Positions 1 - 15

[Donny osmond]

It's surely going to be 1 or 2 honoured with being selected to play with the Irish team? In fact, surely we should just be asking which Irish players will only make the bench and not start?

[paddy no 11]

I can't work out your tone on this one

[Donny osmond]

Only being slightly facetious tbh. Genuinely, we could discuss the merits of, e.g. Zander Fagerson as Lions test starter, or one of the Curry twins, or Jack Morgan, but who is there from Sco, Wal or Eng that is a better player than the Irish player in that position. I would suggest, very few.

[Puja]

Only being slightly facetious tbh. Genuinely, we could discuss the merits of, e.g. Zander Fagerson as Lions test starter, or one of the Curry twins, or Jack Morgan, but who is there from Sco, Wal or Eng that is a better player than the Irish player in that position. I would suggest, very few.

I would be surprised if it was as Irish as you expect. Apart from anything else, there's almost always an unexpected name that ends up demanding a Test jersey with their form on a Lions tour - Martin Corry in 2001, Tom Croft in 2009, Tom Youngs in 2013 - but also Ireland's individuals aren't all that. They're a very good team, but to suggest that all fifteen of their fifteen are better than the options from England and Scotland is incredibly over the top.

I'd expect about 12 Irish players in the XXIII, probably about 8-9 in the starting XV. I won't try and get into predictions or saying "This player over that", cause there's a lot of rugby to be played, injuries to fall victim to and, as I said, there'll be somebody who takes off on tour, but it definitely won't be "Ireland plus guests".

Puja

[Donny osmond]

The Irish may or may not be better individually - and I agree with you, I don't think they necessarily are - but surely the biggest question the head coach will be asking is how they play as a team, at which skill the Irish are demonstrably well ahead of the rest.

[Puja]

The Irish may or may not be better individually - and I agree with you, I don't think they necessarily are - but surely the biggest question the head coach will be asking is how they play as a team, at which skill the Irish are demonstrably well ahead of the rest.

I see your point, but Farrell is aware that he's leading a Lions tour. If he runs the side as you think, with the expectation that the best way to building a team is to have Ireland starting, with other players having to win the shirt off the incumbent Irish player, then he will have a very unhappy squad, very quickly, and the tour will fall apart (and not just from the non-Irish - I don't think the Irish players will be keen about not having the proper Lions experience).

If it was "Pick a side from the British Isles to play for your life in a game tomorrow", then I'd agree that Ireland plus a couple of special guests would likely be the right call. But that isn't the case - it's 6 warm-up games and a month of training, combined with players coming in with excitement and expectations that there are no incumbents in the shirts and that every place is up for winning. I've no doubt a fair few of the starting shirts will go to Irishmen, but I doubt Farrell's an idiot who'll wreck the tour. Apart from anything else, he'll want to be in charge in 2029 as well.

Puja

[Mikey Brown]

Well here is my pre-6N attempt, which already has some fairly laughable calls in it.

Estimates at the squad size is anywhere from 37-42, but not sure where people are getting those numbers. It started at 37 last time, during COVID and adding players later, but was 41 in 2017. I know it's too early but the Autumn is done now and I thought it might be a laugh to see how many Scots I can fit in a squad before we crumble in the 6 nations and Wales come back from the Sarlacc pit.

Forwards (24):

1. Porter, Schoeman, Genge, Baxter**
2. Sheahan*, Lake, Kelleher, George
3. Fagerson, Bealham, Stuart, Furlong*
4. Itoje, Beirne, Ryan
5. McCarthy, Martin
6. CCS, Curry, Baird/Chessum
7. VDF/Morgan/Darge/Underhill (two of, somehow)
8. Doris (c), Fagerson

Backs (16):

9. JGP, White, Mitchell
10. Russell, Smith, Crowley
11. Freeman, VDM/Lowe***
12. Tuipulotu, Aki
13. Ringrose*, Jones (realistically though, just stick with either established pair)
14. IFW, Hansen
15. Keenan, Kinghorn

HC: Farrell, Forwards: POC, Attack: Jones, Defence: Tandy

*Assuming they come back to anything like their usual form
** Pleading ignorance, I really don't know who else is pushing for a place
*** There are good arguments that both are too one-dimensional. I just don't get Lowe at all tbh, but feel like big powerful options on the left will be wanted. Personally I'd take VDM's game-breaking potential vs Lowe's ability to kick the ball really, really hard.

There'a couple of guys like George and Furlong who may be a bit past it, but there's not a huge amount of depth or experience there otherwise. Maybe LCD will have taken the England 2 shirt back and be a contender. Tempted to put (2 of) Ryan/Baird/Chessum in as a rangey lock/blindside option. Don't particularly like Ryan but accept he's highly rated.

Leaving Henshaw out feels wrong, but he doesn't look the same player to me anymore. I couldn't work out how to trim the forwards (particularly backrow) down any further to make room. Kinghorn potentially tied up in France, maybe Furbank or Frawley would offer some useful versatility in that slot as Keenan is clearly first choice. We'd need one on the bench or Freeman/Smith to be able to cover there from the 23.

I've not looked at any of the squads floating around, so I'm prepared to have completely overlooked someone or something.

10/24 Irish forwards. 7/16 Irish backs. Rationale on squad numbers may be completely off but there we go.

Martin, CCS, M Fagerson, White, Crowley looking like questionable calls at this point.

[Puja]

10/24 Irish forwards. 7/16 Irish backs. Rationale on squad numbers may be completely off but there we go.

Martin, CCS, M Fagerson, White, Crowley looking like questionable calls at this point.

You got Smith right at 10 though!

Puja

[Mikey Brown]

10/24 Irish forwards. 7/16 Irish backs. Rationale on squad numbers may be completely off but there we go.

Martin, CCS, M Fagerson, White, Crowley looking like questionable calls at this point.

You got Smith right at 10 though!

Puja

Ha. Could well be 0/3 on fly-halves with the way things are going.

I probably won’t even watch if Russell doesn’t go, to be honest.

[paddy no 11]

All change now

Ireland are past it age wise

[paddy no 11]

Don't want anyone over 30 going in a lions tour

[paddy no 11]

Poor Ben Thomas is in line for the Geoff Cross award for this 6N, though gatty is complicit