynN5

It looks a lot fairer and saner split than previously, even if there's having to be some interesting gerrymandering to give Bristol enough space, and there's still some anomalies like Colchester parents having to drive their children 5.5 hours round trip to Northampton training, rather than the 3 hours to Saracens.

Puja

Be interesting to overlay catchment sizes and actual rugby schools as well.....

The RFU trying to claim that clubs that put more effort into their catchment areas reap greater rewards is a bit comedic when you look at the great transfer of talent from state to private scholarship at 6th form level.

Spotting a few more difficulties for parents based on that map - a parent in Slough could get to Harlequins in 35 minutes, but now has to take their 15 year old over 2 hours to get to Bath. I don't know what the answer is though.

Gods help us should the nightmare scenario happen and some Championship club dare to get promoted.

Puja

You'd hope it would be Doncaster so you could give them the area currently marked as Prem Rugby and encourage them to grow their academy.

Ealing would cause issues.

As usual it's a case of which schools you get rather than the geographic area.

[Epaminondas Pules]

Telegraph doing a good bit of analysis on the changes to the academy structures and catchment areas: https://archive.ph/tynN5

It looks a lot fairer and saner split than previously, even if there's having to be some interesting gerrymandering to give Bristol enough space, and there's still some anomalies like Colchester parents having to drive their children 5.5 hours round trip to Northampton training, rather than the 3 hours to Saracens.

Puja

Be interesting to overlay catchment sizes and actual rugby schools as well.....

The RFU trying to claim that clubs that put more effort into their catchment areas reap greater rewards is a bit comedic when you look at the great transfer of talent from state to private scholarship at 6th form level.

Spotting a few more difficulties for parents based on that map - a parent in Slough could get to Harlequins in 35 minutes, but now has to take their 15 year old over 2 hours to get to Bath. I don't know what the answer is though.

Gods help us should the nightmare scenario happen and some Championship club dare to get promoted.

Puja

The majority of that stays pretty local / within catchment. For example, here lads at Lichfield will be offered places at Brooksby. They streamline them into feeder schools from state schools, where there are feeders. Round London(ish) area there's more choice so they don't have to. And like it or not, they do have the best facilities, coaches and buy in from the school. The investment in catchment boils down to community club and schools engagement, which is a mixed old bag. My eldest goes to a school in Worcester's old catchment, and Tigers reached out a good while ago to start dialogue with the school coaches.

But the local community clubs will essentially lose any promising players from Colts as they're not allowed to play, focussing more on school rugby and DPP.

[Banquo]

Be interesting to overlay catchment sizes and actual rugby schools as well.....

The RFU trying to claim that clubs that put more effort into their catchment areas reap greater rewards is a bit comedic when you look at the great transfer of talent from state to private scholarship at 6th form level.

Spotting a few more difficulties for parents based on that map - a parent in Slough could get to Harlequins in 35 minutes, but now has to take their 15 year old over 2 hours to get to Bath. I don't know what the answer is though.

Gods help us should the nightmare scenario happen and some Championship club dare to get promoted.

Puja

You'd hope it would be Doncaster so you could give them the area currently marked as Prem Rugby and encourage them to grow their academy.

Ealing would cause issues.

As usual it's a case of which schools you get rather than the geographic area.

unless they've recruited a shed load unlikely- Coventry are the ones to watch imo. And yes, the point about schools i made earlier re overlaying the clubs academy areas.

[FKAS]

Be interesting to overlay catchment sizes and actual rugby schools as well.....

The RFU trying to claim that clubs that put more effort into their catchment areas reap greater rewards is a bit comedic when you look at the great transfer of talent from state to private scholarship at 6th form level.

Spotting a few more difficulties for parents based on that map - a parent in Slough could get to Harlequins in 35 minutes, but now has to take their 15 year old over 2 hours to get to Bath. I don't know what the answer is though.

Gods help us should the nightmare scenario happen and some Championship club dare to get promoted.

Puja

The majority of that stays pretty local / within catchment. For example, here lads at Lichfield will be offered places at Brooksby. They streamline them into feeder schools from state schools, where there are feeders. Round London(ish) area there's more choice so they don't have to. And like it or not, they do have the best facilities, coaches and buy in from the school. The investment in catchment boils down to community club and schools engagement, which is a mixed old bag. My eldest goes to a school in Worcester's old catchment, and Tigers reached out a good while ago to start dialogue with the school coaches.

But the local community clubs will essentially lose any promising players from Colts as they're not allowed to play, focussing more on school rugby and DPP.

Yeah Tigers have been partnered with Brooksby for a while now. It's an agricultural college in Melton. Lots of room for pitches, boarding options and is part of an academy with other sites that offers various courses. Allows Tigers almost a finishing school leading into the academy though plenty still attend elsewhere.

Not been there in a long time but used to be a nice campus.

[Oakboy]

Some positive things.

trying to get the Pro game aligned is welcome, financial oversight is well overdue, the pathways look sensible, expanding the u20s and committing to more A games, and England having control over their key players seems pretty sound.

Seems being the key word. Devil being in the detail and implementation, eg rumours the RFU can’t actually afford to award all of the central contracts.

I read that Borthwick is considering 15 rather than 25. His choice or budgetary?

[Banquo]

Some positive things.

trying to get the Pro game aligned is welcome, financial oversight is well overdue, the pathways look sensible, expanding the u20s and committing to more A games, and England having control over their key players seems pretty sound.

Seems being the key word. Devil being in the detail and implementation, eg rumours the RFU can’t actually afford to award all of the central contracts.

I read that Borthwick is considering 15 rather than 25. His choice or budgetary?

yes

[Mellsblue]

Some positive things.

trying to get the Pro game aligned is welcome, financial oversight is well overdue, the pathways look sensible, expanding the u20s and committing to more A games, and England having control over their key players seems pretty sound.

Seems being the key word. Devil being in the detail and implementation, eg rumours the RFU can’t actually afford to award all of the central contracts.

I read that Borthwick is considering 15 rather than 25. His choice or budgetary?

I’d seen a couple of sources a few weeks ago that said budgetary.

[FKAS]

Is it also a good idea to hold back a few deals as otherwise chopping and changing every 12 months could leave players in tough positions. Keeping a few contracts back to potentially tempt player back from France might also work, Joe Marchant is out of contract next summer for starters.

[Puja]

Is it also a good idea to hold back a few deals as otherwise chopping and changing every 12 months could leave players in tough positions. Keeping a few contracts back to potentially tempt player back from France might also work, Joe Marchant is out of contract next summer for starters.

Good point. I'm actually in favour of them having a bit of scarcity and value rather than just being automatically doled out to the first 25.

Puja

[CunningPunter]

Gods help us should the nightmare scenario happen and some Championship club dare to get promoted.

Puja

Well they've reduced the chance of that by making the aspirant play the bottom club twice.

[Mellsblue]

Worth seeing how many they actually award but they’ve paid handsomely for the central(ish) contracts so to only use 60% wastes an awful lot of money. I’m also not sure about needing that much wiggle room to change - just like RWC squads, HC’s will have more than 15 squad certainties.
As for scarcity, then 25 is scarce enough surely.

[Mellsblue]

As for the academy boundaries, why do we think they’ll cede any territory to a Championship/Tier 2 club who aren’t a PR member?

[Margin_Walker]

Yeah, a Championship club would have to get promoted, stick around, produce a decent chunk of cash and jump through a lot of hoops before they ever got given an academy.

[Puja]

Worth seeing how many they actually award but they’ve paid handsomely for the central(ish) contracts so to only use 60% wastes an awful lot of money. I’m also not sure about needing that much wiggle room to change - just like RWC squads, HC’s will have more than 15 squad certainties.
As for scarcity, then 25 is scarce enough surely.

Every contract is going have to be a player who is a guarantee for the next 2-3 season though, isn't it? Are there 25 who we can guarantee will be fixtures in 3 years' time? Apart from anything else, Dan Cole and Will Stuart are currently squad certainties, but I'm hoping they won't be in a couple of years. And wouldn't it make sense to hold back contracts and leave room for players who will break through and may require a contract going forwards - who would've given a central contract to Feyi-Waboso in 2023, for example? It'd be sensible to hold some back in case we need to keep that kind of bolter out of the clutches of the Top 14, or in case JWillis makes noises about wanting to come back, etc.

Puja