England Squad for the AIs

[Stom]

Squad is up on the Quins site...

Forwards

Fin Baxter (Harlequins, 2 caps)
Ollie Chessum (Leicester Tigers, 23 caps)
Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers, 115 caps)
Luke Cowan-Dickie (Sale Sharks, 41 caps)
Chandler Cunningham-South (Harlequins, 7 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 53 caps)
Theo Dan (Saracens, 14 caps)
Trevor Davison (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins, 17 caps)
Ben Earl (Saracens, 33 caps)
Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 31 caps)
Ellis Genge (Bristol Bears, 62 caps)
Jamie George (Saracens, 93 caps)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens, 11 caps)
Maro Itoje (Saracens, 84 caps)
Joe Marler (Harlequins, 95 caps)
George Martin (Leicester Tigers, 15 caps)
Will Stuart (Bath Rugby, 41 caps)
Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby, 38 caps)

Backs

Elliot Daly (Saracens, 69 caps)
Immanuel Feyi-Waboso (Exeter Chiefs, 6 caps)
Tommy Freeman (Northampton Saints, 11 caps)
George Furbank (Northampton Saints, 11 caps)
Ollie Lawrence (Bath Rugby, 27 caps)
Alex Lozowski (Saracens, 5 caps)
Luke Northmore (Harlequins, 2 caps)
Harry Randall (Bristol Bears, 7 caps)
Tom Roebuck (Sale Sharks, 1 cap)
Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 65 caps)
Ollie Sleightholme (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
Fin Smith (Northampton Saints, 5 caps)
Marcus Smith (Harlequins, 35 caps)
Ben Spencer (Bath Rugby, 6 caps)
Freddie Steward (Leicester Tigers, 34 caps)
Jack van Poortvliet (Leicester Tigers, 14 caps)

Rehabilitation: George Ford (Sale Sharks) Not considered for selection: Alex Coles (Northampton Saints),Joe Cokanasiga (Bath Rugby), Fraser Dingwall (Northampton Saints), Alex Mitchell (Northampton Saints), Will Muir (Bath Rugby), Max Ojomoh (Bath Rugby), Raffi Quirke (Sale Sharks), Bevan Rodd (Sale Sharks)

[Stom]

Some good, some bad.

Some...interesting.

[Puja]

Some good, some bad.

Some...interesting.

Thought it deserved its own thread.

Puja

[Stom]

Some good, some bad.

Some...interesting.

Thought it deserved its own thread.

Puja

Sure, it does.

However, it's not posted elsewhere, which is interesting...

[Puja]

Forwards

Fin Baxter (Harlequins, 2 caps)
Ellis Genge (Bristol Bears, 62 caps)
Joe Marler (Harlequins, 95 caps)

Jamie George (Saracens, 93 caps)
Theo Dan (Saracens, 14 caps)
Luke Cowan-Dickie (Sale Sharks, 41 caps)

Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers, 115 caps)
Will Stuart (Bath Rugby, 41 caps)
Trevor Davison (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)

Ollie Chessum (Leicester Tigers, 23 caps)
Maro Itoje (Saracens, 84 caps)
George Martin (Leicester Tigers, 15 caps)
Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 31 caps)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens, 11 caps)

Chandler Cunningham-South (Harlequins, 7 caps)
Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby, 38 caps)
Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 53 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Ben Earl (Saracens, 33 caps)
Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins, 17 caps)


Backs

Ben Spencer (Bath Rugby, 6 caps)
Harry Randall (Bristol Bears, 7 caps)
Jack van Poortvliet (Leicester Tigers, 14 caps)

Marcus Smith (Harlequins, 35 caps)
Fin Smith (Northampton Saints, 5 caps)
Ford? - down as rehabilitation and expected to start training again next week.

Ollie Lawrence (Bath Rugby, 27 caps)
Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 65 caps)
Alex Lozowski (Saracens, 5 caps)
Luke Northmore (Harlequins, 2 caps)

Immanuel Feyi-Waboso (Exeter Chiefs, 6 caps)
Tommy Freeman (Northampton Saints, 11 caps)
Ollie Sleightholme (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
Tom Roebuck (Sale Sharks, 1 cap)
Elliot Daly (Saracens, 69 caps)

George Furbank (Northampton Saints, 11 caps)
Freddie Steward (Leicester Tigers, 34 caps)

[Puja]

Some good, some bad.

Some...interesting.

Thought it deserved its own thread.

Puja

Sure, it does.

However, it's not posted elsewhere, which is interesting...

Now on a few other sites - looks like Quins just jumped the gun by a few minutes.

The most "interesting" decisions are Dombrandt over TWillis, which I'm fairly certain few on here will be happy with, and keeping Ewels in, presumably with the plan of him providing another 7 minutes of impact. Other than that, seems relatively uncontroversial, given how little time there's been for bolters to step up.

Puja

[Mikey Brown]

I thought Slade, Northmore and Dombrandt were injured?

Some pretty uninspiring selections in there but still a largely decent bunch of players I guess. It's always tempting to imagine a worst case scenario of a team with Ewels, Isiekwe, Spencer, Daly, but probably not very constructive.

Still not worth even having an actual 12 as an apprentice I guess.

[Epaminondas Pules]

I really do not get some of that!

[Banquo]

I really do not get some of that!

which bits.....I'm going for


Luke Cowan-Dickie (Sale Sharks, 41 caps)
Trevor Davison (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 31 caps)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens, 11 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Ben Spencer (Bath Rugby, 6 caps)

and....though who else...

Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 65 caps)
Alex Lozowski (Saracens, 5 caps)
Luke Northmore (Harlequins, 2 caps)

[FKAS]

Davison over Heyes is an odd one. In fact Cole over Heyes on current form.

Daly returning to the squad is very disappointing he's just no longer required. We've got plenty of exciting wingers and three wingers all settled into the squad that are ahead of him for selection.

Rushing back Marler, Slade, Dombrandt and Northmore doesn't make much sense. Obano, TWillis and then looking at some new centres would have made sense as Lozowski could offer the Slade style centre.

[Banquo]

Davison over Heyes is an odd one. In fact Cole over Heyes on current form.

Daly returning to the squad is very disappointing he's just no longer required. We've got plenty of exciting wingers and three wingers all settled into the squad that are ahead of him for selection.

Rushing back Marler, Slade, Dombrandt and Northmore doesn't make much sense. Obano, TWillis and then looking at some new centres would have made sense as Lozowski could offer the Slade style centre.

d'accord, (Daly is a triumph of hope/form over reality). Midfield and prop really could do with a roll of the dice on some young talent. Isiekwe is lucky, just a mediocre player, if versatile.

[FKAS]

Davison over Heyes is an odd one. In fact Cole over Heyes on current form.

Daly returning to the squad is very disappointing he's just no longer required. We've got plenty of exciting wingers and three wingers all settled into the squad that are ahead of him for selection.

Rushing back Marler, Slade, Dombrandt and Northmore doesn't make much sense. Obano, TWillis and then looking at some new centres would have made sense as Lozowski could offer the Slade style centre.

d'accord, (Daly is a triumph of hope/form over reality). Midfield and prop really could do with a roll of the dice on some young talent. Isiekwe is lucky, just a mediocre player, if versatile.

Given the form of some of the young talent it's not a massive roll of the dice either.

I'd have liked to have seen;

Obano>Marler
Heyes>Davison
Beard>Daly
Willis/Barbeary>Dombrandt

Also Seb Atkinson>Northmore but that's more hope than any real expectation.

[Banquo]

Davison over Heyes is an odd one. In fact Cole over Heyes on current form.

Daly returning to the squad is very disappointing he's just no longer required. We've got plenty of exciting wingers and three wingers all settled into the squad that are ahead of him for selection.

Rushing back Marler, Slade, Dombrandt and Northmore doesn't make much sense. Obano, TWillis and then looking at some new centres would have made sense as Lozowski could offer the Slade style centre.

d'accord, (Daly is a triumph of hope/form over reality). Midfield and prop really could do with a roll of the dice on some young talent. Isiekwe is lucky, just a mediocre player, if versatile.

Given the form of some of the young talent it's not a massive roll of the dice either.

I'd have liked to have seen;

Obano>Marler
Heyes>Davison
Beard>Daly
Willis/Barbeary>Dombrandt

Also Seb Atkinson>Northmore but that's more hope than any real expectation.

them, and an apprentice style role of the dice too. Its not like there isn't a host of young talent about.

[Puja]

I really do not get some of that!

which bits.....I'm going for


Luke Cowan-Dickie (Sale Sharks, 41 caps)
Trevor Davison (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 31 caps)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens, 11 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Ben Spencer (Bath Rugby, 6 caps)

and....though who else...

Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 65 caps)
Alex Lozowski (Saracens, 5 caps)
Luke Northmore (Harlequins, 2 caps)

I will defend Cowan-Dickie - he has been on fire for Sale and looks right back to his best. A fit and in form LCD is definitely worth his place in the squad, especially as Dan still can't get ahead of George to get significant minutes for Saracens.

Ben Curry's a good player and has been good for Sale for a long time - I'd've preferred Pepper, but hard to make a case for his callup on the basis of 2.5 games for Bath.

I'd've preferred to see Butt/Anyanwu/SAtkinson instead of Northmore, who strikes me as the Isiekwe of the backline - lots to like in terms of attributes, but never going to be a realistic first choice international.

Puja

[fivepointer]

I suppose the warning signs were there with the training squad.

This is a highly unimaginative, ultra conservative squad that rewards no young player and offers little encouragement.

Tight head prop is a disaster area. One guy who is showing clear signs of going over the hill and another who frankly doesnt look up to it. Heyes form has been good and he should have been selected. How Willis misses out is quite mad. No Pearson, Hill or Fisilau but the luxury of 3 opensides and an injured Dombrandt. If Isiekwe is a better player than Batley then i must be watching a different game to the selectors.

No inside centre - natch. Northmore and Slade included who are crocked. Daly given another go despite doing nothing for England for a very long time.

Underwhelmed? You betcha.

[Banquo]

By the way...why no Ted Hill, he's been tremendous and has genuine differential talent.

[Banquo]

I really do not get some of that!

which bits.....I'm going for


Luke Cowan-Dickie (Sale Sharks, 41 caps)
Trevor Davison (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 31 caps)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens, 11 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Ben Spencer (Bath Rugby, 6 caps)

and....though who else...

Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 65 caps)
Alex Lozowski (Saracens, 5 caps)
Luke Northmore (Harlequins, 2 caps)

I will defend Cowan-Dickie - he has been on fire for Sale and looks right back to his best. A fit and in form LCD is definitely worth his place in the squad, especially as Dan still can't get ahead of George to get significant minutes for Saracens.

Ben Curry's a good player and has been good for Sale for a long time - I'd've preferred Pepper, but hard to make a case for his callup on the basis of 2.5 games for Bath.

I'd've preferred to see Butt/Anyanwu/SAtkinson instead of Northmore, who strikes me as the Isiekwe of the backline - lots to like in terms of attributes, but never going to be a realistic first choice international.

Puja

Langdon is imo a better bet. LCD is 31 and a knock away from done. Ben Curry offers not much point of difference to other 7's in the squad- better to look at say...., Ted Hill- offers a genuine 6 capability, Pearson- offers a harder carry, and although maybe premature, Pollock- in the squad would be a laugh.

[Puja]

which bits.....I'm going for


Luke Cowan-Dickie (Sale Sharks, 41 caps)
Trevor Davison (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 31 caps)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens, 11 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Ben Spencer (Bath Rugby, 6 caps)

and....though who else...

Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 65 caps)
Alex Lozowski (Saracens, 5 caps)
Luke Northmore (Harlequins, 2 caps)

I will defend Cowan-Dickie - he has been on fire for Sale and looks right back to his best. A fit and in form LCD is definitely worth his place in the squad, especially as Dan still can't get ahead of George to get significant minutes for Saracens.

Ben Curry's a good player and has been good for Sale for a long time - I'd've preferred Pepper, but hard to make a case for his callup on the basis of 2.5 games for Bath.

I'd've preferred to see Butt/Anyanwu/SAtkinson instead of Northmore, who strikes me as the Isiekwe of the backline - lots to like in terms of attributes, but never going to be a realistic first choice international.

Puja

Langdon is imo a better bet. LCD is 31 and a knock away from done. Ben Curry offers not much point of difference to other 7's in the squad- better to look at say...., Ted Hill- offers a genuine 6 capability, Pearson- offers a harder carry, and although maybe premature, Pollock- in the squad would be a laugh.

31's a decent age for a hooker and LCD hasn't been out with injury since the start of last season IIRC. He's had a full pre-season and looks back to his best - if peak!LCD is available, then I'd be picking him to start, let alone be in the squad.

Puja

[FKAS]

d'accord, (Daly is a triumph of hope/form over reality). Midfield and prop really could do with a roll of the dice on some young talent. Isiekwe is lucky, just a mediocre player, if versatile.

Given the form of some of the young talent it's not a massive roll of the dice either.

I'd have liked to have seen;

Obano>Marler
Heyes>Davison
Beard>Daly
Willis/Barbeary>Dombrandt

Also Seb Atkinson>Northmore but that's more hope than any real expectation.

them, and an apprentice style role of the dice too. Its not like there isn't a host of young talent about.

With the A side playing this Autumn that squad will have the youngsters that would have otherwise been apprentices.

[Oakboy]

It saddens me to see those 6 backrowers. Only two, CCS and Earl, should be picked ahead of Willis, IMO.

The stodginess of the squad selection generally is a real cause for concern. To move on from recent narrow defeats requires spark/edge, not uninspirational grind from same/old. Are we just expecting to improve radically by defensive tweaks?

Yes, there is a half-decent XV within the 36 but it seems as if a chance has been missed to add new zest to the squad as a whole.

[Banquo]

Given the form of some of the young talent it's not a massive roll of the dice either.

I'd have liked to have seen;

Obano>Marler
Heyes>Davison
Beard>Daly
Willis/Barbeary>Dombrandt

Also Seb Atkinson>Northmore but that's more hope than any real expectation.

them, and an apprentice style role of the dice too. Its not like there isn't a host of young talent about.

With the A side playing this Autumn that squad will have the youngsters that would have otherwise been apprentices.

good point, but no harm getting them in the camp

[Banquo]

I will defend Cowan-Dickie - he has been on fire for Sale and looks right back to his best. A fit and in form LCD is definitely worth his place in the squad, especially as Dan still can't get ahead of George to get significant minutes for Saracens.

Ben Curry's a good player and has been good for Sale for a long time - I'd've preferred Pepper, but hard to make a case for his callup on the basis of 2.5 games for Bath.

I'd've preferred to see Butt/Anyanwu/SAtkinson instead of Northmore, who strikes me as the Isiekwe of the backline - lots to like in terms of attributes, but never going to be a realistic first choice international.

Puja

Langdon is imo a better bet. LCD is 31 and a knock away from done. Ben Curry offers not much point of difference to other 7's in the squad- better to look at say...., Ted Hill- offers a genuine 6 capability, Pearson- offers a harder carry, and although maybe premature, Pollock- in the squad would be a laugh.

31's a decent age for a hooker and LCD hasn't been out with injury since the start of last season IIRC. He's had a full pre-season and looks back to his best - if peak!LCD is available, then I'd be picking him to start, let alone be in the squad.

Puja

we all have our own opinions

[Epaminondas Pules]

I really do not get some of that!

which bits.....I'm going for


Luke Cowan-Dickie (Sale Sharks, 41 caps)
Trevor Davison (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 31 caps)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens, 11 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Ben Spencer (Bath Rugby, 6 caps)

and....though who else...

Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 65 caps)
Alex Lozowski (Saracens, 5 caps)
Luke Northmore (Harlequins, 2 caps)

Add Dombrandt. Take out Curry

I like LCD but he's a way off his top form.

[Banquo]

I really do not get some of that!

which bits.....I'm going for


Luke Cowan-Dickie (Sale Sharks, 41 caps)
Trevor Davison (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 31 caps)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens, 11 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Ben Spencer (Bath Rugby, 6 caps)

and....though who else...

Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 65 caps)
Alex Lozowski (Saracens, 5 caps)
Luke Northmore (Harlequins, 2 caps)

Add Dombrandt. Take out Curry

I like LCD but he's a way off his top form.

Puja says you are wrong. Agree on Dombrandt, I'd also exclude Curry B. Have Ted Hill and Willis T- there's plenty of openside with CurryT EarlB UnderhillS. I'd also be looking at one of the tyro carrying 7's.

[Epaminondas Pules]

which bits.....I'm going for


Luke Cowan-Dickie (Sale Sharks, 41 caps)
Trevor Davison (Northampton Saints, 2 caps)
Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 31 caps)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens, 11 caps)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, 5 caps)
Ben Spencer (Bath Rugby, 6 caps)

and....though who else...

Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 65 caps)
Alex Lozowski (Saracens, 5 caps)
Luke Northmore (Harlequins, 2 caps)

Add Dombrandt. Take out Curry

I like LCD but he's a way off his top form.

Puja says you are wrong. Agree on Dombrandt, I'd also exclude Curry B. Have Ted Hill and Willis T- there's plenty of openside with CurryT EarlB UnderhillS. I'd also be looking at one of the tyro carrying 7's.

Wouldn't disagree greatly on Hill for Curry B

Just seems weird to pick injured players, ones who will never be more than filler, and those who have proven a few times to be short of the standard. Especially when there is an alternative that offers future